X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2014 09:23:04 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from p3plsmtpa08-01.prod.phx3.secureserver.net ([173.201.193.102] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.8) with ESMTP id 6664339 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 31 Dec 2013 21:56:29 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=173.201.193.102; envelope-from=jayph@fastairplane.net Received: from shuriken ([69.92.48.82]) by p3plsmtpa08-01.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id 8Svu1n0021mPo4M01Svu6g; Tue, 31 Dec 2013 19:55:54 -0700 From: "Jay Phillips" X-Original-To: "'Lancair Mailing List'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [LML] Re: Advanced flight systems s-TEC GPSS interface X-Original-Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2013 19:55:54 -0700 X-Original-Message-ID: <024d01cf069c$fd952ab0$f8bf8010$@fastairplane.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQMo92697K8nea82xh2k0OGsasdIyZe7SsHQ Content-Language: en-us (3) G3X's, GTN 750, and miscellaneous other stuff. Jay Phillips -----Original Message----- From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = Todd Long Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2013 2:44 PM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Re: Advanced flight systems s-TEC GPSS interface What all are you putting in?=20 Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 31, 2013, at 14:29, "Jay Phillips" = wrote: >=20 > David Buckwalter is doing the build. Brad Simmons is doing the = installation. >=20 > Jay Phillips >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = Steven Bradford > Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2013 11:22 AM > To: lml@lancaironline.net > Subject: [LML] Re: Advanced flight systems s-TEC GPSS interface >=20 > Who is doing the installation work for you? >=20 > Steven=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On Dec 30, 2013, at 11:20, "Jay Phillips" = wrote: >=20 > I'm having this installed in my 4P as we speak (email?). Should have = it back in a couple of weeks. Be happy to report once I have something = to report. >=20 > Jay Phillips >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = Todd Long > Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 8:55 AM > To: lml@lancaironline.net > Subject: [LML] Re: Advanced flight systems s-TEC GPSS interface >=20 > Does anyone have the G3X and the newest Garmin autopilot instated in a = 4 or 4P? And want to share their experience. I know a few people are = looking at maybe switching to that and would like some feed back.=20 >=20 > Sent from my iPhone >=20 >> On Dec 29, 2013, at 14:10, George Wehrung wrote: >>=20 >> We have the AFS 4500S in our ES with the TruTrak Autopilot. TruTrak = manufactures the autopilot for AFS. >>=20 >> I agree with the display being too busy and would also prefer a = separate HSI vs being overlaid on top of the ADI. >>=20 >> Our autopilot needs adjustment either in the servos or software as it = pitches and hunts in turns of greater than 10=CB=9A. Just another thing = I need to get to. I am also having trouble controlling the autopilot = through the AFS EFIS. The early installs had a two position rocker = switch where the autopilot took its input directly from a garmin GPS = (GNS430W in our case) or from the EFIS. I can only go directly from the = Garmin at this point. From talking with AFS tech support they have = tried giving me directions on how to take the switch out of the loop. = But if I can=E2=80=99t have the EFIS give direction from the autopilot = it will become just a wing leveler and altitude hold autopilot. >>=20 >> I am also very interested to see where the Garmin G3X goes. I would = like to have a single unit over on the right side so they can fly and = then two units having a ADI/HSI on one panel and a moving map Panels = together. This would compliment my Garmin stack (340, MX20, GNS430W, = and SL30). And when I do replace the 430 I could do that with the GTN = 650. =20 >>=20 >> My other complaint with the AFS is that I can not see the second = bearing pointer. I use #1 for the GPS enroute pointer and the HSI but I = can=E2=80=99t see the bearing that my SL30 is locked onto. >>=20 >> Ok, that=E2=80=99s my rant for now. >>=20 >> George >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Dec 29, 2013, at 11:35 AM, Todd Long wrote: >>>=20 >>> Do you already have an afs EFIS? I currently have the 3500S. It = interfaces with the AFS Pilot to control everything. It does have ALT = preselect.=20 >>> I think the user interface is way better with the 5000 series. In my = 3500 there is way too much button pushing to just change heading and = altitude. The 5000 has pretty much dedicated knobs for each altitude and = heading select. So I'm sure that makes it way nicer to use. The 5000 so = makes entering crossing point altitudes easy. >>>=20 >>> The altitude and pitch has given me no trouble. So far it works well = and holds altitude nicely even in in light to moderate summer bumps. The = lateral is another story. It tends to hunt until it finally gets its = self dialed in. I think the servo they recommended doesn't have enough = torque. If I was to do a new install I would use the recommended pitch = servo and the high torque on roll. Also when disturbed in roll by = turbulence in starts oscillating. A kind of tick tock motion. Doesn't = get worse but doesn't get better. If I grab the stick and hold it steady = for a second it stops. No idea why it does that but I have heard I'm not = the only one with this problem. So far I have not been able to come up = with a combination of settings in the autopilot and EFIS to correct the = problem.=20 >>>=20 >>> Install was fairly straight forward. Took 2 days.=20 >>> Half of it was disassembling the panel and interior. The stec servos = will not work. And a few new wires will need to be run. The afs takes 9? = for pitch I think.=20 >>>=20 >>> I really dislike the 3500 interface so far as usability. And the HSI = overlayed on the ADI annoys me. Too much clutter in one space. I have = considered upgrading to the 5000 series for a bigger screen and all the = extra knobs and buttons. But to be honest I want to see what Garmin does = with the G3X next. Maybe a bigger or touch screen? If so I'd pull all = the AFS stuff out and go all Garmin autopilot included. The Garmin = autopilot servos have more torque than the AFS does except for the high = torque. Plus Garmin isn't going anywhere soon or being bought out. And = if you have any problems with compatibility it's most likely a one stop = shop for tech support. Because what else would you install but Garmin = GPS and radios.=20 >>> Garmin does charge more for data updates. But over all in total = costs, flying and insuring a 4P isn't cheap to start.=20 >>>=20 >>> Playing with both the Garmin and AFS at Oshkosh this summer I'm sold = on Garmin. But since my system is workable now I'm going to wait to see = what comes out next. My wishes really only include a bigger screen and = maybe touch screen. Garmin has the screen technology in their portables = at that size and is going touch on about everything else.=20 >>>=20 >>> Sent from my iPhone >>>=20 >>>> On Dec 28, 2013, at 10:38, Douglas Johnson = wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> How do you like the afs autopilot? Does it have altitude preselect = and hold? Good lateral and vertical precision? Did you have to switch = out all your stec servos and wiring? >>>>=20 >>>> Douglas Johnson MD >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>=20 >>>>> On Dec 27, 2013, at 7:28 AM, Todd Long = wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>> I screwed around for a year with an stec 55x and the afs. Don't = waste your time. You will have headaches and be disappointed. Rob will = even tell you the stec works with limited functionality and only has had = a few partial successes. It's not a sales ploy. Stec tech support tried = to help but have almost zero knowledge of afs equipment. Also the = interface for operation will be a pain. I ended up putting in the afs = pilot and should have from the start. Took about 2 days to install.=20 >>>>> I had the stec in the plane when I bought it. And tried to make it = work with the afs. FAIL.=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>=20 >>>>>> On Dec 26, 2013, at 16:23, Tom wrote: >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Folks=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> I am interested in hearing from anyone with experience = interfacing an advanced flight systems efis with an Stec autopilot using = the st901 GPSS module. I would like to upgrade my panel incrementally = and keep the basic autopilot in place. I believe I could still operate = coupled approaches with little or no change to my existing wiring but = where things get a little fuzzy is around the heading guidance selection = from the efis source. The af5000 has an Stec selection for auto pilot = type. I am not certain if it is providing the right ARINC tags to the = GPSS. Ie ground speed and commanded roll rate. Again I would love to = hear from anybody having experience with this arrangement >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Tom >>>>>> -- >>>>>> For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >>>>>=20 >>>>> -- >>>>> For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >>>>=20 >>>> -- >>>> For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >>>=20 >>> -- >>> For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >>=20 >>=20 >> -- >> For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >=20 > -- > For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >=20 >=20 > -- > For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >=20 > -- > For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >=20 >=20 > -- > For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html -- For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html