X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2013 19:09:49 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nskntmtas01p.mx.bigpond.com ([61.9.168.137] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.5) with ESMTP id 6412884 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sun, 11 Aug 2013 04:37:46 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=61.9.168.137; envelope-from=john@jjts.net.au Received: from nskntcmgw05p ([61.9.169.165]) by nskntmtas01p.mx.bigpond.com with ESMTP id <20130811083709.UIRE21423.nskntmtas01p.mx.bigpond.com@nskntcmgw05p> for ; Sun, 11 Aug 2013 08:37:09 +0000 Received: from [192.168.15.14] ([110.142.219.220]) by nskntcmgw05p with BigPond Outbound id BLd51m00H4luXCm01Ld6JT; Sun, 11 Aug 2013 08:37:09 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=G7ae4qY5 c=1 sm=1 a=6xIvA0WTx9AVOJiHBW+VeQ==:17 a=d56vjV6BgfAA:10 a=zkk8-oj4yPkA:10 a=mCSqThwqAAAA:8 a=DfDDCk8ntgwA:10 a=Z3gcRS8DAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=jjqUt_clAAAA:8 a=aLNh518WCXgtlVWQ9hgA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=KED6Sku2_P4A:10 a=-ZBvsNeBbbMA:10 a=NzvJW0xkwboA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=TXDgo7XlknKvYzcg:21 a=FZfp6tqvwrxWL5w7:21 a=yMhMjlubAAAA:8 a=SSmOFEACAAAA:8 a=gPgA39D-zdW9ivImn6kA:9 a=UiCQ7L4-1S4A:10 a=hTZeC7Yk6K0A:10 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=frz4AuCg-hUA:10 a=rnYgdqcAs4AA:10 a=2HbPFX852vHzz0Ze:21 a=49lNbOvXxSVeaBJt:21 a=27BKQGBSmyMz1l8_:21 a=6xIvA0WTx9AVOJiHBW+VeQ==:117 User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.3.6.130613 X-Original-Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2013 16:37:04 +0800 Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Legacy Starter/Starter Adapter failed From: John Smith X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List X-Original-Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [LML] Re: Legacy Starter/Starter Adapter failed In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3459083828_1825038" > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3459083828_1825038 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, Well =AD its happened - the dreaded starter adapter failure at ~90hrs TTIS!! The engine was delivered late 2008 and and was first used in flight late 2010 =AD so I'm well out of warranty time period. Anyways, beyond a few hint= s a few hours prior, almost continuous slipping started almost overnight =AD very difficult to get a start, and nearly got stuck a little way from home. I did end up installing the Skytec at about 70hours. It ran the starts like a trooper, until=8A.. The ST3 seems to test fine according to Skytec recommended checks. As I still have the the old Iskra starter, I'm thinking of installing this just to make absolutely certain that it is the adapter, and not the starter motor =AD but its a very long shot as I think the ST3 is, not surprisingly, absolutely fine. For what its worth, I can turn the starter adapter shaft quite easily both ways, but may be only a quarter of a turn or so before sensing a "spring resistance" feel and, if one lets go of the shaft, it just "springs back" - same in both directions of rotation. I'll be talking to engine engineers o= n Monday, but does this all sound like a failed adapter? My main question now =AD has anyone had any experience of replacing the starter adapter on the IO-550 in a Legacy? Can it be done by lifting the engine off the engine mount and moving it forwards a few inches? If this is possible then it might come down to "just" disconnecting governor and throttle cables (may be mixture), remove a few cable ties to wiring and P-clamps on fuel lines, and unbolt the rear exhaust hangers? Make sense, or is it really a case of engine right out? As it happens, the left hand side upper rear facing stud is really very long, and it doesn't seem possible to pull the adapter off this stud withou= t moving the engine forward (BTW - this stud has been installed with two spacers setting the nut about 7/16 =AD 1/2" off the adapter housing itself =AD it is a TCM reman engine =AD doesn't seem right to me, but may be there's goo= d reason?) Would be very grateful any tips and suggestions=8A. Thanks! Regards, John =20 John N G Smith Tel / fax: +61-8-9385-8891 Mobile: +61-409-372-975 Email: john@jjts.net.au From: "pete@leapfrogventures.com" Reply-To: Lancair Mailing List Date: Tuesday, 5 June 2012 2:46 AM To: Subject: [LML] Re: Legacy Starter/Starter Adapter > I would definitely go with the ST3 over the ST5. I did and am very happy= with > it. =20 > =20 > As for the adapter, if you only have 50 hours, I would just replace the > starter and wait. If the adapter fails later, fix it then. As they say,= if > it=B9s not broke, don=B9t fix it. I guess the risk is you might get stranded > somewhere, but, as I recall when the adapter in my former Cirrus started = to > slip, I could still start it once before it gave up the ghost. > =20 >=20 > Pete > =20 >=20 > From: John Smith [mailto:john@jjts.net.au] > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2012 4:54 AM > To: lml@lancaironline.net > Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Legacy Starter/Starter Adapter > =20 >=20 > Hi Ron, >=20 > =20 >=20 > No, it wasn't mine that was slipping but I'm on the case now to sort thin= gs > out before something fails. >=20 > =20 >=20 > I have a regular CMI starter adapter =AD incidentally, one that does not ha= ve a > part number the subject of the AD 2012-10-13 issued recently (this one > extended the applicability of the earlier AD on this subject to ALL engin= es > manufactured prior to Nov 2011 (not just in the period Jan 2011 to Nov 20= 11); > but I do have an ISKRA starter. >=20 > =20 >=20 > I had been thinking of replacing the ISKRA unit with the SkyTec C24ST3 (t= he > lower duty of the two suited to the IO550 =AD being ..ST3 or ST5). >=20 > =20 >=20 > I noted your comments about the SkyTec unit "finishing the job"=8A. I'm jus= t > wondering if that outcome might be related to the duff CMI starter adapte= rs > the subject of this AD? In other words, whilst the ISKRA starter does da= mage, > certain starter adapters were doomed anyway? >=20 > =20 >=20 > My engine has about 50hours on it, and prob somewhere around 50 starts. >=20 > =20 >=20 > Whilst I like the light weight of the SkyTec ST3 unit (just over 6 lbs an= d > lower torque than the ST5, and my battery is in the back so SkyTec under = this > circumstance recommend the ST3 anyway), appreciate any views around wheth= er > the SkyTec is a good option or not, and whether I should be overhauling t= he > starter adapter? >=20 > =20 >=20 > Thanks! >=20 > =20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Regards, >=20 > John >=20 >>> =20 --B_3459083828_1825038 Content-type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All,

<= /div>
Well – its happened -  the dreaded starter adapter fail= ure at ~90hrs TTIS!!

The engine was delivered = late 2008 and and was first used in flight late 2010 – so I'm well out= of warranty time period.  Anyways, beyond a few hints a few hours prio= r, almost continuous slipping started almost overnight – very difficul= t to get a start, and nearly got stuck a little way from home.
I did end up installing the Skytec at about 70hours. It ran the = starts like a trooper, until…..  The ST3 seems to test fine accor= ding to Skytec recommended checks. As I still have the the old Iskra starter= , I'm thinking of installing this just to make absolutely certain that it is= the adapter, and not the starter motor – but its a very long shot as = I think the ST3 is, not surprisingly, absolutely fine.

<= div>For what its worth, I can turn the starter adapter shaft quite easi= ly both ways, but may be only a quarter of a turn or so before sensing a "sp= ring resistance" feel and, if one lets go of the shaft, it just "springs bac= k" - same in both directions of rotation.  I'll be talking to engine en= gineers on Monday, but does this all sound like a failed adapter?
=
My main question now – has anyone had any experience of= replacing the starter adapter on the IO-550 in a Legacy? Can it be done by = lifting the engine off the engine mount and moving it forwards a few inches?= If this is possible then it might come down to "just" disconnecting governo= r and throttle cables (may be mixture), remove a few cable ties to wiring an= d P-clamps on fuel lines, and unbolt the rear exhaust hangers? Make sense, o= r is it really a case of engine right out?

As it ha= ppens, the left hand side upper rear facing stud is really very long, and it= doesn't seem possible to pull the adapter off this stud without moving the = engine forward (BTW - this stud has been installed with two spacers setting = the nut about 7/16 – 1/2" off the adapter housing itself – it is= a TCM reman engine – doesn't seem right to me, but may be there's goo= d reason?)

Would be very grateful any tips and sugg= estions…. Thanks!


=
Regards,

John
John N G Smith
Tel / fax:    +61-8-9385-8891
Mobile:      +61-409-372-975
Email:         john@jjts.net.au
=

From: "pete@leapfrogventures.com" <pete@leapfrogventures.com<= /a>>
Reply-To: Lancair Mailing = List <lml@lancaironline.net>= ;
Date: Tuesday, 5 June 2012 2:46 = AM
To: <lml@lancaironline.net>
Subject: [LML] Re: Legacy Starter/Starter Adapter
=

I would de= finitely go with the ST3 over the ST5.  I did and am very happy with it= . 

 = ;

As for the adapter, if= you only have 50 hours, I would just replace the starter and wait.  If= the adapter fails later, fix it then.  As they say, if it’s not = broke, don’t fix it.  I guess the risk is you might get stranded = somewhere, but, as I recall when the adapter in my former Cirrus started to = slip, I could still start it once before it gave up the ghost.

 

Pete

 

 

 

<= /blockquote> --B_3459083828_1825038--