X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2012 17:57:33 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from imr-ma01.mx.aol.com ([64.12.206.39] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.5) with ESMTP id 5583765 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 06 Jun 2012 14:01:18 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.206.39; envelope-from=vtailjeff@aol.com Received: from mtaomg-da05.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-da05.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.51.141]) by imr-ma01.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id q56I0exr018083 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2012 14:00:40 -0400 Received: from core-mnc004b.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-mnc004.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.29.106.205]) by mtaomg-da05.r1000.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id C96C5E00008D for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2012 14:00:39 -0400 (EDT) References: X-Original-To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: Re: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out In-Reply-To: X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: vtailjeff@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="--------MB_8CF12256ADC55B1_11A0_7894A_webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com" X-Mailer: AOL Webmail 36210-STANDARD Received: from 75.49.226.16 by webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com (64.12.222.104) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Wed, 06 Jun 2012 14:00:39 -0400 X-Original-Message-Id: <8CF12256ACE0D59-11A0-1BED8@webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com> X-Originating-IP: [75.49.226.16] X-Original-Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2012 14:00:39 -0400 (EDT) x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:501410496:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d338d4fcf9ac74ed1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ----------MB_8CF12256ADC55B1_11A0_7894A_webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ralf, Download your flight data from your EFIS and see how well you reacted --ie = got plane pointed downhill, good rate of descent, etc. You might be surpris= ed. For those not in the best aerobic shape a sudden loss of cabin pressure= can be quickly debilitating at FL 200-280. Your time of useful consciousne= ss may be measured in seconds.=20 One important lesson for all is where is your O2 mask and how quickly can y= ou get it on and start the flow of O2? When was the last time you practiced= this? Is your O2 bottle serviced? How many minutes supply do you have for = you and your passengers? This is not the first Lancair to experience a cab= in depressurization this year.=20 Jeff -----Original Message----- From: bronnenmeier To: lml Sent: Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:48 am Subject: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out Dear subscribers, Yesterday morning I had already unexpected visitors from the FAA. The wo gentlemen took pictures of the plane and the missing window and nspected all my log books and my personal information. They told me hat they have never seen anything like this before and told me that verything was ok before they left. I also filed a NASA report as Jeff ecommended.=20 Thanks also for all the kind comments that I got off the list. My seat covers are still fine - fortunately I always have the urge to se the bathroom heavily before a longer flight - I guess this rotected me this time :-). =20 On my flight from 5G7 to ISM I noticed negative cabin altitude during limb (the differential pressure was still well below 5 psi) - my irlfriend's suitcase had blocked the outflow valve - I put a tennis hoe underneath and it fixed the problem. On the way back from ISM to 5G7 clearance did not have my flight plan. I urned off the engine and filed again. I was a little worried about how he warm engine would start since it was almost 100F outside. Since I se the new hot start procedure that I got here from the list it always tarts up right away (throttle, mixture pulled out - high boost 20 sec - witch to low boost - throttle 1/2 " in - start cranking - push mixture lowly in - it usually starts with the mixture half way in) The first two hours into the flight were uneventful above the clouds ith light turbulence and about a 40 kts head wind. My flight bag with he oxygen masks was in the back on top of all the luggage - big istake! - I will always keep the masks in the front now. Over sudden a big bang without any reason. Popping ears that hurt, loud ind noise and a girlfriend that seemed to squeeze off my arm. I look in he back - no flight bag. I pulled the throttle to idle, disconnected he auto pilot, moved the speed brakes out and point the nose down. I all ATC and tell them that I need to descent immediately because of oss of cabin pressure. I get clearance down to 11K. At 14 k or so I nter IMC. At 11k the engine does not take the throttle well - I am till IMC. I check and see that the mixture is still pulled. I put the AP to 24 and fix the mixture, level the plane and engage the autopilot. n flight aware (40941) I see some significant altitude changes - I on't know if this was me trying to figure out things in IMC or if it ust got reported wrong. After the plane flies straight and level in auto pilot again I start ooking around and find that the drivers rear window is missing ompletely. I disconnect the AP and start checking rudder and elevator - verything behaves as it should. I call ATC and tell them that I lost a indow and that everything is under control. I get clearance to 9K. At 9 K I start thinking about my options. I read on this list once that f you get hit or your plane is damaged that the safest speed is the peed that you are going right now. So I leave the MAP at 23, lean the ngine and decide to continue my trip home to 5G7.=20 I inventory the back - a few sweaters and my flight bag are missing. We ut on some additional cloths (cabin temp is now below 50F with heat on ull open). With the reduced speed it was a little more than two hours ntil me made it home.=20 I can't tell you how relieved I was once I got 3 green from the landing ear. We touched down uneventful at 10:15 pm or so. My wallet (ID, credit cards, SS card... pretty much everything) and my eys were in my flight bag. Fortunately we had the second shift working n the plant I got a key to the hangar and a service car. Unfortunately am a German resident alien without ID documentation now. I need to get y green card replaced first. Until then I can't even buy beer at almart because you need an ID for this.=20 Attached you see a picture before we left - the second part of the light my girlfriend did not look quite as happy as on the picture. She tayed pretty quiet during the whole situation but I will probably have o think about some good arguments to get her in the plane again. Ralf -----Original Message----- rom: John Hafen [mailto:j.hafen@comcast.net]=20 ent: Wednesday, June 06, 2012 8:28 AM o: lml@lancaironline.net ubject: RE: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out Yeah, come on Ralf. We want to hear about Doritos bags blowing up and ll that fun stuff! John Hafen eteran of pressure blow-out over the Saw Tooth mountains of Idaho at 7.5 Required new seat covers -----Original Message----- rom: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of ill Bradburry ent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 10:28 AM o: lml@lancaironline.net ubject: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out Ralf, hat is a pretty calm way to report the incident. You didn't mention ny damage to the seat covers? :>) Are we to understand that you just calmly requested a lower altitude and hen continued on to your destination? B2 -----Original Message----- rom: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of ronnenmeier@GROBSYSTEMS.COM ent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 8:26 AM o: lml@lancaironline.net ubject: [LML] 4P rear window blew out Dear subscribers, Does anybody have a spare driver rear window for a 4P? Mine blew out at FL200 last night coming home from Florida. A few ersonal belongings got sucked out of the cabin but the airplane handled ust fine and no emergency was declared. Three corners of the window are still in the frame. The outside skin of he plane is fine except on rear vertical line - there is about a three nch tear. It is pretty obvious that the plexi-glass must have cracked nd not the outside skin. Some minor paint damage on the horizontal tab. Anybody out there with a similar experience? Ralf =20 -- or archives and unsub ttp://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html - or archives and unsub ttp://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html -- or archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html ----------MB_8CF12256ADC55B1_11A0_7894A_webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Ralf,
 
Download your flight data from your EFIS and see how well you reacted = --ie got plane pointed downhill, good rate of descent, etc. You might = be surprised. For those not in the best aerobic shape a sudden loss of cabi= n pressure can be quickly debilitating at FL 200-280. Your time of useful c= onsciousness may be measured in seconds.
 
One important lesson for all is where is your O2 mask and how quickly = can you get it on and start the flow of O2? When was the last time you prac= ticed this? Is your O2 bottle serviced? How many minutes supply do you have= for you and your passengers?  This is not the first Lancair to experi= ence a cabin depressurization this year.
 
Jeff
 

 
<=
TT>



= -----Original Message-----
From: bronnenmeier <bronnenmeier@GROBSYSTEMS.COM>
To: lml <lml@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:48 am
Subject: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out

Dear s=
ubscribers,

Yesterday morning I had already unexpected visitors from the FAA. The
two gentlemen took pictures of the plane and the missing window and
inspected all my log books and my personal information. They told me
that they have never seen anything like this before and told me that
everything was ok before they left. I also filed a NASA report as Jeff
recommended.=20

Thanks also for all the kind comments that I got off the list.

My seat covers are still fine - fortunately I always have the urge to
use the bathroom heavily before a longer flight  - I guess this
protected me this time :-). =20

On my flight from 5G7 to ISM I noticed negative cabin altitude during
climb (the differential pressure was still well below 5 psi) - my
girlfriend's suitcase had blocked the outflow valve - I put a tennis
shoe underneath and it fixed the problem.

On the way back from ISM to 5G7 clearance did not have my flight plan. I
turned off the engine and filed again. I was a little worried about how
the warm engine would start since it was almost 100F outside. Since I
use the new hot start procedure that I got here from the list it always
starts up right away (throttle, mixture pulled out - high boost 20 sec -
switch to low boost - throttle 1/2 " in - start cranking - push mixture
slowly in - it usually starts with the mixture half way in)

The first two hours into the flight were uneventful above the clouds
with light turbulence and about a 40 kts head wind. My flight bag with
the oxygen masks was in the back on top of all the luggage - big
mistake! - I will always keep the masks in the front now.

Over sudden a big bang without any reason. Popping ears that hurt, loud
wind noise and a girlfriend that seemed to squeeze off my arm. I look in
the back - no flight bag. I pulled the throttle to idle, disconnected
the auto pilot, moved the speed brakes out and point the nose down. I
call ATC and tell them that I need to descent immediately because of
loss of cabin pressure. I get clearance down to 11K. At 14 k or so I
enter IMC. At 11k the engine does not take the throttle well - I am
still IMC. I check and see that the mixture is still pulled. I put the
MAP to 24 and fix the mixture, level the plane and engage the autopilot.
On flight aware (40941) I see some significant altitude changes - I
don't know if this was me trying to figure out things in IMC or if it
just got reported wrong.

After the plane flies straight and level in auto pilot again I start
looking around and find that the drivers rear window is missing
completely. I disconnect the AP and start checking rudder and elevator -
everything behaves as it should. I call ATC and tell them that I lost a
window and that everything is under control. I get clearance to 9K.

At 9 K I start thinking about my options. I read on this list once that
if you get hit or your plane is damaged that the safest speed is the
speed that you are going right now. So I leave the MAP at 23, lean the
engine and decide to continue my trip home to 5G7.=20

I inventory the back - a few sweaters and my flight bag are missing. We
put on some additional cloths (cabin temp is now below 50F with heat on
full open). With the reduced speed it was a little more than two hours
until me made it home.=20

I can't tell you how relieved I was once I got 3 green from the landing
gear. We touched down uneventful at 10:15 pm or so.

My wallet (ID, credit cards, SS card... pretty much everything) and my
keys were in my flight bag. Fortunately we had the second shift working
in the plant I got a key to the hangar and a service car. Unfortunately
I am a German resident alien without ID documentation now. I need to get
my green card replaced first. Until then I can't even buy beer at
Walmart because you need an ID for this.=20

Attached you see a picture before we left - the second part of the
flight my girlfriend did not look quite as happy as on the picture. She
stayed pretty quiet during the whole situation but I will probably have
to think about some good arguments to get her in the plane again.

Ralf

-----Original Message-----
From: John Hafen [mailto:j.hafen@co=
mcast.net]=20
Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2012 8:28 AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: RE: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out

Yeah, come on Ralf.  We want to hear about Doritos bags blowing up and
all that fun stuff!

John Hafen
Veteran of pressure blow-out over the Saw Tooth mountains of Idaho at
17.5 Required new seat covers

-----Original Message-----
From: Lancair Mailing List [mailt=
o:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of
Bill Bradburry
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 10:28 AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Re: 4P rear window blew out

Ralf,
That is a pretty calm way to report the incident.  You didn't mention
any damage to the seat covers?  :>)

Are we to understand that you just calmly requested a lower altitude and
then continued on to your destination?

B2

-----Original Message-----
From: Lancair Mailing List [mailt=
o:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of
bronnenmeier@GROBSYSTEMS.CO=
M
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 8:26 AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] 4P rear window blew out

Dear subscribers,

Does anybody have a spare driver rear window for a 4P?

Mine blew out at FL200 last night coming home from Florida. A few
personal belongings got sucked out of the cabin but the airplane handled
just fine and no emergency was declared.

Three corners of the window are still in the frame. The outside skin of
the plane is fine except on rear vertical line - there is about a three
inch tear. It is pretty obvious that the plexi-glass must have cracked
and not the outside skin. Some minor paint damage on the horizontal
stab. Anybody out there with a similar experience?

Ralf =20

--
For archives and unsub
http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html


--
For archives and unsub
http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html

----------MB_8CF12256ADC55B1_11A0_7894A_webmail-stg-m05.sysops.aol.com--