X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 12:09:57 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nm29-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.44.192] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with SMTP id 4948993 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sun, 17 Apr 2011 11:28:07 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.44.192; envelope-from=paulhershorin@bellsouth.net Received: from [98.139.44.99] by nm29.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Apr 2011 15:27:34 -0000 Received: from [98.139.44.80] by tm4.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Apr 2011 15:27:34 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1017.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Apr 2011 15:27:34 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 50144.63518.bm@omp1017.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 65419 invoked by uid 60001); 17 Apr 2011 15:27:33 -0000 DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=bellsouth.net; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=16KAnABnKWum2NUeyvg6/lHR59UGtB/L8jK/E+LwtPmj8ajCV/w3mY8O3KBdjqIcJANBh1e2MrDXCRQXzaMWnr+KROvRvC3d0+ADZqCuStHzpDh4gLyWdmSKehdedzw3JsLO0B9z2RLMD7K9kEpodXRKAAGZp6VfCAKw0PxKrZA=; X-Original-Message-ID: <585446.61484.qm@web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: KiQ3ttUVM1kBcTN8HaNBg7Jh3Dzu.vExVBiB0WgsOKTNiwG kov4abVV2Or7zyBOQAJf7ZWVD2CxC.gVppsUCtvkg8z5E.bOYehGwwMGygoW qYnDsir8Vbxxejh_HmqNWT5bvAKtQurN2su4vJmJIN2FRhjMfj2PCUXXP3da X.AUDBZPibmnXlZhB7vh28NzQBwrj3UieODyj5IpA_wTkkIl2j4FKhYn2HWH YEXwz8LUbLWYrQLcM7Audu.U4WwZg0S8ElzXeVmj3i05cj4kIdtjUxINirKA nQ314uGnQ0ZPLTanxLqmSCAkAfircXu6T3v05AsrKaTzL.s27SF.nbD_X48a EsssoFB7.s63GKNMNGOBgDQ-- Received: from [65.8.213.103] by web83905.mail.sp1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 17 Apr 2011 08:27:33 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailClassic/12.0.2 YahooMailWebService/0.8.109.295617 X-Original-Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2011 08:27:33 -0700 (PDT) From: PAUL HERSHORIN Subject: Re: [LML] Re: 360 carbon/racing gear doors X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-771046855-1303054053=:61484" --0-771046855-1303054053=:61484 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have the outback gear doors--when building my plane I added a layer of ca= rbon fiber cloth to all doors on the inside.=C2=A0 By doing this it made th= e doors strong enough so that they do not bend and they pull up tight when = closed.=C2=A0 I have never had any vibration or noise out of the doors. Paul Hershorin 360=C2=A0 471LA --- On Sun, 4/17/11, Danny Miller wrote: From: Danny Miller Subject: [LML] Re: 360 carbon/racing gear doors To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Sunday, April 17, 2011, 11:13 AM Louis, You=E2=80=99re not alone in these questions.=C2=A0 If answers and comments = come to you directly rather than through LML, please share. =C2=A0 Danny Miller N 38=C2=B0 43' 25.7" W 77=C2=B0 30' 38.6" =C2=A0 From: Louis Gabriel [mailto:louis@gabriels.us]=20 Sent: Saturday, April 16, 2011 8:24 PM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: 360 carbon/racing gear doors =C2=A0 First, thanks for being such a great community--I'm brand new to both gener= al aviation and the Lancair game, and I have never encountered a more patie= nt and willing-to-answer-dumb-questions bunch.=C2=A0 I was hoping you might= oblige me once more: I am a new owner of a Lancair 360 Mk II with outback gear...and I've been p= lagued with gear door problems.=C2=A0 None of these are new or unsolved, bu= t almost every piece of advice on the LML and otherwise (namely n91cz.com) = suggests the solution is a set of three-piece, carbon fiber gear doors. Where do they come from?=C2=A0 How do I get a set? For some (perhaps unnecessary) background, here are the problems I'm having= : 1. Inner gear door flutter.=C2=A0 When the gear is extended, the inner gear= doors move around quite a bit in the prop wash (wearing out the hinge pin)= .=C2=A0 I've mostly solved this by replacing the flimsy aluminum hinge with= stainless steel, but I still have some qualms about the permanence of my s= olution. 2. High speed buffet.=C2=A0 I've found that the trailing edge of my left in= ner gear door does not hold very effectively against either the airframe or= the outer door, which above about 180 kts will occasionally start to buffe= t and buzz rather alarmingly.=C2=A0 After determining this noise was not th= e imminent end of my flying career, I found slowing down, cycling the gear = (just enough to reseat the inner doors), then speeding back up solved my pr= oblem.=C2=A0 Upon swinging the gear, it's apparent the trailing edge of the= inner gear door is the issue. 3. Drag.=C2=A0 Even on the jack stands, there is quite a bit of undercarria= ge material in the otherwise undisturbed slipstream. Here are my thoughts on potential solutions: 1. To solve the inner gear door flutter issue, I should first minimize the = amount of inner gear door I have.=C2=A0 The three-piece carbon set does jus= t that, according to my understanding.=C2=A0 I'd like to start there.=C2=A0= Second, I can fiddle around with the hinge system further, but what I woul= d REALLY like to do is sequence the doors to close after the gear is down.= =C2=A0 I plan on doing instrument work--it would be nice to be able to drag= the gear whenever I want without thinking about the doors.=C2=A0 Has anyon= e experimented with this? 2. For the rest of my problems, stiffer, smaller, better-designed doors are= the answer.=C2=A0 My only hurdle is acquiring them--and that's where I'm h= oping for your help. Thanks for your time, and I really appreciate your help.=C2=A0 I'm glad to = be part of the community! Louis Gabriel N61GH, KCVN --0-771046855-1303054053=:61484 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I have the outback gear doors--when buil= ding my plane I added a layer of carbon fiber cloth to all doors on the ins= ide.  By doing this it made the doors strong enough so that they do no= t bend and they pull up tight when closed.  I have never had any vibra= tion or noise out of the doors.
Paul Hershorin
360  471LA

--- On Sun, 4/17/11, Danny Miller <dan= ny.miller@verizon.net> wrote:

From: Danny Miller <danny.miller@verizon.net&g= t;
Subject: [LML] Re: 360 carbon/racing gear doors
To: lml@lancaironl= ine.net
Date: Sunday, April 17, 2011, 11:13 AM

Louis,

You=E2=80=99= re not alone in these questions.  If answers and comments come to you = directly rather than through LML, please share.

 

Danny Miller=

N 38=C2=B0 4= 3' 25.7"

W 77=C2=B0 3= 0' 38.6"

 

From:<= /SPAN> Louis Gabriel [mailto:louis@gabriels.us] Sent: Saturday, April 16, = 2011 8:24 PM
To: lml@lan= caironline.net
Subject: = 360 carbon/racing gear doors

<= SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> 

<= SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">First, thanks for being such a great communi= ty--I'm brand new to both general aviation and the Lancair game, and I have= never encountered a more patient and willing-to-answer-dumb-questions bunc= h.  I was hoping you might oblige me once more:

I am a new owne= r of a Lancair 360 Mk II with outback gear...and I've been plagued with gea= r door problems.  None of these are new or unsolved, but almost every = piece of advice on the LML and otherwise (namely n91cz.com) suggests the solution is = a set of three-piece, carbon fiber gear doors.

Where do they come fr= om?  How do I get a set?

For some (perhaps unnecessary) backgro= und, here are the problems I'm having:
1. Inner gear door flutter. = When the gear is extended, the inner gear doors move around quite a bit in= the prop wash (wearing out the hinge pin).  I've mostly solved this by re= placing the flimsy aluminum hinge with stainless steel, but I still have so= me qualms about the permanence of my solution.

2. High speed buffet.=   I've found that the trailing edge of my left inner gear door does no= t hold very effectively against either the airframe or the outer door, whic= h above about 180 kts will occasionally start to buffet and buzz rather ala= rmingly.  After determining this noise was not the imminent end of my = flying career, I found slowing down, cycling the gear (just enough to resea= t the inner doors), then speeding back up solved my problem.  Upon swi= nging the gear, it's apparent the trailing edge of the inner gear door is t= he issue.

3. Drag.  Even on the jack stands, there is quite a b= it of undercarriage material in the otherwise undisturbed slipstream.
Here are my thoughts on potential solutions:
1. To solve the inner gear door flutter issue, I should first minimize the amount of inner= gear door I have.  The three-piece carbon set does just that, accordi= ng to my understanding.  I'd like to start there.  Second, I can = fiddle around with the hinge system further, but what I would REALLY like t= o do is sequence the doors to close after the gear is down.  I plan on= doing instrument work--it would be nice to be able to drag the gear whenev= er I want without thinking about the doors.  Has anyone experimented w= ith this?

2. For the rest of my problems, stiffer, smaller, better-d= esigned doors are the answer.  My only hurdle is acquiring them--and t= hat's where I'm hoping for your help.

Thanks for your time, and I re= ally appreciate your help.  I'm glad to be part of the community!
<= BR>Louis Gabriel
N61GH, KCVN

--0-771046855-1303054053=:61484--