X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Thu, 24 Dec 2009 10:37:46 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from bosmailout08.eigbox.net ([66.96.190.8] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3c4) with ESMTP id 4037691 for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 24 Dec 2009 09:45:18 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=66.96.190.8; envelope-from=SRS0=d/Ui72=IK=mwheli.com=bjburr@eigbox.net Received: from bosmailscan21.eigbox.net ([10.20.15.21]) by bosmailout08.eigbox.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1NNovh-0003YP-Ih for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 24 Dec 2009 09:44:41 -0500 Received: from bosimpout02.eigbox.net ([10.20.55.2]) by bosmailscan21.eigbox.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1NNovh-00058S-GO for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 24 Dec 2009 09:44:41 -0500 Received: from bosauthsmtp07.eigbox.net ([10.20.18.7]) by bosimpout02.eigbox.net with NO UCE id M2k21d003099BUA012k2WR; Thu, 24 Dec 2009 09:44:02 -0500 X-EN-OrigOutIP: 10.20.18.7 X-EN-IMPSID: M2k21d003099BUA012k2WR Received: from c-76-27-82-124.hsd1.ut.comcast.net ([76.27.82.124] helo=[192.168.0.6]) by bosauthsmtp07.eigbox.net with esmtpa (Exim) id 1NNovg-0003gO-Pp for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 24 Dec 2009 09:44:41 -0500 X-Original-Message-Id: From: Burr Bryan X-Original-To: "Lancair Mailing List" In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-22--109163040 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v936) Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Fuel Planning X-Original-Date: Thu, 24 Dec 2009 07:44:38 -0700 References: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.936) X-EN-UserInfo: afb066d8b4230608b04b264cad72a5d8:59efd05c4346593dae8a30875e4d072b X-EN-AuthUser: bjburr@mwheli.com X-Original-Sender: Burr Bryan X-EN-OrigIP: 76.27.82.124 X-EN-OrigHost: c-76-27-82-124.hsd1.ut.comcast.net --Apple-Mail-22--109163040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Aside from weight and balance implications "top it" is always the safest in my book. A wise old aviator once told me the following: " The sky above you, the runway behind you, and the air in your fuel tanks do you no good". In other words: fly high, rotate as early as safely possible, and carry gas. Bryan N132BB On Dec 24, 2009, at 6:52 AM, Gary Casey wrote: > Thanks, Rob, for posting the results. The ones that said "top it" > didn't abide by the spirit of the question :-) in that I don't know > how many minutes of fuel that equates to, but there were enough > replies in minutes. The technician in me couldn't resist doing some > math: > The average planned fuel remaining was 63 minutes, or about 30 > minutes in each tank. I guess that would work, but for me that > would be about 7 gallons in each tank, at my low fuel warning > setting. I know I would get an additional verbal warning from my > usual right seat crewmember :-(. > The standard deviation of the answers was 33 minutes, a fairly large > variation considering the average was 63 minutes. A significant > number of people would have in the vicinity of 30 minutes > remaining. In fact, 4 out of 12 would have 30 minutes or less. One > planned the flight with only 20 minutes remaining. > Of course, if I knew the minutes remaining of the ones that said > "top it" the results would shift dramatically. > Gary > > Fuel PlanningDecember 23, 2009 11:19:15 AM MST > From: > "Rob Logan" > To: > "" > Thanks to those that responded to the fuel question. This is how it > was > worded: > > There is 30min of fuel in your plane. > You wanta meet your friends for lunch on this stunning VFR day. > You don't have any planned flights for the next few weeks. > The lunch stop's gas is the same price as as at your home field. > The lunch stop's runway is 5,000 at sea level. > The flight time to lunch is 30mins > > How many mins of fuel do you add to your tanks for the flight? > > Here is the summery in the form of: > in the plane + personal min + trip + extra > > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + top > 30 + 30 + top > 30 + 15 + full wings, not aux > > 30 + 30 + 60 + 60 > 30 + 120 > 30 + 120 > 30 + 120 > 30 + 120 > 30 + 30 + 30 + 30 > 30 + 30 + 60 > 30 + 30 + 30 + 15 > 30 + 15 + 30 + 15 > 30 + 15 + 30 + 5 > 30 + 0 + 60 > 30 + 60 > > common notes: > > 1) always top > 2) add enough to get to lunch and home plus personal reserve > 3) fill to a level one can directly observe fuel in tank. > > Rob > > --Apple-Mail-22--109163040 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Aside from weight and balance = implications "top it" is always the safest in my book.  A wise old = aviator once told me the following: " The sky above you, the runway = behind you, and the air in your fuel tanks do you no good". In other = words:  fly high, rotate as early as safely possible, and carry = gas.

Bryan
N132BB

On = Dec 24, 2009, at 6:52 AM, Gary Casey wrote:

Thanks, Rob, for posting the results.  The = ones that said "top it" didn't abide by the spirit of the question :-) = in that I don't know how many minutes of fuel that equates to, but there = were enough replies in minutes.  The technician in me couldn't = resist doing some math:
The average = planned fuel remaining was 63 minutes, or about 30 minutes in each tank. =  I guess that would work, but for me that would be about 7 gallons = in each tank, at my low fuel warning setting.  I know I would get = an additional verbal warning from my usual right seat crewmember = :-(.
The standard deviation of the = answers was 33 minutes, a fairly large variation considering the average = was 63 minutes.  A significant number of people would have in the = vicinity of 30 minutes remaining.  In fact, 4 out of 12 would have = 30 minutes or less.  One planned the flight with only 20 minutes = remaining.
Of course, if I knew the minutes = remaining of the ones that said "top it" the results would shift = dramatically.
Gary

From:
lml@lancair.net>
Thanks = to those that responded to the fuel question. This is how it = was
worded:

There is 30min of fuel in your plane.
You wanta = meet your friends for lunch on this stunning VFR day.
You don't have = any planned flights for the next few weeks.
The lunch stop's gas is = the same price as as at your home field.
The lunch stop's runway is = 5,000 at sea level.
The flight time to lunch is 30mins

How = many mins of fuel do you add to your tanks for the flight?

Here = is the summery in the form of:
in the plane + personal min + trip + = extra

30 + top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + = top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + top
30 + = 30 + top
30 + 15 + full wings, not aux

30 + 30 + 60 + 60
30 = + 120
30 + 120
30 + 120
30 + 120
30 + 30 + 30 + 30
30 + = 30 + 60
30 + 30 + 30 + 15
30 + 15 + 30 + 15
30 + 15 + 30 + = 5
30 + 0  + 60
30 + 60

common notes:

1) always = top
2) add enough to get to lunch and home plus personal = reserve
3) fill to a level one can directly observe fuel in = tank.

                =         Rob

= --Apple-Mail-22--109163040--