X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:35:35 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from QMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.16] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.14) with ESMTP id 3742823 for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:28:05 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=76.96.62.16; envelope-from=j.hafen@comcast.net Received: from OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.11]) by QMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id B46C1c0030EZKEL515Sssm; Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:26:52 +0000 Received: from [10.128.90.251] ([75.151.125.133]) by OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id B5TE1c0032soXEK3M5TGjZ; Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:27:16 +0000 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.17.0.090302 X-Original-Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 10:27:25 -0700 Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up -- and "Judge not, lest ye be judged..." From: John Hafen X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List X-Original-Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up -- and "Judge not, lest ye be judged..." Thread-Index: Acn7Ol1fcTM/3aLWX02ImSt1/g16hw== In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3329375248_211452" > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3329375248_211452 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Gents: We have to judge, critique, analyze, and evaluate every step we take in life. Flying airplanes, especially slick fast Lancairs, is a particularly big step in life. You can get in trouble fast, if you aren=B9t careful. So we have to make judgment calls all along the way, from pre-flight to post flight. You can=B9t not judge. I scour every accident or mishap report I can find, not to pile on and beat anyone up, but to learn from the misfortunes of others. If I can read abou= t and learn safe practices based on the bad (or good) experiences of the next guy, then I don=B9t have to learn everything first hand myself. And hopefully, if I can learn from the experiences of others, and and make accurate judgments based on that information, I won=B9t die in a fireball. I=B9d much rather be shot by a jealous husband, who has reason to be jealous;= ) If you don=B9t want to hear my opinion on New Testament translations, then please read no further. Mr. Brunner partially paraphrases Matthew 7: 1-2, saying: =B3Judge not, lest ye be judged.=B2 The full text (King James Version) says: 1) Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2) For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. If you analyze, or judge, those two lines, they are in conflict with each other. The first line says not to judge. The second line tells how to do it and the consequences of appropriate or inappropriate judgment. If the first line were accurately translated from the original texts, there would be no need for the second line telling how to judge. The very oldest original New Testament texts we have date from about 400AD. Being copied by hand, and for political expediency, lots of changes were made =8B like in the first lined above about not making judgments. I=B9m no scholar, but I do have PHD buddies that are, and do these types of translations (yes, it is still ongoing) for a living, that struggle to this day with various meanings of various parts of the New Testament. I suspect that if we had the original text for Matthew 7:1 would read more like: =B3Judge not unrighteously, that ye be not judged. But judge righteou= s judgment.=B2 It would make a lot more sense anyway. Think, judge, and make intelligent decisions based on facts and data, fly the hell out of your Lancair, and di= e of a heart attack on a golf course in Palm Springs long after you lose your medical certificate. Humbly submitted. John Hafen LIVP 413AJ 155 hours and loving every moment of it, and looking at my gear down lights about a thousand times on final before landing. On 6/30/09 4:11 PM, "Douglas Brunner" wrote: > The particular pilot involved raced my plane at Reno and did a very good = job > of it. He also spent 6 years in the Hanoi Hilton. > =20 > "Judge not, lest ye be judged" >> =20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> =20 >> From: Colyn Case at earthlink >> =20 >> To: lml@lancaironline.net >> =20 >> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 8:13 AM >> =20 >> Subject: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up -- are you kidding? - Sender is fo= rged >> (SPF Fail) >> =20 >>=20 >> =20 >> I don't know if this kind of speculation is warranted. If you were no= t in >> the plane then likely you don't know what the actual circumstances were= . >> =20 >> The particular pilot in question deadsticked a jet (after an engine fai= lure) >> onto a two-lane road last year, among other things. When I can do tha= t >> I'll feel better about throwing rocks in that direction. >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> Colyn >> =20 >>> =20 >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> =20 >>> From: Henry Arjad >>> =20 >>> To: lml@lancaironline.net >>> =20 >>> Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 9:20 AM >>> =20 >>> Subject: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up -- are you kidding? - Sender is f= orged >>> (SPF Fail) >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> I wonder if he requires to take a 709 ride? >>> =20 >>> =20 >=20 --B_3329375248_211452 Content-type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Re: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up -- and "Judge not, lest ye be j= udged..." Gents:

We have to judge, critique, analyze, and evaluate every step we take in lif= e.  Flying airplanes, especially slick fast Lancairs, is a particularly= big step in life.  You can get in trouble fast, if you aren’t ca= reful.  So we have to make judgment calls all along the way, from pre-f= light to post flight.  You can’t not judge.

I scour every accident or mishap report I can find, not to pile on and beat= anyone up, but to learn from the misfortunes of others.  If I can read= about and learn safe practices based on the bad (or good) experiences of th= e next guy, then I don’t have to learn everything first hand myself.
And hopefully, if I can learn from the experiences of others, and and make = accurate judgments based on that information,  I won’t die in a f= ireball.  I’d much rather be shot by a jealous husband, who has r= eason to be jealous;)

If you don’t want to hear my opinion on New Testament translations, t= hen please read no further.

Mr. Brunner partially paraphrases Matthew 7: 1-2, saying:

“Judge not, lest ye be judged.”

The full text (King James Version) says:

1) Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2) For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measu= re ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

If you analyze, or judge, those two lines, they are in conflict with each o= ther.  The first line says not to judge.  The second line tells ho= w to do it and the consequences of appropriate or inappropriate judgment. &n= bsp; If the first line were accurately translated from the original tex= ts, there would be no need for the second line telling how to judge.  &= nbsp;

The very oldest original New Testament texts we have date from about 400AD.=  Being copied by hand, and for political expediency, lots of changes w= ere made — like in the first lined above about not making judgments.
I’m no scholar, but I do have PHD buddies that are, and do these type= s of translations (yes, it is still ongoing) for a living, that struggle to = this day with various meanings of various parts of the New Testament.

I suspect that if we had the original text for Matthew 7:1 would read more = like:  “Judge not unrighteously, that ye be not judged.  But= judge righteous judgment.”

It would make a lot more sense anyway.  Think, judge, and make intelli= gent decisions based on facts and data, fly the hell out of your Lancair, an= d die of a heart attack on a golf course in Palm Springs long after you lose= your medical certificate.

Humbly submitted.

John Hafen
LIVP 413AJ  155 hours and loving every moment of it, and looking at my= gear down lights about a thousand times on final before landing.



On 6/30/09 4:11 PM, "Douglas Brunner" <douglasbrunner@earthlink.net> wrote:

T= he particular pilot involved raced my plane at Reno and did a very good job = of it.  He also spent 6 years in the Hanoi Hilton.
"Judge not, lest ye be judged"

----- Original Message -----
 
From:  Colyn  Case at earthlink <mailto:colyncase@earthlink.net>  
 
To: lml@lancaironline.net
 
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 8:13 AM
 
Subject: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up --  are you kidding? - Sen= der is forged (SPF Fail)
 

 
I don't know if this kind of speculation is  = ;warranted.   If you were not in the plane then likely you don't k= now  what the actual circumstances were.
The particular pilot in question deadsticked a &n= bsp;jet (after an engine failure) onto a two-lane road last year, among othe= r  things.   When I can do that I'll feel better about throwi= ng rocks  in that direction.
 
 
Colyn

----- Original Message -----
 
From:  Henry Arjad <mail= to:henry@cptgroup.com>   
 
To: lml@lancaironline.net
 
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 9:20  AM
 
Subject: [LML] Re: Evolution Gear-Up --  are you kidding? - Sen= der is forged (SPF Fail)
 

 
 

I wonder  if he requires to take a 709 ride?
 

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