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From: "LHenney" <LHenney@charter.net>
X-Original-To: "Lancair List" <lml@lancaironline.net>
Subject:  235/320/360 gear dump valve idea
X-Original-Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:31:55 -0600
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Randy,

=20

I=92m not getting this concern.  The dump line goes to the tank and ends
submerged in fluid with a =BC=94 down tube in the reservoir.  =
Additionally, in
my opinion no fluid would ever travel upstream toward the valve.  Thus, =
no
air would be added to the system by use of a 3 way vavle.

=20

Larry

=20

  _____ =20

From: randy snarr [mailto:randylsnarr@yahoo.com]=20
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 9:59 PM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: Re: [LML] Re: 235/320/360 gear dump valve idea

=20

Chris,
Is there such a thing as a check valve that could be incorporated into =
the
3rd pressure dump line to the hyd reservoir?
That way you could open the dump valve releasing positive pressure from =
the
high/low sides of the system but you would not be allowing air from that
same line if the was no positive pressure or negative pressure?
Could a shuttle valve help do that?

Randy Snarr

Chris Zavatson <chris_zavatson@yahoo.com> wrote:

<<From: Randy <randystuart

Then the pump pressurizes the high side and it stops, and the shuttle =
valve
centers,...>>

This is where pumps in the fleet differ.  In my two pumps the shuttle =
valve
does not return to center.  It stays where the fluid last pushed it.  =
The
O-ring on the spool offers up much more friction than the spring on the
poppet valve could ever hope to overcome.  I am curious if all pump =
vintages
have O-rings on the spool valve and/or how snug the fit might be?  If =
the
spool can be made to stay put, the problem goes away.  I am simply
suggesting this as something to investigate before a lot of new plumbing =
is
added to the system.

=20

A little over a year ago, when this issue was last discussed, I took a
series of photos showing the effect of heating and cooling.  What is
observed is that the high side pressure goes up and down with =
temperature
(heat gun and ice bath) while the low side remains at zero. =20

http://www.n91cz.com/Hydraulics/Heat_Cool_Series.doc=20

My pumps are '95 and newer.

=20

Chris Zavatson

N91CZ

360std

www.N91CZ.com <http://www.n91cz.com/>=20

=20

  _____ =20

Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=3D51733/*http:/mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06=
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DtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20>  it now.

=20

 =20

  _____ =20

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=3D51734/*http:/tools.search.yahoo.com/newsear=
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tegory.php?category=3Dshopping>  them fast with Yahoo! Search.


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<div class=3DSection1>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Randy,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>I&#8217;m not getting this =
concern.=A0 The
dump line goes to the tank and ends submerged in fluid with a =BC&#8221; =
down
tube in the reservoir.=A0 Additionally, in my opinion no fluid would =
ever travel
upstream toward the valve.=A0 Thus, no air would be added to the system =
by use of
a 3 way vavle.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'>Larry<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:blue'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> randy =
snarr
[mailto:randylsnarr@yahoo.com] <br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Sunday, February =
10, 2008
9:59 PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> =
lml@lancaironline.net<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [LML] Re: =
235/320/360
gear dump valve idea</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>Chris,<br>
Is there such a thing as a check valve that could be incorporated into =
the 3rd
pressure dump line to the hyd reservoir?<br>
That way you could open the dump valve releasing positive pressure from =
the
high/low sides of the system but you would not be allowing air from that =
same
line if the was no positive pressure or negative pressure?<br>
Could a shuttle valve help do that?<br>
<br>
Randy Snarr<br>
<br>
<b><i><span style=3D'font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>Chris Zavatson
&lt;chris_zavatson@yahoo.com&gt;</span></i></b> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&lt;&lt;From: Randy &lt;randystuart<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><em><b><i><font size=3D4 face=3D"Arial =
Narrow"><span
style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial =
Narrow";font-weight:bold'>Then the
pump pressurizes the high side and it stops, and the shuttle valve
centers,...&gt;&gt;</span></font></i></b></em><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>This is where pumps in the fleet differ.&nbsp; In my two pumps =
the
shuttle valve does not return to center.&nbsp; It stays where the fluid =
last
pushed it.&nbsp; The O-ring on the spool offers up much more friction =
than the
spring on the poppet valve could ever hope to overcome.&nbsp; I am =
curious if
all pump vintages have O-rings on the spool valve and/or how snug the =
fit might
be?&nbsp; If the spool can be made to&nbsp;stay put, the problem goes
away.&nbsp; I am simply suggesting this as something to investigate =
before
a&nbsp;lot of new plumbing is added to the =
system.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>A little over a year ago, when this issue was last discussed, I =
took a
series of photos showing the effect of heating and cooling.&nbsp; What =
is observed
is that the high side pressure goes up and down with temperature (heat =
gun and
ice bath) while the low side remains&nbsp;at zero.&nbsp; =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><a =
href=3D"http://www.n91cz.com/Hydraulics/Heat_Cool_Series.doc">http://www.=
n91cz.com/Hydraulics/Heat_Cool_Series.doc</a>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></fo=
nt></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>My pumps are '95 and newer.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>Chris Zavatson<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>N91CZ<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>360std<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><a
href=3D"http://www.n91cz.com/">www.N91CZ.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p>

</div>

</div>

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style=3D'font-size:
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face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D1 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! =
Mobile. <a
href=3D"http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=3D51733/*http:/mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3D=
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it now.</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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