Return-Path: Received: from pop3.olsusa.com ([63.150.212.2] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.1) with ESMTP id 999982 for rob@logan.com; Mon, 31 Dec 2001 07:20:39 -0500 Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.34]) by pop3.olsusa.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-71866U8000L800S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Mon, 31 Dec 2001 01:45:09 -0500 Received: from JMcKibbin@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v31_r1.9.) id k.183.1893d2c (2172) for ; Mon, 31 Dec 2001 01:46:05 -0500 (EST) From: JMcKibbin@aol.com Message-ID: <183.1893d2c.296163ad@aol.com> Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2001 01:46:05 EST Subject: Re: fuel senders and gauges To: lancair.list@olsusa.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailing-List: lancair.list@olsusa.com Reply-To: lancair.list@olsusa.com <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<--->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> << Lancair Builders' Mail List >> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<--->>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> In a message dated 12/27/01 Patrick T Redig writes: << Greetings: I'm about to apply bottom wing skins to my 320. I see no mention in the manual regarding installation of fuel level senders. I would like to have fuel indication for both wing tanks as well as the header tank. What have other builders done about this? Thanks Pat Redig Scandia, Minnesota >> I will try to describe what I am doing since I think its a little unusual. As a point of reference, I'm building a LNC2 with tanks extending all the way to the tip rib. I am not utilizing the "D" section. I am building the tanks to feed directly to the engine. I haven't decided whether to use a header tank or not. I am building my own wing tank capacitance probes using the tube-within-a-tube design. The outside tube is 5/8 inch OD with a 0.035 wall. The inside tube is 7/16 inch OD with a 0.065 wall. There is nothing critical about the wall thickness of the inside tube and, in fact, it could be a solid rod. These sizes are available from AS&S. What is unusual, if not unique, about my design is that the assembly is roughly six feet long and extends all the way from the bottom inboard corner of the tank (i.e., the bottom of the BL51 rib) diagonally up and outboard (viewed from the front or rear) to the top inside surface of the tank in the vicinity of the fill connection. The fill connection is roughly 8 inches inboard of the tip rib. This arrangement should provide readability of the level throughout the entire range of normal tank levels. Since the assembly penetrates the dry bay between the BL 99.5 and 105.5 ribs, I plan to bond the outside tube permanently into the structure with Hysol and BID at each rib exactly the same way the aileron pushrod enclosing tube is bonded into the wing. The outside tube has a custom made aluminum flange welded on the inboard end that will be potted into the BL 51 rib. By undoing the machine screws that are threaded into this flange, the inside tube can be withdrawn out the inboard end, through the BL 50 rib and, hopefully, through the main gear door opening. This will allow inspection and replacement of the insulating spacers that are used to maintain concentricity of the two tubes. These spacers are the only serviceable components in the system and are made from round head nylon rivets. The rivets are 1/4-inch diameter head with 1/8-inch diameter by 1/8-inch long shank. They are available from several sources such as MSC (www. mscdirect.com part number 67357129) for about $1.75 for a package of 100. Each spacer is made up of 3 rivets. Each rivet is set in a #30 hole drilled radially into the inside tube at a spacing of 120 deg. The spacers (i.e., a set of 3 rivets) are located on 10-inch centers axially along the inside tube. Note that the rivets are not actually riveted in place. The heads are merely captured between the inside and outside tubes. The top of the rivet head must be shaved slightly to fit between the tubes. I made a simple jig to accomplish this quickly and accurately but it could probably be done by hand. The rivets seem to hold the inside tube securely while allowing fuel and/or air to flow freely in an axial direction in the annular space between the tubes. Note that the outboard ends of the tubes are open to the tank and the inboard end of the outside tube has a hole cut in the bottom to allow fuel to flow in and out of the annular space between the tubes. This same hole should allow any moisture to escape as well. On the inboard end, there is a spacer made of Delrin which was fabricated to maintain concentricity of the two tubes while at the same time clamping a Buna-N gasket between itself and the aluminum flange. The Delrin spacer is bolted to the aluminum flange with six #6 flat head machine screws. These screws are threaded into six Helicoiled blind holes in the aluminum flange. A 3 inch long, #10 socket-head machine screw passes through the center of the Delrin spacer and into a threaded (Helicoiled) aluminum plug which is welded into the end of the inside tube. The machine screw holds the assembly together and provides an electrical connection to the inside tube. The raw materials for this system are quite cheap, roughly on a par with automotive float gages but having the advantage of no moving parts inside the tank and being able to read the entire range of fuel in the tank. The question is, how much of the fabrication can you do yourself or get done on the cheap? Turning the flange for the inboard end of the outside tube and the plug for the inside tube was not a problem for me. Welding them in place is best left to someone who knows what they are doing and has a TIG machine but this is not very expensive. You can tell them its for use with gasoline just don't tell them its for an airplane! I had the inside tube anodized to preclude a spark between the tubes should they ever come in contact with one another. Getting something 6 feet long anodized is problematic at best and, for me, rather expensive. If you can do this yourself or otherwise get it done cheaply, it would substantially reduce the cost of the project. For electronics, I plan to use a single integrated circuit called a CAV414. This is available in the US from Servoflo, Inc. (www.servoflo.com). Last time I checked, the CAV414 was $5 for a 16-pin DIL package or $4 for a surface mount unit. This single IC, along with a handful of passive components, will convert a variable capacitance in the range of 10 to 2000 pF to a variable voltage. The tube dimensions described above result in an empty capacitance of about 400 pF and full capacitance of about 800 pF and I have selected components which result in a corresponding output of 0 to 5 Vdc. Although the CAV414 will accept supply voltages from 6 to 35 Vdc directly from the instrument bus without the need for a separate voltage regulator, I plan to provide some type of overvoltage protection to keep any voltage spikes from traveling down the supply line, blasting through the IC and impressing themselves on the capacitor element. That could ruin your whole day. With the right components, the CAV414 will do everything that the circuit described by Jim Weir in Kitplanes will do except that it does not have a low alarm although this can be added downstream relatively easily if required. In the testing I have done so far the CAV414 seems to have good linearity over the range of about 15% to 150% of the reference capacitance and is highly immune to variations in supply voltage. I don't really have facilities to test its temperature or vibration tolerance but I doubt these will be issues. In a previous post, someone mentioned testing capacitance probes with gasoline and then described rather extensive fire precautions. You might consider using kerosene rather than gasoline at least for bench (outdoor) testing. It has a similar dielectric constant (1.94 for gasoline vs. 2.08 for kerosene) and is still flammable but it is an order of magnitude safer than gasoline. I'm sorry this is such a long post but I have actually left out a lot of detail. If there is any interest in duplicating this design, I will be happy to answer any questions that I can. If anyone can see any problems with what I have described, I hope they will say so BEFORE I close out my wings. Thanks in advance. Jim McKibbin >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> LML website: http://members.olsusa.com/mkaye/maillist.html LML Builders' Bookstore: http://www.buildersbooks.com/lancair Please remember that purchases from the Builders' Bookstore assist with the management of the LML. Please send your photos and drawings to marvkaye@olsusa.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>