X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Tue, 07 Oct 2014 08:54:41 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from [157.56.110.91] (HELO na01-bn1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.9e) with ESMTPS id 7182538 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 08:56:00 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=157.56.110.91; envelope-from=ngeorge@continentalmotors.aero Received: from BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.141.206.150) by BLUPR04MB419.namprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.141.27.20) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1034.13; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:55:23 +0000 Received: from BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.141.206.150) by BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com (10.141.206.150) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1039.15; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:55:21 +0000 Received: from BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.206.150]) by BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.206.150]) with mapi id 15.00.1039.011; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:55:21 +0000 From: Neal George X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List Subject: [LML] Continental starter adapter failure- Legacy Thread-Topic: [LML] Continental starter adapter failure- Legacy Thread-Index: Ac/cre2qba3+qsy0TVuR8yv0BfSXDA== X-Original-Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:55:20 +0000 X-Original-Message-ID: <7b513b536409425699b1930d7a3c02a2@BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [69.85.249.2] x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:BLUPR04MB722;UriScan:; x-forefront-prvs: 0350D7A55D x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM;SFS:(10009020)(199003)(189002)(97736003)(19625215002)(76482002)(87936001)(19300405004)(101416001)(105586002)(10300001)(31966008)(4396001)(21056001)(19580405001)(2656002)(99396003)(99286002)(15202345003)(15975445006)(16236675004)(106356001)(50986999)(92566001)(120916001)(64706001)(85306004)(107886001)(107046002)(110136001)(229853001)(76576001)(20776003)(46102003)(74316001)(54356999)(86362001)(108616004)(19580395003)(95666004)(80022003)(85852003)(66066001)(33646002)(24736002);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101;SCL:1;SRVR:BLUPR04MB722;H:BLUPR04MB722.namprd04.prod.outlook.com;FPR:;MLV:sfv;PTR:InfoNoRecords;A:1;MX:1;LANG:en; Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_7b513b536409425699b1930d7a3c02a2BLUPR04MB722namprd04pro_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Return-Path: ngeorge@continentalmotors.aero X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:BLUPR04MB419; X-OriginatorOrg: continentalmotors.aero --_000_7b513b536409425699b1930d7a3c02a2BLUPR04MB722namprd04pro_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gentlemen - It is nearly impossible to replace a Permold starter adapter correctly in m= ost aircraft without dismounting the engine. Yes, it's a pain, but it's th= e only way to do it right. Starter adapter studs are an interference fit in a thru-hole in the crankca= se. The interference fit damages the threads of the stud and the hole. In= addition to the interference fit, studs are installed with Loctite 271 - i= t makes the installation "permanent" and contributes to sealing the hole ag= ainst oil leakage. Instructions for removing a stud installed with Loctite 271 include raising= the temperature of the assembly to about 400-degrees F to soften the adhes= ive. Nine times out of ten, removing a stud without heat will also remove = aluminum from the threads - if the stud doesn't break at the first exposed = thread. Nominal-size steel bolts - for example, AN5-40A - will not achieve proper t= hread engagement in a new stud hole, much less a deformed one. Without pro= per thread engagement, correct fastener torque cannot be applied and mainta= ined. The overhaul manual (M16) lists a number of approved repairs for damaged th= readed holes. The starter adapter stud locations are not addressed. Neal =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D The problem for us is that the adapter is fixed to the block with studs. Bu= t we do not have enough room to withdraw the adapter backwards and clear al= l of the studs - I think was two that wouldn't clear. I can't recall which,= but once you look at it, you'll see which ones they are. So - I removed t= he offending studs with a stud extractor - took a bit of doing as I assume = the studs are installed with super Loktite or similar, but they came out OK= . Withdrew the adapter, and my Lame fitted a new shaft and spring which luc= kily for me was provided by TCM under a warranty claim. Meanwhile - removed= the other studs, and then reinstalled the adapter with a set of properly s= pec'd bolts (length etc critical of course) instead of the two above offend= ing studs. If the adapter ever fails again - it will now be a very simple job to remov= e the starter adapter. I guess I should caution that I don't know if what I did is endorsed by TCM= - it may be, but I don't know; I did check with my LAME and he considered = it fine, but your call of course here! Good luck! Regards, John John N G Smith --_000_7b513b536409425699b1930d7a3c02a2BLUPR04MB722namprd04pro_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Gentlemen –

It is nearly impossible to replace a Permold star= ter adapter correctly in most aircraft without dismounting the engine.  Yes, it’s a pain, but it’s the only way to do it right.<= o:p>

 

Starter adapter studs are an interference fit in = a thru-hole in the crankcase.  The interference fit damages = the threads of the stud and the hole. = ; In addition to the interference fit, studs are installed with Loctit= e 271 – it makes the installation “permanent” and contrib= utes to sealing the hole against oil leakage.

 

Instructions for removing a stud installed with L= octite 271 include raising the temperature of the assembly to about 400-degrees F to soften the adhesive.&nbs= p; Nine times out of ten, removing a stud without heat will also rem= ove aluminum from the threads – if the stud doesn’t break at th= e first exposed thread. 

 

Nominal-size steel bolts – for example, AN5= -40A – will not achieve proper thread engagement in a new stud hole, = much less a deformed one.  Without= proper thread engagement, correct fastener torque cannot be applied and ma= intained. 

 

The overhaul manual (M16) lists a number of appro= ved repairs for damaged threaded holes.&nb= sp; The starter adapter stud locations are not addressed.

 

Neal

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

The problem for us is that the adapter is fixed to = the block with studs. But we do not have enough room to withdraw the adapter backwards and clear all of the studs – I think was two that = wouldn’t clear. I can’t recall which, but once you look at it, = you’ll see which ones they are.  So – I removed the offend= ing studs with a stud extractor – took a bit of doing as I assume the studs are installed with super Loktite or similar, but they came out OK. W= ithdrew the adapter, and my Lame fitted a new shaft and spring which luckil= y for me was provided by TCM under a warranty claim. Meanwhile – remo= ved the other studs, and then reinstalled the adapter with a set of properly spec’d bolts (length etc critical= of course) instead of the two above offending studs.

 

If the adapter ever fails again – it will now= be a very simple job to remove the starter adapter.  

 

I guess I should caution that I don’t know if= what I did is endorsed by TCM – it may be, but I don’t know; I= did check with my LAME and he considered it fine, but your call of course here!=

 

Good luck!

Regards,

John
John N G Smith

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