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To:  lml@lancaironline.net
Date: Tue, 22 May 2012 15:27:28 -0400
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 receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.161.180; envelope-from=bbreen@cableone.net
Subject: Re: [LML] Re: 360 still surging
References: <list-5553274@logan.com>
From: Berni Breen <bbreen@cableone.net>
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Hi Don:

No filter between the two.  I have 2 filters between the fuel selector and t=
he gascolator.  I pulled both of those today to check but discovered no rest=
rictions.  I had not thought about removing them...do you recommend I do?

Thank you.

Berni Breen
Sent from my iPhone

On May 22, 2012, at 8:32 AM, don Grabiel <grabiel71@gmail.com> wrote:

> Berni, just a thought, but do you have a fuel filter in between the gascol=
ator and the manual fuel pump on the engine? If so try removing it.      Don=
 G.
>=20
> On May 21, 2012 4:31 PM, "Berni Breen" <bbreen@cableone.net> wrote:
> Many of you guys have offered suggestions to help me remedy my ongoing eng=
ine surge challenge.  As a reminder...my fuel injected IO360 displays a very=
 pronounced surge during idle and taxi following a flight and brief shutdown=
/restart.  The problem never occurs when the engine iis cool. =20
>=20
> I have tried suggestions such as ground running the engine at 1700 rpm for=
 extended periods following a restart in an attempt to get some air moving t=
hrough the cowl but that has resulted in limited success.  So far my only re=
medy is to let the engine sit for a long enough period to let it cool signif=
icantly.  If I do, I have zero issues with surging.
>=20
> I even removed my fuel injector servo and sent it off for overhaul (not an=
 inexpensive undertaking) as another attempt to remedy my problem.  That ide=
a does not address what I firmly believe to be the problem, heat causing fue=
l vapor lock, but I tried it anyway.  I reinstalled the servo yesterday and t=
est flew.  The plane performed flawlessly as it always does following a firs=
t start.  When I returned home and let it sit for 20 minutes, restarted and w=
ent to taxi, the surge was just as pronounced as ever.
>=20
> All of my fuel lines are insulated and fire sleeved.  The only exposed lin=
es are the small lines that run up to the spider on the top of the engine. I=
 do not have any fuel leaks.  Turning on my electric fuel pump, while increa=
sing fuel pressure from 20 to 25 psi, does not remedy the surge issue.
>=20
> As posted here before I have taken the active and lifted off several times=
 with this surge issue going on as the surge quits once I apply full throttl=
e.  As several of you have pointed out this is not a safe way to proceed the=
refore I am again asking for ideas/suggestions from you guys.
>=20
> Many years ago in my drag racing days me and several of my friends would i=
nstall a cooling can to cool down the fuel and therefore (we believed) helpe=
d us produce more power.  We would use a coffee can, insert a coil of copper=
 fuel line in the can, put this contraption in line (fuel line) fill it and f=
ill it with ice prior to a run.  While this is not a practical long term sol=
ution, is this the kind of thing I should be doing to prove/disprove my beli=
ef that I have a vapor lock issue?
>=20
> I sincerely appreciate any and all suggestions!
>=20
> Berni Breen
> Lancair 360
>=20
>=20

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<html><head></head><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>Hi Don:</div><div><br></div><div>No filter between the two. &nbsp;I have 2 filters between the fuel selector and the gascolator. &nbsp;I pulled both of those today to check but discovered no restrictions. &nbsp;I had not thought about removing them...do you recommend I do?</div><div><br></div><div>Thank you.<br><br>Berni Breen<div>Sent from my iPhone</div></div><div><br>On May 22, 2012, at 8:32 AM, don Grabiel &lt;<a href="mailto:grabiel71@gmail.com">grabiel71@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><p>Berni, just a thought, but do you have a fuel filter in between the gascolator and the manual fuel pump on the engine? If so try removing it.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Don G.</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On May 21, 2012 4:31 PM, "Berni Breen" &lt;<a href="mailto:bbreen@cableone.net">bbreen@cableone.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Many of you guys have offered suggestions to help me remedy my ongoing engine surge challenge. &nbsp;As a reminder...my fuel injected IO360 displays a very pronounced surge during idle and taxi following a flight and brief shutdown/restart. &nbsp;The problem never occurs when the engine iis cool. &nbsp;<div>


<br></div><div>I have tried suggestions such as ground running the engine at 1700 rpm for extended periods following a restart in an attempt to get some air moving through the cowl but that has resulted in limited success. &nbsp;So far my only remedy is to let the engine sit for a long enough period to let it cool significantly. &nbsp;If I do, I&nbsp;<span>have zero issues with surging.<span></span></span></div>


<div><span><br></span></div><div><span>I even removed my fuel injector servo and sent it off for overhaul (not an inexpensive undertaking) as another attempt to remedy my problem. &nbsp;That idea does not address what I firmly believe to be the problem, heat causing fuel vapor lock, but I tried it anyway. &nbsp;I reinstalled the servo yesterday and test flew. &nbsp;The plane performed flawlessly as it always does following a first start. &nbsp;When I returned home and let it sit for 20 minutes, restarted and went to taxi, the surge was just as pronounced as ever.</span></div>


<div><span><br></span></div><div><span>All of my fuel lines are insulated and fire sleeved. &nbsp;The only exposed lines are the small lines that run up to the spider on the top of the engine. I do not have any fuel leaks. &nbsp;Turning on my electric fuel pump, while increasing fuel pressure from 20 to 25 psi, does not remedy the surge issue.</span></div>


<div><span><br></span></div><div><span>As posted here before I have taken the active and lifted off several times with this surge issue going on as the surge quits once I apply full throttle. &nbsp;As several of you have pointed out this is not a safe way to proceed therefore I am again asking for ideas/suggestions from you guys.</span></div>


<div><span><br></span></div><div><span>Many years ago in my drag racing days me and several of my friends would install a cooling can to cool down the fuel and therefore (we believed) helped us produce more power. &nbsp;We would use a coffee can, insert a coil of copper fuel line in the can, put this contraption in line (fuel line) fill it and fill it with ice prior to a run. &nbsp;While this is not a practical long term solution, is this the kind of thing I should be doing to prove/disprove my belief that I have a vapor lock issue?</span></div>


<div><span><br></span></div><div><span>I sincerely appreciate any and all suggestions!</span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div>
<span>Berni Breen</span></div><div><span>Lancair 360</span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div></div><div><br></div>
</blockquote></div>
</div></blockquote></body></html>
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