X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 11:08:39 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from imr-ma02.mx.aol.com ([64.12.206.40] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.1) with ESMTP id 5087946 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 10:04:03 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.206.40; envelope-from=Sky2high@aol.com Received: from mtaomg-mb04.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-mb04.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.41.75]) by imr-ma02.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id p7AE3I0p007823 for ; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 10:03:18 -0400 Received: from core-mta001b.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-mta001.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.29.234.129]) by mtaomg-mb04.r1000.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id 7C09DE0000A0 for ; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 10:03:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Sky2high@aol.com X-Original-Message-ID: <1f866.37f086f1.3b73e9a4@aol.com> X-Original-Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 10:03:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [LML] Re: TSOs and equipment failure X-Original-To: lml@lancaironline.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_1f866.37f086f1.3b73e9a4_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 9.6 sub 5004 X-AOL-IP: 24.1.9.48 X-Originating-IP: [24.1.9.48] x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:501435264:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d294b4e428fa55730 --part1_1f866.37f086f1.3b73e9a4_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en Matt, =20 Interesting. That brought to mind the trip returning home from the Reno= =20 Air races interrupted by 9/11. Over Wyoming I was in, uh, very electrical= =20 clouds when the S-Tec 50 auto pilot shut off, communications were very=20 difficult with static and my hydro-electric analog being was tingling all = over. =20 The Terra radios, Garmin 430, Rocky Mountain encoder, AOA and Vision Micro= =20 Systems EPI 800 all continued to work along with the vacuum powered AI and= =20 DG. Oh yeah, the 12th century compass and old fashioned airspeed=20 indicator also remained operational. =20 Whilst considering another 1000 IFR miles, my mind became re-focused on a = =20 giant hole that opened up over Casper WY and where ATC allowed me to land= =20 as there were no local terrorrist targets of value. Why land there? You= =20 might ask. Well, I had lost my vacuum system backup, the auto pilot. Or = was=20 it that I was relying soley on my a/p backup, the vacuum driven AI. =20 Anyway, I try to fix such things as they break rather than succumb to=20 get-home-itis. =20 How fortunate that the Casper avionics shop was knowledgeable with S-Tec= =20 and at least fixed the pitch board blown fuse overnight. Of course it too= k=20 a few months to determine that there were other problems with the pitch=20 board that eventually required its replacement.=20 =20 So, 1 electric TSo'd item failed but all the rest kept on ticking, =20 including those of questionable origins. However, I have always bought the= =20 argument for a mixed power source panel, such as electric and vacuum. Par= t of my=20 decision to land was that my friend had lost his vacuum pump on the way to= =20 Reno and the Fed Ex plane carrying his replacement pump was one of the =20 last to land at Reno. Remembering his pump failure, the miracle hole and= =20 qualified avionics shop all came together at the right moment. =20 Scott Krueger =20 =20 =20 In a message dated 8/10/2011 7:14:38 A.M. Central Daylight Time, =20 matt.hapgood@alumni.duke.edu writes: =20 Just a quick anecdotal story regarding TSO vs. non-TSO equipment:=20 About 7 years ago I was flying my Lancair 360 out of Aspen during marginal= =20 weather. It was a challenging departure that has you flying in a valley = =20 on instruments. Not a great time for instrument failure.=20 About 2 minutes into the departure, solid IFR, I started getting severe = =20 p-static. So severe my headset was shocking me badly enough that I had to= =20 remove it. Here is the important part=E2=80=A6=20 Every non-TSO piece of electrical equipment in the plane failed. Not one= =20 TSO piece of equipment failed. Here is list of what failed:=20 - AOA. Started bouncing up and down and calling out =E2=80=9Cer= ror =E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D=20 - VM Engine instruments=20 - Rocky Mountain MicroEncoder. Shut off.=20 - Tablet PC (used for charts): shut off (fortunately I had =20 back-up)=20 - CO detector. Permanently damaged=20 Here is what did not fail:=20 - Mechanical/steam gauges=20 - Sandel EFIS=20 - Garmin 430=E2=80=99s (2)=20 - Garmin audio panel=20 - Garmin transponder=20 - S-TEC autopilot=20 It seems likely I wouldn=E2=80=99t be writing this email today if I had al= l=20 electronic non-TSO equipment that day=E2=80=A6=20 Matt=20 --part1_1f866.37f086f1.3b73e9a4_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en
Matt,
 
Interesting.  That brought to mind the trip returning home f= rom=20 the Reno Air races interrupted by 9/11.  Over Wyoming I was in, uh, ve= ry=20 electrical clouds when the S-Tec 50 auto pilot shut off, communications wer= e=20 very difficult with static and my hydro-electric analog being was tingling = all=20 over.  The Terra radios, Garmin 430, Rocky Mountain encoder,=20 AOA and Vision Micro Systems EPI 800 all continued to work along = with=20 the vacuum powered AI and DG.  Oh yeah, the 12th century compass and o= ld=20 fashioned airspeed indicator also remained operational.
 
Whilst considering another 1000 IFR miles, my mind became re-focused= =20 on a  giant hole that opened up over Casper WY and where ATC allo= wed=20 me to land as there were no local terrorrist targets of value.&nb= sp;=20 Why land there? You might ask.  Well, I had lost my vacuum system back= up,=20 the auto pilot.  Or was it that I was relying soley on my a/p bac= kup,=20 the vacuum driven AI.   Anyway, I try to fix such things as they= =20 break rather than succumb to get-home-itis.
 
How fortunate that the Casper avionics shop was knowledgeabl= e=20 with S-Tec and at least fixed the pitch board blown fuse overnight.  O= f=20 course it took a few months to determine that there were other problems wit= h the=20 pitch board that eventually required its replacement. 
 
So, 1 electric TSo'd item failed but all the rest kept on ticking= ,=20 including those of questionable origins.  However, I have always bough= t the=20 argument for a mixed power source panel, such as electric and vacuum.&= nbsp;=20 Part of my decision to land was that my friend had lost his vacuum pump on = the=20 way to Reno and the Fed Ex plane carrying his replacement pump was one of t= he=20 last to land at Reno.  Remembering his pump failure, th= e=20 miracle hole and qualified avionics shop all came together at the right=20 moment.
 
Scott Krueger      
 
In a message dated 8/10/2011 7:14:38 A.M. Central Daylight Time,=20 matt.hapgood@alumni.duke.edu writes:
=

Just=20 a quick anecdotal story regarding TSO vs. non-TSO=20 equipment:

 About=20 7 years ago I was flying my Lancair 360 out of Aspen during marginal=20 weather.  It was a challenging departure that has you flying in a va= lley=20 on instruments.  Not a great time for instrument=20 failure.

 About=20 2 minutes into the departure, solid IFR, I started getting severe=20 p-static.  So severe my headset was shocking me badly enough that I = had=20 to remove it.  Here is the important part=E2=80=A6=

Every=20 non-TSO piece of electrical equipment in the plane failed.  Not one = TSO=20 piece of equipment failed.  Here is list of what=20 failed:

 -      = ;   =20 AOA. =20 Started bouncing up and down and calling out =E2=80=9Cerror =E2=80=A6=E2= =80=9D

-      = ;   =20 VM=20 Engine instruments

-      = ;   =20 Rocky=20 Mountain MicroEncoder.  Shut off.

-      = ;   =20 Tablet=20 PC (used for charts): shut off (fortunately I had=20 back-up)

-      = ;   =20 CO=20 detector.  Permanently damaged

 

Here=20 is what did not fail:

 

-      = ;   =20 Mechanical/steam=20 gauges

-      = ;   =20 Sandel=20 EFIS

-      = ;   =20 Garmin=20 430=E2=80=99s (2)

-      = ;   =20 Garmin=20 audio panel

-      = ;   =20 Garmin=20 transponder

-      = ;   =20 S-TEC=20 autopilot

 

It=20 seems likely I wouldn=E2=80=99t be writing this email today if I had all = electronic=20 non-TSO equipment that day=E2=80=A6

 

Matt

 

 

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