X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "William Jepson" Received: from mail-pa0-f47.google.com ([209.85.220.47] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.4) with ESMTPS id 7869953 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 27 Jul 2015 18:33:27 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.220.47; envelope-from=wrjjrs@gmail.com Received: by padck2 with SMTP id ck2so58118592pad.0 for ; Mon, 27 Jul 2015 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=KcqpkCtGd6wfakT2B+WZyGaQKgy8RRTIdp3VX6ki858=; b=wGvAdMMUglkn8WqV4MQbH7CPdg+lHw3TYcKZbAYmBN0BnrExQx6VDVqPc4MegliLug rvitAvPSXLuSxfUVX2ZBUJjYzMniTG6fwqca6oRYvD8H4cR8TffiXAT65ubBNOir68VK o9hu3l3iiKImFY8kQG7JDO/EEG3jDgyvpaj8/A0IQt1VhTGFJV5C+Gg8YXGXVCBiYgYA 8BudQ5BhABCyYoGZn+gYkfsU2yWu1/A76JCDnGCD+lHxQN7FtYSzd3WmGZtO0qj60Cdk 6gr+iHu4ujnxeQ0of8oKHelAwoGc0nHJEWDen5oya3PPd+/RvIrFJsFpeB2YmSdiPt0x Fsqw== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.66.236.39 with SMTP id ur7mr73409705pac.123.1438036373200; Mon, 27 Jul 2015 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.74.67 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Jul 2015 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.74.67 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Jul 2015 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2015 15:32:53 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Alternative redrives To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1136cb1832e504051be2ef4e --001a1136cb1832e504051be2ef4e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don't disagree. The slipper clutch is a torsional vibration band-aid. The properly designed system makes it totally unneeded. Bill Jepson On Jul 27, 2015 3:29 PM, "Charlie England" wrote: > Yes, but that's probably not the best reason to not use the drive. If the > clutch weighs as much as an entire drive should weigh, that would be a go= od > reason to stay away. It sounds like they didn't know how to deal with the > forces at work, & took a sledge hammer approach at avoiding problems. > > On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 1:21 PM, Bill Bradburry < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >> Is Geared Drives the company where the owner and his (I think?) >> daughter were killed in a plane crash? >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] >> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2015 11:54 AM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Alternative redrives >> >> >> >> I think it=E2=80=99s about 70#=E2=80=99s. This is the Geared Drives des= ign with a few >> changes. Oil seal retainer is one. >> >> >> >> Bobby >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] >> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2015 11:31 AM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Alternative redrives >> >> >> >> I went back to the exhibit buildings, and took some photos of the psru= =E2=80=99s >> offered by www.autopsrus.com . I will forward these later today as every >> thing gets transferred . They are spur gear drive, have there own oil >> supply and pump, use pressure fed roller bearings, will provide oil for = a >> constant speed prop, and are available in many reduction ratios. They ma= ke >> a unit that can be straight through, suitable for the 13-B, the casing i= s >> CNC machined. They use a flywheel for the torque damping, and it has a >> centrifugal clutch that disengages the prop below ~900 engine rpm, so wh= en >> starting there is no prop load. Will likely be heavier than Tracy=E2=80= =99s >> >> >> >> I have to reduce the size of the pictures before I can send them. >> >> >> >> *From:* Tom Gillespie >> >> *Sent:* Sunday, July 26, 2015 1:59 PM >> >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Anyone or everyone in Oshkosh? >> >> >> >> Tracy, >> >> That is very interesting! Could one be built specifically for my >> combination of a high HP 20 B? I would have more peace of mind knowing h= ow >> it was put together by me along with your knowledge and experience. The >> thought of someone just starting out making them does not sit well with = me >> as they are an unknown. >> >> Let me know what you think and I will be in touch. >> >> Thanks for your time! >> >> ~~~tg~~~ >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Tracy >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Sent:* Sunday, July 26, 2015 10:04 AM >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Anyone or everyone in Oshkosh? >> >> >> >> The design is royalty free. Anyone who wants to build it is more than >> welcome. I can help with info if you need it. >> >> >> >> Tracy >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >> On Jul 25, 2015, at 17:48, Thomas Mann >> wrote: >> >> Well, barring the passage of the =E2=80=9CAffordable Airplane Act=E2= =80=9D perhaps we >> should start trying to solve our own problems. >> >> I don=E2=80=99t know what the transaction was regarding production of Tr= acy=E2=80=99s >> design but if it=E2=80=99s based off of royalties for every unit sold, I= would say >> that it=E2=80=99s not benefiting anyone. >> >> >> >> Perhaps a competitive bid is in order? >> >> >> >> *From:* Fly Rotary >> *Sent:* =E2=80=8ESaturday=E2=80=8E, =E2=80=8EJuly=E2=80=8E =E2=80=8E25= =E2=80=8E, =E2=80=8E2015 =E2=80=8E2=E2=80=8E:=E2=80=8E38=E2=80=8E =E2=80=8E= PM >> *To:* Fly Rotary >> >> >> >> Absent a viable PSRU solution, there probably is no, =E2=80=9Crotary eng= ine >> option=E2=80=9D=E2=80=A6 :>( >> >> >> >> B2 >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net >> ] >> *Sent:* Saturday, July 25, 2015 2:01 PM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Anyone or everyone in Oshkosh? >> >> >> >> =E2=80=A6=E2=80=A6 no sign of rotaries. >> >> >> ________________________________________________________________________= ___ >> >> >> >> What I have found is that if you want there to be a Rotary Engine forum, >> you have to do it yourself. >> >> If I had a flying Rotary, I would be willing to do this but as I do not, >> it would not be appropriate. >> >> >> >> We should make an effort to have a =E2=80=9CFly Rotary=E2=80=9D forum an= d present our >> case for the Rotary Engine as a viable alternative to the piston solutio= n. >> >> I would propose that this comes from our group rather than as a >> piggy-back on to any of the other alternative engine groups. >> >> I would not want for our engine solution to be sandwich between the >> Corvair, Subaru and Volkswagen groups. >> >> >> >> If you want to see it there, you have to make it happen. >> >> >> >> T Mann >> >> >> > > --001a1136cb1832e504051be2ef4e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don't disagree. The slipper clutch is a torsional vibr= ation band-aid. The properly designed system makes it totally unneeded.

Bill Jepson

On Jul 27, 2015 3:29 PM, "Charlie England&q= uot; <flyrotary@lancairon= line.net> wrote:
Yes, but that's probably not the best reason to no= t use the drive. If the clutch weighs as much as an entire drive should wei= gh, that would be a good reason to stay away. It sounds like they didn'= t know how to deal with the forces at work, & took a sledge hammer appr= oach at avoiding problems.

On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 1:21 PM, Bill Bradburry <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Is Geared Drives t= he company where the owner and his (I think?) daughter were killed in a plane crash?

=C2=A0

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2015 = 11:54 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Alternative redrives

=C2=A0

= I think = it=E2=80=99s about 70#=E2=80=99s. This is the =C2=A0Geared Drives design with a few changes. O= il seal retainer is one.

= = =C2=A0

= Bobby=

= = =C2=A0

= = =C2=A0

= = =C2=A0

= = =C2=A0

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2015 = 11:31 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Alterna= tive redrives

=C2=A0

I went back = to the exhibit buildings, and took some photos of the psru=E2=80=99s offered by www.autopsrus.com = . I will forward these later today as every thing gets transferred . They are spur gear drive, hav= e there own oil supply and pump, use pressure fed roller bearings, will provi= de oil for a constant speed prop, and are available in many reduction ratios. = They make a unit that can be straight through, suitable for the 13-B, the casing= is CNC machined. They use a flywheel for the torque damping, and it has a centrifugal clutch that disengages the prop below ~900 engine rpm, so when starting there is no prop load. Will likely be heavier than T= racy=E2=80=99s

=C2=A0

I have to re= duce the size of the pictures before I can send them.

=C2=A0<= u>

Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 1:59 PM

Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Anyone or everyone in Oshkosh?<= u>

=C2=A0

Tracy,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 That is very interesting! Could one be built specifically for my combinatio= n of a high HP 20 B? I would have more peace of mind knowing how it was put toge= ther by me along with your knowledge and experience. The thought of someone just starting out making them does not sit well with me as they are an unknown.<= u>

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Let me know what you think and I will be in touch.

Thanks for your time!

~~~tg~~~

=C2=A0

=C2=A0<= /p>

From: Tracy <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 = 10:04 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Any= one or everyone in Oshkosh?

=C2=A0

The design is royalty free.=C2=A0 Anyone who wants to build it is more than welcome.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I can help with info if you need it.

=C2=A0

Tracy

Sent from my iPad


On Jul 25, 2015, at 17:48, Thomas Mann <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Well, barring the passage of the =E2=80=9CAffordable Airplane Act=E2=80=9D perhap= s we should start trying to solve our own problems.

I don=E2=80=99t know what the transaction was regarding production of = Tracy=E2=80=99s design but if it=E2=80=99s based off o= f royalties for every unit sold, I would say that it=E2=80=99s not benefiting= anyone.

=C2=A0

Perhaps a competitive bid is in order?

=C2=A0

From= :=C2=A0Fly Rotary
Sent: =E2=80=8ESaturday=E2= =80=8E, =E2=80=8EJuly=E2=80=8E =E2=80=8E25=E2=80=8E, =E2=80=8E2015 =E2=80=8E2=E2=80=8E:=E2=80=8E38=E2=80=8E =E2=80=8EPM
To:=C2=A0Fly Rotary=

=C2=A0

Absent a viable PSRU solution, there probably is no, =E2=80=9Crotary engine option=E2=80=9D=E2= =80=A6=C2=A0 :>(

=C2=A0

B2

=C2=A0

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 201= 5 2:01 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Any= one or everyone in Oshkosh?

=C2=A0

=E2=80=A6=E2=80=A6 no sign of rotaries.

____________________________________________________________= _______________

=C2=A0

What I have found is that if you want there to be a Rotary Engine forum, you hav= e to do it yourself.

If I had a flying Rotary, I would be willing to do this but as I do not, it wo= uld not be appropriate.

=C2=A0

We should make an effort to have a =E2=80=9CFly Rotary=E2=80=9D forum and pres= ent our case for the Rotary Engine as a viable alternative to the piston solution.=

I would propose that this comes from our group rather than as a piggy-back on= to any of the other alternative engine groups.

I would not want for our engine solution to be sandwich between the Corvair, Subaru and Volkswagen groups.

=C2=A0

If you want to see it there, you have to make it happen.<= /font>

=C2=A0

T Mann

=C2=A0<= /p>


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