X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-ew0-f52.google.com ([209.85.215.52] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.9) with ESMTP id 4489312 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 12:47:40 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.215.52; envelope-from=andrew@martinag.com.au Received: by ewy20 with SMTP id 20so1564243ewy.25 for ; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 09:47:05 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.213.108.141 with SMTP id f13mr3389573ebp.78.1285951623828; Fri, 01 Oct 2010 09:47:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.119.70 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Oct 2010 09:47:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Originating-IP: [203.42.105.31] In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2010 00:47:03 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: simple dyno From: Andrew Martin To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0015174bef1cbc954f049190f1db --0015174bef1cbc954f049190f1db Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 5=94x5=94 is a bit on the big side, it would take over 500hp to turn it at 2000rpm. I=92ve just made up a 54=94long by 3.6=94 square laminated beam, cost all o= f $30, calculation shows it should absorb 190hp at 2450 prop rpm, only going to be used for a short while on initial startup so no need to go overboard. Andrew On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 10:10 PM, Ernest Christley wrote= : > Why would it need to be wood? > > Not that wood would be lacking. A typical prop is. . .what?. . .3"x8" at > the hub, for a total cross-section of 18sq.". A 5"x5" beam would give yo= u > 25sq.", and the typical prop is quickly narrowed down to a very flat > section. And your not worried about weight, so you could use something > strong but heavy, like oak or hickory. > > But, you could also use an aluminum bar. McMaster-Carr has a 5"x5"x6' 60= 61 > aluminum bar for $700 (http://www.mcmaster.com/#aluminum/=3D933sgh). A > 4"x4" of 6061 is $450, and a 4"x4" of 2024 is $1060. Kind of expensive, b= ut > $700 won't buy much dyno time either. Package (crate?) it correctly, hav= e > it validated against a standard dyno, and it could be rented out to other > builders. > > A composite bar could be built in a few days. Again, since weight is not= a > concern, you could make it a solid layup, but you'd probably want to limi= t > the wall thickness to something simply ridiculous like 1/2", rather than > going batsh!7 crazy, just to save materials. Either way, it would probab= ly > hold the weight of a dump truck without blinking. > > > Bill Bradburry wrote: > >> Over my head! >> >> A 75 inch log that is 5 inches square swinging at 7000 rpm??? If 191 HP >> can do that I will be surprised, but would not want to be close enough t= o >> witness it! [:> >> >> Bill B >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] >> *On Behalf Of *Andrew Martin >> *Sent:* Saturday, September 25, 2010 11:56 AM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] simple dyno >> >> >> Whilst researching propellers, I came across this gem of info from >> www.jcpropellerdesign.com >> >> >> >> Gustave Eiffel (1832-1923) came up with a simple solution for measuring = HP >> without complex apparatus, By using a /balanced /wood bar instead of a >> propeller with a square cross section of 1/15th of the length of the bar= , >> you can measure the rpm and calculate the HP available. >> >> Power in HP =3D 0.0532 (diameter/450)5 (RPM/1000)3 >> >> >> As I need a load on the engine when I run it I=92m going to give this a = go, >> 1350 x 90mm at 7000 rpm will give me 191hp, that=92ll do if I can get it= . >> -- >> Regards >> >> Andrew Martin >> Renesis RD1c >> >> West Australia >> >> > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > --=20 Regards Andrew Martin Martin Ag 275 Newmarracarra Rd Moonyoonooka WA 6532 0427477144 08 99241145 andrew@martinag.com.au --0015174bef1cbc954f049190f1db Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
5=94x5=94 is a bit on the big side, it would take over 500hp = to turn it at 2000rpm.
I=92ve just made up a 54=94long by 3.6=94 = square laminated beam, cost all of $30, calculation shows it should absorb = 190hp at 2450 prop rpm, only going to be used for a short while on initial = startup so no need to go overboard.

Andrew

On Fri, Oct 1,= 2010 at 10:10 PM, Ernest Christley <echristley@att.net> wrote:
Why would it need to be wood?

Not that wood would be lacking. =A0A typical prop is. . .what?. . .3"x= 8" at the hub, for a total cross-section of 18sq.". =A0A 5"x= 5" beam would give you 25sq.", and the typical prop is quickly na= rrowed down to a very flat section. =A0And your not worried about weight, s= o you could use something strong but heavy, like oak or hickory.

But, you could also use an aluminum bar. =A0McMaster-Carr has a 5"x5&q= uot;x6' 6061 aluminum bar for $700 (http://www.mcmaster.com/#aluminum/= =3D933sgh). =A0A 4"x4" of 6061 is $450, and a 4"x4"= of 2024 is $1060. Kind of expensive, but $700 won't buy much dyno time= either. =A0Package (crate?) it correctly, have it validated against a stan= dard dyno, and it could be rented out to other builders.

A composite bar could be built in a few days. =A0Again, since weight is not= a concern, you could make it a solid layup, but you'd probably want to= limit the wall thickness to something simply ridiculous like 1/2", ra= ther than going batsh!7 crazy, just to save materials. =A0Either way, it wo= uld probably hold the weight of a dump truck without blinking.


Bill Bradburry wrote:
Over my head!

A 75 inch log that is 5 inches square swinging at 7000 rpm??? =A0If 191 HP = can do that I will be surprised, but would not want to be close enough to w= itness it! =A0[:<O

=A0
Bill B

=A0
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] *On Behalf= Of *Andrew Martin
*Sent:* Saturday, September 25, 2010 11:56 AM
*To:* Rotary motors in aircraft
*Subject:* [FlyRotary] simple dyno

=A0
Whilst researching propellers, I came across this gem of info from www.jcpropellerdesi= gn.com <http://www.jcpropellerdesign.com>



Gustave Eiffel (1832-1923) came up with a simple solution for measuring HP = without complex apparatus, By using a /balanced /wood bar instead of a prop= eller with a square cross section of 1/15th of the length of the bar, you c= an measure the rpm and calculate the HP available.

Power in HP =3D 0.0532 (diameter/450)5 (RPM/1000)3

=A0
As I need a load on the engine when I run it I=92m going to give this a go,= 1350 x 90mm at 7000 rpm will give me 191hp, that=92ll do if I can get it.<= br> --
Regards

Andrew Martin
Renesis RD1c

West Australia




--
Homepage: =A0http:/= /www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub: =A0 http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists= /flyrotary/List.html



--
Regards

A= ndrew Martin
Martin Ag
275 Newmarracarra Rd
Moonyoonooka WA 6532
0427477144
08 99241145
andrew@martinag.com.au
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