X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fmailhost03.isp.att.net ([204.127.217.103] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.6) with ESMTP id 4250210 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 06 May 2010 15:10:57 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.217.103; envelope-from=keltro@att.net DKIM-Signature: v=1; q=dns/txt; d=att.net; s=dkim01; i=keltro@att.net; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1273173057; h=Content-Type: MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Message-Id:Date:Subject:To:From; bh=SQQbOh 8exFaBkPkeheXC40Tp3WOmtWQfQjZLWeYzFwg=; b=S9ABMyNqDjxqQ9+nHzxCe5nGL XBltDaUPO8kO4+La9tRNJDs+Q/beP/mbY/hEXVQtI9/Td6wr7Z6ncvh0jHQXQ== Received: from fwebmail16.isp.att.net ([204.127.221.116]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc03) with SMTP id <20100506191022H0300jecvie>; Thu, 6 May 2010 19:10:22 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [204.127.221.116] Received: from [208.114.39.128] by fwebmail16.isp.att.net; Thu, 06 May 2010 19:10:22 +0000 From: "Kelly Troyer" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: TO4E Info Date: Thu, 06 May 2010 19:10:22 +0000 Message-Id: <050620101910.20907.4BE3141D000D7FEB000051AB22218801869B0A02D29B9B0EBF019D9B040A05@att.net> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Mar 2 2009) X-Authenticated-Sender: a2VsdHJvQGF0dC5uZXQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_20907_1273173022_0" --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_20907_1273173022_0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bob, Thanks for the clarification.............Since your "60-1" turbo is a hyb= rid with a TO4 turbine section the question of which turbine wheel you have with the 1.15 a/r housing was narrowed by the service rep at "Turbonetics".......The 1.15 housing is limited to either the F1-65 mm or F1-68 mm turbine wheel... -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from "Rogers, Bob J." : -= -------------=20 According to narrative associated with the Turbonetics 60-1, it is =E2=80= =9Cthe careful marriage of a unique high flow/high efficiency compressor se= ction teamed up with a T4 turbine section.=E2=80=9D In other words, it is = a T4 hybrid that flows more than a TO4E.=20=20 =20 See http://www.agpturbo.com/product.php?productid=3D16138&cat=3D252&page=3D= 1 =20 Bob J. Rogers =20 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Beh= alf Of Kelly Troyer Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2010 10:45 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] TO4E Info =20 Group, Perhaps of interest to some..........Exchange I had with a "Turbonetics"= service rep. concerning choice of a turbocharger for my project............My intia= l choice of a TO4E, 50 compressor trim, wet housing (coolent), 1.15 area/radius turb= ine housing (to prevent overspeed at short forays up to 17,999 ft), big shaft, = sleeve bearing turbo has been based on the experience of others of the group......= ... =20 The only question in my mind was what size turbine wheel to use (F1-62 m= m, F1-65 mm or F1-68 mm) as this information was not stated in any of the post= s that I have seen from the group..........This question was answered in the = posts below from me and "Turbonetics".............John Slade of this group is usi= ng a TO4E, 50 comp. trim, .96 a/r turbine housing, turbine wheel ??, successful= ly at altitudes up to 12-14,000 I believe...............The "Cosygirrls" accor= ding to their site have purchased a TO4E, 50 trim, 1.15 a/r housing with the intent= to fly at oxygen altitudes............Bob Rogers (Mustang II, 13B, turbo) is f= lying=20 what he says is a "60-1" trim, 1.15 a/r housing turbo..........It is not cl= ear to me if it is a TO4E as "Turbonetics" has a "60" series turbo that looks much like the TO4E but with a larger compressor wheel and he was not sure which turbine wheel he has............He has had no overspeed problems at altitud= e.. =20 After my plotting my maximum boost (10 psi) (1.7 pressure ratio) at 25= =20 lb/min(air flow) (13B) on the compressor maps it is clear that there are=20 several turbos that will do a satisfactory job for our rotarys...........FW= IW -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 =20 -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------=20 From: Benita Betancourt =20 To: Kelly Troyer =20 Subject: RE: TO4E Info=20 Date: Wed, 05 May 2010 18:39:00 +0000=20 My apologies Kelly, I did mean to type F1-65. You are right in your assumpt= ion, the smaller wheel size is better for your conditions.=20 Please let me know if there is anything else.=20 =20 Benita Betancourt Customer Service Turbonetics Inc. 2255 Agate Ct. Simi Valley, CA 93065 Phone:805-581-0333 Direct:805-426-3421 Fax: 805-584-1913 www.TurboneticsInc.com Watch & read about and our new Forged Billet Compressor Wheels, why they ar= e superior to cast aluminum impellers and even better than standard billet = ones at the Turbonetics Blog. Products: Turbochargers | Turbo Systems | Heat Exchangers | Valves & Contro= ls Markets: Industrial | Military | Agricultural Equipment | Aftermarket Autom= otive The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged= . It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone= else is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosu= re, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in rel= iance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the intende= d addressee please contact the sender and dispose of this e-mail.=20 =20 From: Kelly Troyer [mailto:keltro@att.net]=20 Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:17 PM To: Benita Betancourt Subject: RE: TO4E Info =20 Benita, Thanks for your response...........I have one more question.........Can y= ou tell me=20 why the F1-68 (Larger diameter) turbine wheel would be less likely to over-= speed at altitude using the 1.15 a/r housing than the F1-65 turbine wheel ?.....= ...... In my mind the F1-65 wheel would seem to be a "looser" fit in the housing and pro= bably bypass more of the exhaust..............I admit to being neophyte at this..= ........... =20 Thanks Again, Kelly Troyer -------------- Original message from Benita Betancourt : --------------=20 Kelly,=20 Your only option with the 1.15 a/r is the t4 turbine housing in a f1-65 or = 68. You will want to go with the F1-68 to help with your overspeed issue.= =20 Thank you for your email and interest in our products,=20 =20 Benita Betancourt Customer Service Turbonetics Inc. 2255 Agate Ct. Simi Valley, CA 93065 Phone:805-581-0333 Direct:805-426-3421 Fax: 805-584-1913 www.TurboneticsInc.com Watch & read about and our new Forged Billet Compressor Wheels, why they ar= e superior to cast aluminum impellers and even better than standard billet = ones at the Turbonetics Blog. Products: Turbochargers | Turbo Systems | Heat Exchangers | Valves & Contro= ls Markets: Industrial | Military | Agricultural Equipment | Aftermarket Autom= otive =20 =20 From: Kelly Troyer [mailto:keltro@att.net]=20 Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 10:03 AM To: Benita Betancourt; Benita Betancourt Subject: TO4E Info =20 =20 Sirs, I am interested in purchasing a Turbonetics TO4E, 50 trim, for use on a M= azda=20 rotary engine flowing approx 25 lb/min to produce 10 lb booost at a 1.7p/r = at altitudes up to 18,000 ft............I plan on a 1.15 a/r tang. turbine hou= sing to avoid overspeed at altitude..........My question is how to choose a turbine wheel= for my needs (F1 62, F1 65, or F1 68).......... =20 Thanks, Kelly Troyer keltro@att.net=20=20=20 =20 --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_20907_1273173022_0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_20907_1273173022_1" --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_20907_1273173022_1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Bob,
  Thanks for the clarification.............Since your "60-1" turb= o is a hybrid with
a TO4 turbine section the question of which turbine wheel you have wit= h the
1.15 a/r housing was narrowed by the service rep at "Turbonetics"= .......The
1.15 housing is limited to either the F1-65 mm or F1-68 mm turbine whe= el...
--
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke Delta"_1= 3B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifol= d



 
-------------- Original message from "Rogers, Bob J." <BR= ogers@FDIC.gov>: --------------

According to narrativ= e associated with the Turbonetics 60-1, it is =E2=80=9Cthe careful marriage= of a unique high flow/high efficiency compressor section teamed up with a = T4 turbine section.=E2=80=9D  In other words, it is a T4 hybrid that flows more than a TO4E.  

 

See http://www.agpturbo.com/product.php?productid=3D16138&cat=3D252&pa= ge=3D1

 

Bob J. Rogers

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Kelly Troyer
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2010 10:45 AM
To: Rotar= y motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] TO4E Info

 

Group,

   Perhaps of interest to some..........Exchang= e I had with a "Turbonetics" service

rep. concerning choice of a turbocharger for my project..= ..........My intial choice

of a TO4E, 50 compressor trim, wet housing (coolent), 1.1= 5 area/radius turbine

housing (to prevent overspeed at short forays up to = 17,999 ft), big shaft, sleeve

bearing turbo has been based on the experience of others = of the group.........

 

   The only question in my mind was what s= ize turbine wheel to use (F1-62 mm,

F1-65 mm or F1-68 mm) as this information was not stated = in any of the posts

that I have seen from the group..........This question wa= s answered in the posts

below from me and "Turbonetics".............John Slade of= this group is using a

TO4E, 50 comp. trim, .96 a/r turbine housing, turbine whe= el ??,  successfully

at altitudes up to 12-14,000 I believe...............The = "Cosygirrls" according to

their site have purchased a TO4E, 50 trim, 1.15 a/r housi= ng with the intent to

fly at oxygen altitudes............Bob Rogers (Mustang II= , 13B, turbo) is flying 

what he says is a "60-1" trim, 1.15 a/r housing= turbo..........It is not clear to

me if it is a TO4E as "Turbonetics" has a "60" series tur= bo that looks much

like the TO4E but with a larger compressor wheel and he w= as not sure which

turbine wheel he has............He has had no overspeed p= roblems at altitude..

 

   After my plotting my maximum boost (10 = psi) (1.7 pressure ratio) at 25

lb/min(air flow) (13B) on the compressor maps it is = clear that there are

several turbos that will do a satisfactory job for our ro= tarys...........FWIW

--
Kelly Troyer
"Dyk= e Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/O= il Manifold


 

-------------- Forwarded Me= ssage: --------------
From: Benita Betancourt <bbetancourt@turboneti= csinc.com>
To: Kelly Troyer <keltro@att.net>
Subject: RE: = TO4E Info
Date: Wed, 05 May 2010 18:39:00 +0000

My = apologies Kelly, I did mean to type F1-65. You are right in your assumption= , the smaller wheel size is better for your conditions. <= /FONT>

Ple= ase let me know if there is anything else.

 

Benita Betancourt
Customer = Service
Turbonetics Inc.
2255 Agate Ct.
Simi Valley, CA 93065
Ph= one:805-581-0333
Direct:805-426-3421
Fax: 805-584-1913
www.TurboneticsInc.com

Watch &= amp; read about and our new Forged Billet Compressor Wheels, why they are s= uperior to cast aluminum impellers and even better than standard billet one= s at the Turbonetics Blog.

Products: Turbochargers | Turbo Systems | Heat Exchangers | Valves= & Controls
Markets: Industrial | Military | Agricultural Equipment = | Aftermarket Automotive

The information in t= his email is confidential and may be legally privileged.  It is intend= ed solely for the addressee.  Access to this email by anyone else is u= nauthorized.  If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, c= opying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance= on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you are not the intende= d addressee please contact the sender and dispose of this e-mail.

<= SPAN style=3D"COLOR: blue; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> 

From: Kelly Troyer [mailto:keltro@att.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:17 PM
To: Benita Betancourt
Subject: RE: TO4E Info<= /FONT>

 

Benita,

  Thanks for your response...........I have one more= question.........Can you tell me

why the F1-68 (Larger diameter) turbine wheel would be le= ss likely to over-speed

at altitude  using the 1.15 a/r housing than the F1-= 65 turbine wheel ?........... In my

mind the F1-65 wheel would seem to be a "looser" fit in t= he housing and probably

bypass more of the exhaust..............I admit to being = neophyte at this.............

 

Thanks Again,

Kelly Troyer

-------------- Original mes= sage from Benita Betancourt <bbetancourt@turboneticsinc.com>: -------= -------

Kel= ly,

You= r only option with the 1.15 a/r is the t4 turbine housing in a f1-65 or 68.= You will want to go with the F1-68 to help with your overspeed issue.

Tha= nk you for your email and interest in our products,

 

<= SPAN style=3D"COLOR: blue; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> 

From: Kelly Troyer [mailto:keltro@att.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 10:03 AM
To: Benita Betancourt; Benita Betancour= t
Subject: TO4E Info

 

 

Sirs,

  I am interested in purchasing a Turbonetics T= O4E, 50 trim, for use on a Mazda

rotary engine flowing approx 25 lb/min to produce 10 lb b= ooost at a 1.7p/r at

altitudes up to 18,000 ft............I plan on a 1.15 a/r= tang. turbine housing to avoid

overspeed at altitude..........My question is how to= choose a turbine wheel for my

needs (F1 62, F1 65, or F1 68)..........

 

Thanks,

Kelly Troyer

 

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