X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from an-out-0708.google.com ([209.85.132.247] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.0) with ESMTP id 2797230 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 18 Mar 2008 14:34:32 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.132.247; envelope-from=rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id c37so11546anc.91 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2008 11:33:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; bh=IhxyxaXesP+GQlGnnUP4+QlA5K8RPZ17+kIFv+KIdCo=; b=BpeSwncjMEyb8YYK1N3EZbac+ebY+0Hhi3MH8PL6DLKJ8ia9R3HxV9b8FuqQd9JjVMWAxnuZ74dHAwwuhjk5KwpiST3E48AoU0QJvcJp090vYyvyGATd6xvl02PZN2XezkF7RzSb6LS++r0CRLJr+bIJVTOPjyuXLKf02DeBjMU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; b=NxjUO92zx1aZaOmAD8eBs/Ws652h5vPZaF1ITY3uWW1UNzdc+kdfvcLlHgib5PdqCTkFmflfVwH3iUbrnF4sBw9X+Ydcdcur8W6RYMkAszPjCoQUgiTf5Kkdu3sxrB/mGNuPXwxfEZ99sJ/rpz7kQZ3cGGJ2otsQqvE1RSBB4dI= Received: by 10.100.133.1 with SMTP id g1mr2505237and.28.1205865234403; Tue, 18 Mar 2008 11:33:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.133.10 with HTTP; Tue, 18 Mar 2008 11:33:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1b4b137c0803181133n671d2882wa0b8ecf4bb94b874@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 14:33:54 -0400 From: "Tracy Crook" Sender: rwstracy@gmail.com To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil temps, O-rings In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_10291_6532534.1205865234384" References: X-Google-Sender-Auth: 5176e797061f4c33 ------=_Part_10291_6532534.1205865234384 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Hi Greg, The story below is about the RV-4 but I assume you are asking about the RV-8 rad. It's a Griffin with a core (no tanks) measuring 12 x 18 x 2.625= . The part number is on the website somewhere, don't have it handy. Got it from Summit Racing. Sent an email to Craig Catto with info on prop. Tracy On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 1:04 AM, Greg Ward wrote: > Hey Tracy; > What sized radiator are you using in the RV? Still looking at that belly > scoop idea, and need to get some rough ideas on that > Greg Ward; > Lancair 20b in progress > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Tracy Crook > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Sent:* Saturday, March 15, 2008 9:31 AM > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Oil temps, O-rings > > For another data point, I had coolant temps above 256 degrees when I lost > coolant due to a malfunctioning radiator cap. 256 degrees was max range = of > the GRT EIS I was using at the time so it might have been even higher. I > went to low throttle as soon as the alarm went off and flew for about 6 > minutes until I got to an airport (in Texas) and landed. Topped off the > engine with tap water, fixed the cap and flew back to Florida. Engine > showed no signs of distress and I put several hundred hours on it after > that. Was using TES water jacket O-rings at the time. > > One other observation: The temp warning went off as soon as coolant > level fell too low for the pump to work. The engine still had coolant in= it > and cooled the engine by boiling off some of the remaining coolant. Many > have felt that it is a weakness with the rotary but I LIKE the pump being > high in the system for this reason. If the pump had been low, it would h= ave > continued to pump water until there was almost nothing left. A temp warn= ing > at this point leaves you no grace period and my engine would have been > 'toast' after I landed. As Ed can testify, an engine overhaul away from > home is no fun at all. > > Tracy > > > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 7:00 AM, Mark Steitle wrote: > > > Kelly, > > After reading Al's post, I need to make a clarification on my previous > > oil temp information. The 245* temps were *after* the cooler, at the > > oil filter pad, so who knows what they were coming out of the engine. = Over > > the last year I've instrumented my oil & water cooling systems so many > > different ways that I sometimes get confused as to what I'm reading on = the > > EFIS & EM-2. Presently, I'm taking oil temp readings after the first > > oil/air cooler, then after the oil/water exchanger (as the oil enters t= he > > engine). I do this to monitor how well each of the oil coolers are > > working. Sorry for the confusion. > > > > Mark S. > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 12:54 AM, Al Gietzen wrote= : > > > > > Mark, > > > > > > That is the kind of "Real World" info we like to > > > hear.......Particularly > > > > > > since there is some difference of opinion as to the need or > > > suitability > > > > > > for the use of the "TES" seals among the group.......... > > > > > > -- > > > Kelly Troyer > > > > > > My 20B has the stock O-rings, and I've had the engine exit oil up to > > > 235-240 a number of times, coolant temp to 200F =96 never for very lo= ng - no > > > issues. I figure a max short duration limit on the pan temp is 250. M= ax on > > > oil return, about 220F. Cruise below 190. > > > > > > I'm installing an oil/coolant exchanger looking to reduce the oil tem= p > > > by about 15 degrees. > > > > > > I had done all my analysis around using a Setrab TOC300, then when > > > ordering found they have stopped making it. Anyone have one lying ar= ound? > > > > > > Al > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------=_Part_10291_6532534.1205865234384 Content-Type: text/html; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Hi Greg,
  The story below is about the RV-4 but I assume you are asking a= bout the RV-8 rad.  It's a Griffin with a core (no  tanks) me= asuring 12 x 18 x 2.625.  The part number is on the website somewhere,= don't have it handy.  Got it from Summit Racing. 
 
Sent an email to Craig Catto with info on prop.
 
Tracy

On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 1:04 AM, Greg Ward <<= a href=3D"mailto:gregw@onestopdesign.biz">gregw@onestopdesign.biz> w= rote:
Hey Tracy;
What sized radiator are you using in the RV? = ; Still looking at that belly scoop idea, and need to get some rough ideas = on that
Greg Ward;
Lancair 20b in progress
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 9:31 = AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil temps, = O-rings

For another data point, I had coolant temps above 256 degrees whe= n I lost coolant due to a malfunctioning radiator cap.  256 degrees wa= s max range of the GRT EIS I was using at the time so it might have be= en even higher. I went to low throttle as soon as the alarm went = off and flew for about 6 minutes until I got to an airport (in Texas) = and landed.   Topped off the engine with tap water, fixed the cap= and flew back to Florida.   Engine showed no signs of distress a= nd I put several hundred hours on it after that.  Was using TES water = jacket O-rings at the time.
 
One other observation:   The temp warning went off as soon a= s coolant level fell too low for the pump to work.  The engine still h= ad coolant in it and cooled the engine by boiling off some of the remaining= coolant.  Many have felt that it is a weakness with the rotary but I = LIKE the pump being high in the system for this reason.  If the pump h= ad been low, it would have continued to pump water until there was almost n= othing left.  A temp warning at this point leaves you no grace period = and my engine would have been 'toast' after I landed.  As Ed c= an testify, an engine overhaul away from home is no fun at all.
 
Tracy


 
On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 7:00 AM, Mark Steitle &l= t;msteitle@gmail.co= m> wrote:
Kelly,
After reading Al'= s post, I need to make a clarification on my previous oil temp information.=   The 245* temps were after the cooler, at the oil filter pad, = so who knows what they were coming out of the engine.  Over the last y= ear I've instrumented my oil & water cooling systems so many differ= ent ways that I sometimes get confused as to what I'm reading on the EF= IS & EM-2.   Presently, I'm taking oil temp readings afte= r the first oil/air cooler, then after the oil/water exchanger (as the oil = enters the engine).  I do this to monitor how well each of the oil coo= lers are working.  Sorry for the confusion.

Mark S.


On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 12:54 AM, Al Gietzen <= ;ALVentures@cox.net= > wrote:

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Mark,

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">    That is the kind of "= ;Real World" info we like to hear.......Particularly

=

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">since there is some difference of opinion as= to the need or suitability

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">for the use of the "TES" seals amo= ng the group..........

--Kelly Troyer

M= y 20B has the stock O-rings, and I've had the engine exit oil up to 235= -240 a number of times, coolant temp to 200F =96 never for very long - no i= ssues. I figure a max short duration limit on the pan temp is 250. Max on o= il return, about 220F.  Cruise below 190.

I= 'm installing an oil/coolant exchanger looking to reduce the oil temp b= y about 15 degrees.

I= had done all my analysis around using a Setrab TOC300, then when ordering = found they have stopped making it.  Anyone have one lying around?

A= l

 




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