X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from QMTA06.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.56] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.0) with ESMTP id 2794714 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 17 Mar 2008 01:02:02 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=76.96.30.56; envelope-from=gregw@onestopdesign.biz Received: from OMTA14.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.60]) by QMTA06.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 1oAk1Z0011HpZEsA61C200; Mon, 17 Mar 2008 05:00:29 +0000 Received: from gregoryii ([24.6.40.29]) by OMTA14.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 251F1Z0060dkeQQ8a00000; Mon, 17 Mar 2008 05:01:16 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=ChIyhKXIwPwA:10 a=9sULIoOkskckFCRIQgQA:9 a=XvSvBhDwrpAWQgKZTBPxT8kN1wAA:4 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=4vB-4DCPJfMA:10 a=b8hG5vVbyAkA:10 a=Yu8W81VX_DdftomzaeMA:9 a=2ccPsQag3BxfJvrw9BwA:7 a=hTVA6RiQ7YSXRjAyTFc778awn4kA:4 a=iVkDmfvjeKcA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=AfD3MYMu9mQA:10 Message-ID: <084401c887ec$52f7eaf0$8801a8c0@yosemite.onestopdesign.biz> From: "Greg Ward" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil temps, O-rings Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 22:04:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0841_01C887B1.A5FBC180" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3138 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0841_01C887B1.A5FBC180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey Tracy; What sized radiator are you using in the RV? Still looking at that = belly scoop idea, and need to get some rough ideas on that Greg Ward; Lancair 20b in progress ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 9:31 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil temps, O-rings For another data point, I had coolant temps above 256 degrees when I = lost coolant due to a malfunctioning radiator cap. 256 degrees was max = range of the GRT EIS I was using at the time so it might have been even = higher. I went to low throttle as soon as the alarm went off and flew = for about 6 minutes until I got to an airport (in Texas) and landed. = Topped off the engine with tap water, fixed the cap and flew back to = Florida. Engine showed no signs of distress and I put several hundred = hours on it after that. Was using TES water jacket O-rings at the time. One other observation: The temp warning went off as soon as coolant = level fell too low for the pump to work. The engine still had coolant = in it and cooled the engine by boiling off some of the remaining = coolant. Many have felt that it is a weakness with the rotary but I = LIKE the pump being high in the system for this reason. If the pump had = been low, it would have continued to pump water until there was almost = nothing left. A temp warning at this point leaves you no grace period = and my engine would have been 'toast' after I landed. As Ed can = testify, an engine overhaul away from home is no fun at all. Tracy=20 =20 On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 7:00 AM, Mark Steitle = wrote: Kelly,=20 After reading Al's post, I need to make a clarification on my = previous oil temp information. The 245* temps were after the cooler, at = the oil filter pad, so who knows what they were coming out of the = engine. Over the last year I've instrumented my oil & water cooling = systems so many different ways that I sometimes get confused as to what = I'm reading on the EFIS & EM-2. Presently, I'm taking oil temp = readings after the first oil/air cooler, then after the oil/water = exchanger (as the oil enters the engine). I do this to monitor how well = each of the oil coolers are working. Sorry for the confusion.=20 Mark S. On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 12:54 AM, Al Gietzen = wrote: Mark, That is the kind of "Real World" info we like to = hear.......Particularly since there is some difference of opinion as to the need or = suitability for the use of the "TES" seals among the group.......... -- Kelly Troyer=20 My 20B has the stock O-rings, and I've had the engine exit oil up = to 235-240 a number of times, coolant temp to 200F =96 never for very = long - no issues. I figure a max short duration limit on the pan temp is = 250. Max on oil return, about 220F. Cruise below 190. I'm installing an oil/coolant exchanger looking to reduce the oil = temp by about 15 degrees. I had done all my analysis around using a Setrab TOC300, then when = ordering found they have stopped making it. Anyone have one lying = around? Al ------=_NextPart_000_0841_01C887B1.A5FBC180 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey Tracy;
What sized radiator are you using in the = RV?  Still=20 looking at that belly scoop idea, and need to get some rough ideas on=20 that
Greg Ward;
Lancair 20b in progress
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Tracy=20 Crook
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 = 9:31=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Oil = temps,=20 O-rings

For another data point, I had coolant temps above 256 = degrees when I=20 lost coolant due to a malfunctioning radiator cap.  256 degrees = was max=20 range of the GRT EIS I was using at the time so it might have = been=20 even higher. I went to low throttle as soon as the alarm = went off=20 and flew for about 6 minutes until I got to an airport (in = Texas) and=20 landed.   Topped off the engine with tap water, fixed the = cap and=20 flew back to Florida.   Engine showed no signs of distress = and I put=20 several hundred hours on it after that.  Was using TES water = jacket=20 O-rings at the time.
 
One other observation:   The temp warning went off as = soon as=20 coolant level fell too low for the pump to work.  The engine = still had=20 coolant in it and cooled the engine by boiling off some of the = remaining=20 coolant.  Many have felt that it is a weakness with the rotary = but I LIKE=20 the pump being high in the system for this reason.  If the pump = had been=20 low, it would have continued to pump water until there was almost = nothing=20 left.  A temp warning at this point leaves you no grace period = and my=20 engine would have been 'toast' after I landed.  As Ed can = testify, an=20 engine overhaul away from home is no fun at all.
 
Tracy


 
On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 7:00 AM, Mark Steitle = <msteitle@gmail.com> = wrote:
Kelly,=20
After reading Al's post, I need to make a clarification on my = previous=20 oil temp information.  The 245* temps were after the = cooler, at=20 the oil filter pad, so who knows what they were coming out of the=20 engine.  Over the last year I've instrumented my oil & = water=20 cooling systems so many different ways that I sometimes get confused = as to=20 what I'm reading on the EFIS & EM-2.   Presently, I'm = taking=20 oil temp readings after the first oil/air cooler, then after the = oil/water=20 exchanger (as the oil enters the engine).  I do this to monitor = how=20 well each of the oil coolers are working.  Sorry for the = confusion.=20

Mark S.


On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 12:54 AM, Al = Gietzen <ALVentures@cox.net>=20 wrote:

Mark,

    That is the kind of = "Real=20 World" info we like to = hear.......Particularly

since there is some difference of = opinion as to=20 the need or suitability

for the use of the "TES" seals among the = group..........

--
Kelly=20 Troyer

My = 20B has the=20 stock O-rings, and I've had the engine exit oil up to 235-240 a = number of=20 times, coolant temp to 200F =96 never for very long - no issues. I = figure a=20 max short duration limit on the pan temp is 250. Max on oil = return, about=20 220F.  Cruise below 190.

I'm = installing=20 an oil/coolant exchanger looking to reduce the oil temp by about = 15=20 degrees.

I had = done all=20 my analysis around using a Setrab TOC300, then when ordering found = they=20 have stopped making it.  Anyone have one lying=20 around?

Al

 



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