X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from kmb-rly01.kumbaresources.com ([196.25.79.169] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.8) with ESMTP id 1044986 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 24 Mar 2006 06:41:21 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=196.25.79.169; envelope-from=Hennie.vanRooyen@kumbaresources.com Received: from kmb-msg01.kumbaresources.com ([10.4.0.4]) by kmb-rly01.kumbaresources.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:37:04 +0200 Received: from kmbxkpc1.kumbaresources.com ([10.4.0.8]) by kmb-msg01.kumbaresources.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:38:47 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C64F37.836BADA0" Subject: RE: Rotary installed weight comparison Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:38:47 +0200 Message-ID: <9E0DEB6303D10843B3160726ECBB167D162BFF@kmbxkpc1.kumbaresources.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Rotary installed weight comparison Thread-Index: AcZPN4NeFcqOSmh+RK25BtKzSxAxtg== From: "Hennie van Rooyen [HQP]" To: Return-Path: Hennie.vanRooyen@kumbaresources.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Mar 2006 11:38:47.0319 (UTC) FILETIME=[8369EA70:01C64F37] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C64F37.836BADA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks guys. I do read everything over at Paul Lamar's group, the Osprey= group and also over here on a regular basis. But I've read of 160# to in= the mid 300# 13B's.( and even the mentioned 190# which started this= thread) I'm hoping to use a 13B in my amphib and would like to keep= everything as simple and as light as possible, hence my question. =0D I know about Ken's Coot, but his is heavy. (Yes, I know he uses nitro to= boost his power to 300hp for water take-offs which sounds like a neat= solution! And I believe he's done this often with no ill results) However,= I'm trying to keep my project as light as possible to keep water operating= speeds as low as possible. =0D One last question: Would a belt PSRU be much lighter than the geared ones= mostly used? Also, is it REALLY neccessary to use two bearing on both= pulleys as I've seen a 13B installatioin which used only one on each end. =0D Regards, Hennie=0D -----Original Message----- From: Michael McGee [mailto:jmpcrftr@teleport.com] Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:40 AM Subject: Rotary installed weight comparison ..(this was the thread about the [FlyRotary] Re: Rotary - FWD from Lancair= ES List ).. Here's info for a rotary installation comparison if Tracy can recall his= last W&B on his RV-4. Tracy, how does your plane compare to this?=0D * My RV-4 is bone stock VFR with lights (think J3-with-a-speed-kit) first= flown in '96.=0D * Lyc O-320 E2G, 150 HP, 2 mags, carb, no vacuum system, one radio and= transponder=0D * Sensenich FP metal prop with 2 2" spacers (41 pounds total for prop &= spacers)=0D * That big stock boat anchor starter=0D * Heavier than necessary 10 ply tires (extra 6#) because they were on sale.= =0D Empty weight 979# with 48# on the tail wheel Empty CG 69.25 inches (using the 60 inch datum) Mike McGee, RV-4 N996RV, O320-E2G, Hillsboro, OR 13B in gestation mode, RD-1C, EC-2 At 09:00 2006-03-23, you wrote: It varies a lot depending on builder choices but I would put it closer to= an O - 320, a 30 - 45 lb difference depending on which of the many= versions of the IO - 360 that Lycoming made). The counterweighted= crankshaft on the angle valve IO-360 (200 HP models) accounts for a 28= pound increase alone. =0D Tracy Hennie, I'm told the 2-rotor will come in about the same as an IO-360 installation.= This is a very common install in the RV-6, also in the RV-4 (Tracy= Crook). If you're really interested, you can get onto the Fly Rotary= group. Good bunch of guys and they will be able to answer any question= you may have about the rotary. =0D Mark =0D _____ =0D From: Rotary motors in aircraft [ = mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Hennie van Rooyen [HQP] Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 5:56 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Rotary - FWD from Lancair ES List =0D Hi Mark and anyone, =0D " Mazdatrix recently dyno'd a N/A peripheral-ported 13B for Paul Lamar at= 250hp @ 6000rpm, running a carburetor. That is an easy 125hp/rotor, and= 250 hp from a 195# engine." =0D What would be a reasonable firewall forward weight of such a N/A complete= installation? What I really want to know is what is the lightest= installation to be expected based on average experience? =0D Regards, =0D Hennie ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= -------------- This e-mail is confidential and is for the addressee only.=0D Please refer to http://www.kumbaresources.com/email-disclaimer for= important disclaimers. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= -------------- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C64F37.836BADA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks=0D guys. I do read everything over at Paul Lamar's group, the Osprey= =0D group and also over here on a regular basis. But I've read of= 160# to=0D in the mid 300# 13B's.( and even the mentioned 190# which started this=0D thread) I'm hoping to use a 13B in my amphib and would like= to=0D keep everything as simple and as light as possible, hence my=0D question.
 
I know=0D about Ken's Coot, but his is heavy. (Yes, I know he uses nitro to boost his= =0D power to 300hp for water take-offs which sounds like a neat solution!= And I=0D believe he's done this often with no ill results) However, I'm trying= to=0D keep my project as light as possible to keep water operating= =0D speeds as low as possible.
 
One=0D last question: Would a belt PSRU be much lighter than the geared ones= mostly=0D used? Also, is it REALLY neccessary to use two bearing on both pulleys as= I've=0D seen a 13B installatioin which used only one on each= end.
 
Regards,
Hennie 
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael McGee=0D [mailto:jmpcrftr@teleport.com]
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006= 4:40=0D AM
Subject: Rotary installed weight=0D comparison

..(this was the thread about the= [FlyRotary]=0D Re: Rotary - FWD from Lancair ES List )..

Here's info for a rotary= =0D installation comparison if Tracy can recall his last W&B on his=0D RV-4.  Tracy, how does your plane compare to this?=0D
  • My RV-4 is bone stock VFR with lights (think J3-with-a-speed-kit)= first=0D flown in '96.=0D
  • Lyc O-320 E2G, 150 HP, 2 mags, carb, no vacuum system, one radio= and=0D transponder=0D
  • Sensenich FP metal prop with 2 2" spacers (41 pounds total for prop= =0D & spacers)=0D
  • That big stock boat anchor starter=0D
  • Heavier than necessary 10 ply tires (extra 6#) because they were on= =0D sale.
Empty weight 979# with 48# on the tail wheel
Empty= CG 69.25=0D inches (using the 60 inch datum)


Mike McGee, RV-4 N996RV,= O320-E2G,=0D Hillsboro, OR
13B in gestation mode, RD-1C, EC-2



At= 09:00=0D 2006-03-23, you wrote:
It varies a lot= depending on=0D builder choices but I would put it closer to an O - 320,  a 30 -= 45 lb=0D difference depending on which of the many versions of the IO - 360 that= =0D Lycoming made).  The counterweighted crankshaft on the angle valve= =0D IO-360  (200 HP models) accounts for a 28 pound increase=0D alone.
 
Tracy

Hennie,
I’m told the 2-rotor will come in about the same as an= IO-360=0D installation.  This is a very common install in the RV-6, also= in the=0D RV-4 (Tracy Crook).  If you’re really interested, you can= get onto=0D the Fly Rotary group.  Good bunch of guys and they will be able= to=0D answer any question you may have about the rotary.

 
Mark   

From: Rotary motors in aircraft= [=0D mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Hennie van= Rooyen=0D [HQP]
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 5:56 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Rotary - FWD from Lancair ES=0D List

 
Hi Mark= and=0D anyone,

 
"= Mazdatrix recently= dyno’d a=0D N/A peripheral-ported 13B for Paul Lamar at 250hp @ 6000rpm, running= a=0D carburetor.  That is an easy 125hp/rotor, and 250 hp from a 195#= =0D engine."

 
What= would be a=0D reasonable firewall forward weight of such a N/A complete= installation?=0D What I really want to know is what is the lightest installation to be= =0D expected based on average experience?

 
Regards,

 
Hennie
=0D
----------------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------
This e-mail is confidential and is for the= addressee only.
Please refer to= http://www.kumbaresources.com/email-disclaimer for important= disclaimers.
----------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------------
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