X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [66.219.56.248] (HELO qnsi-xch.qnsi.net) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0c6) with ESMTP id 781995 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 24 Oct 2005 14:20:59 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=66.219.56.248; envelope-from=bhughes@qnsi.net Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Return-Receipt-To: "Bobby J. Hughes" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C5D8C7.90832032" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] It's a Start! Disposition-Notification-To: "Bobby J. Hughes" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.6944.0 Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2005 13:20:05 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] It's a Start! Thread-index: AcXYTSLcutXzMXb2SJCrKGQSLH47YgAeGv0w From: "Bobby J. Hughes" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5D8C7.90832032 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Joe, =20 Congrats on the first start. Hopefully mine is a couple of months away if everything comes together. A couple of thoughts on the Microtech. =20 1. Until you get a prop you can use the RPM Limit Function and set if for a "safe" RPM level. There are two options for this on the Microtech. One will kill the engine and the other just limits the RPMS. 2. Get more injectors please........ I am planning on running a total of 6. Check the impedance for the two injectors. I "think" I remember reading the two injector setup was for low impedance type injectors. If you add more I believe you will have to switch to the high impedance type. My unit is a LT-10S =20 Bobby =20 =20 ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Joe Hull Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2005 10:43 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] It's a Start! Fellow "Fly-Rotarians" -=20 =20 I've got an "Atkins Special" - 85-86 13B, short intake manifold, 2 injector TMW Throttle body, MicroTech ECU, and Tracy's EM2.=20 =20 This weekend I finally was able to put everything in place and try an engine start. I tried three tries cranking the engine for about 15-30 seconds and it felt like it was firing every once in a while but not enough to start. I took the intake off and started to take the plugs out to see if there was a pool of gas in the rotors, when it felt like one or both of the bottom plug wires weren't fully seated. I re-seated the plug wires and had my wife crank the engine while I watched the intake. Ah ha! The rear (#2) rotor's injector wasn't firing. So, I moved the #2 injector wires to the #1 rotor and cranked again and there was spraying - so it wasn't the wires and off with the fuel rail and out comes the #2 injector. I couldn't see any obvious clogging, so I cycled it a few times while dropping penetrating oil into it (OK it just happened to be the handiest thing at the moment). The penetrating oil started to go through the injector after a couple cycles so I put it back in and buttoned up the fuel rail and reconnected everything. I Cranked briefly again and there was now a spray pattern. So, it was time for another real try at starting. I cranked for 10 seconds or so and ka-chug - Vrrrrooooommmmm 3500-4000 rpm with a closed throttle! After 2 seconds of hysteria I turned the key to off and went back (it's a pusher) to see if there were any leaks or other anomalies.=20 =20 I guess I really wasn't expecting it to start and my plan for what to look for on my engine monitors and ECU went out the window when it took off like that! A brief inspection of the engine, hoses, and wires turned up nothing out of the ordinary. So it was time to try again, this time with a real expectation of a start and another plan on what to do in the first few seconds. Again a few seconds of cranking and off she went. This time I checked "OP" on the EM2 and it was reading 112psi - hmmm - a tad high but I guess high is better than low. Fuel pressure was 61psi and RPMs were 3000-3500. After 30 seconds I turned it off and went to re-check everything. Again everything looked good except now that the oil had made to all the little nooks and crannies I was about a quart low. So I added a quart, and checked coolant levels and topped them off as well. I didn't see any oil in the plastic rotor oil "injection" lines so I decided, until I'm satisfied that there is oil flowing, I was going to use 2-cycle oil. I added some 2 cycle and sloshed the tank around by rocking the plane. =20 I read a little more in my ECU (MicroTech) manual and turned off the cold start enrichment and found the screen where the fuel flow at idle is set. I cranked it up again and began fiddling with the idle fuel flow when the 2-cycle mix made it to the injectors and things began to run rough and it died. I started it up again and it ran rough for a few seconds and died again. And, that's where I had to leave it this weekend.=20 =20 All in all I'm a happy camper! I didn't fully expect to get the engine running quite so easily. So, now it's a matter of figuring out how to control the open time on the injectors so I can idle at something less that 3000 RPM, and a whole bunch of fine tuning. =20 My airplane is now "whole". All the parts are there (well except the seat cushions). Now it's just a small matter of getting them all working together - the first time and every time, for as long as I want them to! =20 Regards, Joe Hull Redmond (Seattle), Washington Cozy MkIV #991 (working on Engine & Electrical & Finishing) http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/JoeHull/index.html =20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5D8C7.90832032 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Joe,
 
Congrats on the first start. Hopefully mine is = a couple of=20 months away if everything comes together. A couple of thoughts on the=20 Microtech.
 
1. Until you get a prop you can use the RPM = Limit Function=20 and set if for  a "safe" RPM level. There are two options for this = on the=20 Microtech. One will kill the engine and the other just limits = the=20 RPMS.
2. Get more injectors please........ I am = planning on=20 running a total of 6. Check the impedance for the two injectors. I = "think" I=20 remember reading the two injector setup was for low impedance type=20 injectors.  If you add more I believe you will have to switch to = the high=20 impedance type. My unit is a LT-10S
 
Bobby
 
 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Joe=20 Hull
Sent: Sunday, October 23, 2005 10:43 PM
To: = Rotary=20 motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] It's a=20 Start!

Fellow = “Fly-Rotarians” –=20

 

I’ve got an = “Atkins Special” – 85-86=20 13B, short intake manifold, 2 injector TMW Throttle body, MicroTech ECU, and Tracy’s EM2.=20

 

This weekend I finally was = able to=20 put everything in place and try an engine start. I tried three tries = cranking=20 the engine for about 15-30 seconds and it felt like it was firing every = once in=20 a while but not enough to start. I took the intake off and started to = take the=20 plugs out to see if there was a pool of gas in the rotors, when it felt = like one=20 or both of the bottom plug wires weren’t fully seated. I re-seated = the plug=20 wires and had my wife crank the engine while I watched the intake. Ah = ha! The=20 rear (#2) rotor’s injector wasn’t firing. So, I moved the #2 = injector wires to=20 the #1 rotor and cranked again and there was spraying – so it = wasn’t the wires=20 and off with the fuel rail and out comes the #2 injector. I = couldn’t see any=20 obvious clogging, so I cycled it a few times while dropping penetrating = oil into=20 it (OK it just happened to be the handiest thing at the moment). The = penetrating=20 oil started to go through the injector after a couple cycles so I put it = back in=20 and buttoned up the fuel rail and reconnected everything. I Cranked = briefly=20 again and there was now a spray pattern.  So, it was time for another = real try at=20 starting. I cranked for 10 seconds or so and ka-chug – Vrrrrooooommmmm  3500-4000 rpm with a = closed=20 throttle! After 2 seconds of hysteria I turned the key to off and went = back=20 (it’s a pusher) to see if there were any leaks or other anomalies. =

 

I guess I really = wasn’t expecting it=20 to start and my plan for what to look for on my engine monitors and ECU = went out=20 the window when it took off like that! A brief inspection of the engine, = hoses,=20 and wires turned up nothing out of the ordinary.  So it was time to try again, = this time=20 with a real expectation of a start and another plan on what to do in the = first=20 few seconds. Again a few seconds of cranking and off she went. This time = I=20 checked “OP” on the EM2 and it was reading 112psi – = hmmm – a tad high but I=20 guess high is better than low. Fuel pressure was 61psi and RPMs were 3000-3500. =20 After 30 seconds I turned it off and went to re-check everything. = Again=20 everything looked good except now that the oil had made to all the = little nooks=20 and crannies I was about a quart low. So I added a quart, and checked = coolant=20 levels and topped them off as well. I didn’t see any oil in the = plastic rotor=20 oil “injection” lines so I decided, until I’m = satisfied that there is oil=20 flowing, I was going to use 2-cycle oil. I added some 2 cycle and = sloshed the=20 tank around by rocking the plane.

 

I read a little more in my = ECU=20 (MicroTech) manual and turned off the cold = start=20 enrichment and found the screen where the fuel flow at idle is set.  I cranked it up again and = began fiddling=20 with the idle fuel flow when the 2-cycle mix made it to the injectors = and things=20 began to run rough and it died. I started it up again and it ran rough = for a few=20 seconds and died again. And, that’s where I had to leave it this = weekend.=20

 

All in all I’m a = happy camper!  I didn’t fully expect to = get the engine=20 running quite so easily. So, now it’s a matter of figuring out how = to control=20 the open time on the injectors so I can idle at something less that 3000 = RPM,=20 and a whole bunch of fine tuning.

 

My airplane is now = “whole”. All the=20 parts are there (well except the seat cushions). Now it’s just a = small matter of=20 getting them all working together – the first time and every time, = for as long=20 as I want them to!

 

Regards,

Joe=20 Hull

Redmond = (Seattle), Washington

Cozy = MkIV #991=20 (working on Engine & Electrical & Finishing)

http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/JoeHull/index.html

 

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