X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from m12.lax.untd.com ([64.136.30.75] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3.4) with SMTP id 989868 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 09 Jun 2005 10:00:00 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.136.30.75; envelope-from=alwick@juno.com Received: from m12.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m12.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABBLSU3PANP49VJ for (sender ); Thu, 9 Jun 2005 06:59:09 -0700 (PDT) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: L941HVjjYzDhN3itp//mkPRfEzmhYYb2UajFKZwW8G3XVgz5lUsm7A== Received: (from alwick@juno.com) by m12.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id KU3DDNGR; Thu, 09 Jun 2005 06:58:35 PDT To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 06:58:12 -0700 Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Remaining pressure when cold (Re: coolant leak) Message-ID: <20050609.065829.3016.7.alwick@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=--__JNP_000_55ff.3d1d.6706 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 8-6,10-13,15-25,29-30,34-38,43-44,49-50,53-56,59-64,68-80,81-32767 From: al p wick X-ContentStamp: 27:13:1705346834 X-MAIL-INFO:55aa2a737a8b8ec7eeee17e79ef727d7a3ebb337ee470a4bf3c357afaafe1ffb1a73472f1f43ba2e87873e9a833e33afc3734f736a1e5f6aea179e8b1e8e9e875e7ed307133afa27139adeced3ca4ab3d3fa4f1adb478b4f1e631e270b1e8e0ff30ffefba783a73b37ef3b873f775a370777a37feb0acee72b8fbee7bf03f70a1f4e9783fbfa834b330e834e4ae387a72e2a735a137777da1717a3ea0b8e9e5f27cea36ece5707b773c3cefaaa1adfeafac373fa0afa4ff32f8aca17cba393a35bea8b57a7ee8b9e0bb3 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m12.lax.untd.com|alwick@juno.com This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ----__JNP_000_55ff.3d1d.6706 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, please test your theory David and get back to us. I'm unable to comprehend how you are able to maintain pressure long after shutdown. At some point, you have hot liquid (or air) that cools. That must result in substantial pressure drop. Maybe I'm overlooking something. -al wick On Wed, 8 Jun 2005 20:02:31 -0700 David Leonard writes: On 6/8/05, Russell Duffy <13brv3@bellsouth.net> wrote: >>>> You have a compression leak if.... <<<< Very nice write-up Bill. I agree bill, thanks. Dave, I've got to agree that I've never seen pressure after cool down on any cooling system. Do you have something unusual about your system, like two different pressure caps, or anything else that might make it behave abnormally? Yes, exactly, two pressure caps in series. The second tank is one qt and I keep it empty. The first tank is about a pint and I keep it full. First pressure cap i s 13 psi, and second tank is 20. Pressure sensor (switch only) is on the second tank. The second tank acts as my air spring. (see other post) I believe the "normal" way to test for this is to use a coolant pressure tester, or any other method you can devise to pressurize the system. I'm thinking you could easily have a leak that allowed combustion pressure to get through, but would never let coolant pressure through, particularly pushing liquid. It would be easy enough to pressurize the coolant system to about 30 psi and see if the coolant goes into your new turbo. Also, isn't there a test you can do where you send a sample of coolant out to be tested for combustion gasses? That might be easier, and more likely to give a final answer. To test, I could remove the cap from my second tank and run the engine. There should now be no pressure under cap number 1 after cool down. I will do that test in the near future.... I sure hope it's not leaking Dave. I guess this is another warning sign that I'll never get with my zero pressure system, though if I blow too many bubbles, the low coolant light will come on. Cheers, Rusty (zero pressure / ignorance is bliss) I am now running the Evans Coolant too, but I changed my system. the first cap is now zero psi and the second is still 16 psi. I imagine my over pressure is less than 7-10 psi but it still allows me to check the system for leaks with the pressure sensor. -- Dave Leonard Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html http://members.aol.com/vp4skydoc/index.html -al wick Artificial intelligence in cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock Subaru 2.5 N9032U 200+ hours on engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon Prop construct, Subaru install, Risk assessment, Glass panel design info: http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html ----__JNP_000_55ff.3d1d.6706 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yes, please test your theory David and get back to us. I'm unable to=20 comprehend how you are able to maintain pressure long after shutdown. At = some=20 point, you have hot liquid (or air) that cools. That must result in = substantial=20 pressure drop. Maybe I'm overlooking something.
 
-al wick
 
On Wed, 8 Jun 2005 20:02:31 -0700 David Leonard <wdleonard@gmail.com> writes:

 
On 6/8/05, = Russell=20 Duffy <13brv3@bellsouth.net> wrote:<= /SPAN>=20

 >>>> You have a compression leak if= ....=20 <<<<

Very = nice write-up=20 Bill.  
 
I agree bill, thanks.

 
Dave, I= 've got to=20 agree that I've never seen pressure after cool down on any cooling=20 system.  Do you have something unusual about your system, = like two=20 different pressure caps, or anything else that might make it behave=20 abnormally?  
 
Yes, exactly, two pressure caps in series.  The second tank is = one=20 qt and I keep it empty.  The first tank is about a pint and I keep = it=20 full.  First pressure cap i s 13 psi, and second tank is 20. =20 Pressure sensor (switch only) is on  the second tank. 
 
The second tank acts as my air spring.  (see other=20 post)
 
 
I = believe the=20 "normal" way to test for this is to use a coolant pressure tester,= or=20 any other method you can devise to pressurize the=20 system.   I'm thinking you could easily have a leak that= =20 allowed combustion pressure to get through, but would never let coolant= =20 pressure through, particularly pushing liquid. 
 
It = would be easy=20 enough to pressurize the coolant system to about 30 psi and see if the= =20 coolant goes into your new turbo.  Also, isn't there a test you = can do=20 where you send a sample of coolant out to be tested for combustion=20 gasses?  That might be easier, and more likely to give a final=20 answer. 
 
To test, I could remove the cap from my second tank and run the=20 engine.  There should now be no pressure under cap number 1 after = cool=20 down.  I will do that test in the near future.... 

 
I sure hope it's not leaking = Dave. =20 I guess this is another warning sign that I'll never get with my zero=20 pressure system, though if I blow too many bubbles, the low = coolant=20 light will come on. 
 
Cheers,
Rusty (zero pressure / = ignorance is=20 bliss)
 
 
I am now running the Evans Coolant too, but I changed my system.&= nbsp;=20 the first cap is now zero psi and the second is still 16 psi.  I = imagine=20 my over pressure is less than 7-10 psi but it still allows me to check = the=20 system for leaks with the pressure sensor.

--
Dave=20 Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://= members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html
http://members.aol.= com/vp4skydoc/index.html=20
 

-al wick
Artificial intelligence in= =20 cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock Subaru 2.5
N9032U 200+ hours on=20 engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
Prop construct, Subaru install, = Risk=20 assessment, Glass panel design=20 info:
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
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