X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net ([204.127.131.117] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c5) with ESMTP id 913813 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 25 Apr 2005 10:27:00 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.131.117; envelope-from=keltro@att.net Received: from 204.127.135.76 ([204.127.135.76]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13) with SMTP id <20050425142640113002madoe>; Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:26:40 +0000 Received: from [209.247.222.101] by 204.127.135.76; Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:26:39 +0000 From: keltro@att.net (Kelly Troyer) To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Soft Seals Sloppy slots S^4 Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 14:26:39 +0000 Message-Id: <042520051426.25863.426CFE1F0001A9BC000065072161243646019D9B040A05@att.net> X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Feb 14 2005) X-Authenticated-Sender: a2VsdHJvQGF0dC5uZXQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_25863_1114439199_0" --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_25863_1114439199_0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ken, My Hurleys also !! -- Kelly Troyer Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2 -------------- Original message from kenpowell@comcast.net: -------------- Hi Ed, This has been quite an education for me. Looks like my Hurley apex seals are going to up for sale on Ebay. I WILL be measuring the apex seal slots on all 4 rotors in my shop. (Yeah, I'm yet another who missed this critical measurement!) Ken Powell Bryant, Arkansas 501-847-4721 -------------- Original message -------------- > Right, John > > This past Saturday was two weeks from the incident, mainly waiting for > parts. I tore down and rebuilt the engine over 3 days, but actually time > was probably around 10 hours. Total cost was closer to $2500 what with > both new rotor, housings gaskets, seals, etc. However, I believe a complete > rebuild of a Lycoming with all new cylinders and pistons, etc, would have > run a bit more {:>) Not infrequently a catastrophic failure of a Lycoming > means replacement of the crank and even the case, if a rod let go. So all > things considered I'm sure glad I fly behind a rotor. > > The more I think about my incident and having talked to two other folks who > used the Hurley seals and later took their engine apart, that what may have > been the dominant factors were soft seals and sloppy apex slots. My friend > in Az just took apart one of this two engines that he had flow with (not > related to a apex seal problem), he reported that he was surprised at how > worn his Hurley seals were. Very similar to mind with a considerable amount > of material removed the length of the seal where it rubbed against the edge > of the slot. I think Rusty also reported the same. > A second person who had his engine apart due to an oil leak reported the > seals from Tracy Crook/Bruce T looked like new. > > If the seals were soft either by design for failure in the manufacturing > process, then the wear and lost of material in a critical area of the seal > combined with side forces due to the worn slot were probably not a > combination due for long life. > > Going out this AM to install the engine in the aircraft, hopefully will have > it ready to by tomorrow. > > Best Regards > > Ed A > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Slade" > To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" > Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2005 11:35 PM > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: EWP Installation Update > > > >> Well, Bob, I did finish the engine rebuild tonight and loaded it > >> in the Van. > > What's that, Ed - 2 weeks waiting, maybe 4 days work, and about $1500 in > > parts? > > This whole story makes a very interesting comparison to the Lycoming > > powered > > Cozy that recently threw an exhaust valve at 6000' over Long Island. He > > barely made it into Farmingdale where it is now parked behind an FBO while > > the owner figures out how to either come up with $15k .... or....??? > > > > John (new wood floor all done....next?) > > > > > > > >>> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > >>> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html > > > > > > >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > >> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html --NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_25863_1114439199_0 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Ken,
    My Hurleys also !!
--
Kelly Troyer
Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2




-------------- Original message from kenpowell@comcast.net: --------------

Hi Ed,
This has been quite an education for me.  Looks like my Hurley apex seals are going to up for sale on Ebay.  I WILL be measuring the apex seal slots on all 4 rotors in my shop.  (Yeah, I'm yet another who missed this critical measurement!)

Ken Powell
Bryant, Arkansas
501-847-4721
 
-------------- Original message --------------

> Right, John
>
> This past Saturday was two weeks from the incident, mainly waiting for
> parts. I tore down and rebuilt the engine over 3 days, but actually time
> was probably around 10 hours. Total cost was closer to $2500 what with
> both new rotor, housings gaskets, seals, etc. However, I believe a complete
> rebuild of a Lycoming with all new cylinders and pistons, etc, would have
> run a bit more {:>) Not infrequently a catastrophic failure of a Lycoming
> means replacement of the crank and even the case, if a rod let go. So all
> things considered I'm sure glad I fly behind a rotor.
>
> The more I think about my incident and having talked to two other folks who
> used the Hurley seals and later took their engine apart, that what may have
> been the dominant factors were soft seals and sloppy apex slots. My friend
> in Az just took apart one of this two engines that he had flow with (not
> related to a apex seal problem), he reported that he was surprised at how
> worn his Hurley seals were. Very similar to mind with a considerable amount
> of material removed the length of the seal where it rubbed against the edge
> of the slot. I think Rusty also reported the same.
> A second person who had his engine apart due to an oil leak reported the
> seals from Tracy Crook/Bruce T looked like new.
>
> If the seals were soft either by design for failure in the manufacturing
> process, then the wear and lost of material in a critical area of the seal
> combined with side forces due to the worn slot were probably not a
> combination due for long life.
>
> Going out this AM to install the engine in the aircraft, hopefully will have
> it ready to by tomorrow.
>
> Best Regards
>
> Ed A
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Slade"
> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft"
> Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2005 11:35 PM
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: EWP Installation Update
>
>
> >> Well, Bob, I did finish the engine rebuild tonight and loaded it
> >> in the Van.
> > What's that, Ed - 2 weeks waiting, maybe 4 days work, and about $1500 in
> > parts?
> > This whole story makes a very interesting comparison to the Lycoming
> > powered
> > Cozy that recently threw an exhaust valve at 6000' over Long Island. He
> > barely made it into Farmingdale where it is now parked behind an FBO while
> > the owner figures out how to either come up with $15k .... or....???
> >
> > John (new wood floor all done....next?)
> >
> >
> >
> >>> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> >>> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html
> >
>
>
>
> >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
> >> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html
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