X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2011 07:57:11 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nm1-vm0.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.91.202] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c2a) with SMTP id 4823554 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 12:12:38 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.91.202; envelope-from=randylsnarr@yahoo.com Received: from [98.139.91.70] by nm1.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2011 17:12:02 -0000 Received: from [98.139.91.50] by tm10.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2011 17:12:02 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1050.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2011 17:12:02 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 893972.13652.bm@omp1050.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 54027 invoked by uid 60001); 23 Jan 2011 17:12:02 -0000 DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=4+M2Qa46CRc4vMTxRSKMas2LN+icHVlbUEekXRYoffDywjsuvVUw6F8wF69mrV1uYS7XVBvmR0rgtfz8ommZY+fhPM+1GdmXjzhzNqWu2AUPdmUH5yrwlc29ZvzpbB5KxIbdeduej3Y/IfPm7ML31G5PevusUdcFHXrdjW6BhX0=; X-Original-Message-ID: <315303.53824.qm@web111414.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: DIWmDE8VM1khFl6Tmay0GoJmJ06R..q8.k2i7JlAVKldYWj nms5vHDrZo8H.fLM1IiJLy9M6YrRGuuRVhVC.569yHWiG7K.Rfhe98bORHZj qP7kcjseSzzFvcggPfNKOhP6K.9eqlQZVq84sJR7dT46WzbsZbv0Bd4kkCPv 0bUGzQ_HVD3M.sA94H5mTIYIGMtuDez7YncGPTC5dg4s.AsaKW8loKy1lF_x 4jTnelVAKnDQ10y3KGk04Z6CZPjTZLV6N6wgXk8c.tUDR2TYkyZX1IRnlZT. GKghbLf41oUpFWKhFRsaNbpZY2Iyu85Ytscfpsx7DGVl4_AsPgUUzkohGLdd 85eymXlnXDlC8qdFmDjHh3XYzrTNT0pDJOOVaAK8UOtpmGMGZY_WcUWIdMl5 JeBY7Esl4lA-- Received: from [76.8.220.21] by web111414.mail.gq1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 23 Jan 2011 09:12:01 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailClassic/11.4.20 YahooMailWebService/0.8.107.285259 X-Original-Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 09:12:01 -0800 (PST) From: randy snarr Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Airport security? Security Theatre... X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-89811409-1295802721=:53824" --0-89811409-1295802721=:53824 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is all "Security Theater" Any bad guy can get on any airport if they really want to...only the foolis= h don't know this. Unfortunately the foolish are forcing the rest of us to forfeit our liberty= and money in the per suit of stupidity... If you want something done badly and cost 10 times what it should, have the= government do it... Am track=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 worse = than Bankrupt it wont die Freddie Mae=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Bankrupt and helped crash our economy Fannie Mac =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ditto.. Post Office=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 been to one lately... Social Security Bankrupt TSA=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 my wife wont do what these #@*&^%$ did to me on Th= anksgiving day... Randy Snarr "Flight by machines heavier than air is unpractical and insignificant, if n= ot utterly=0A impossible" -Simon Newcomb, 1902 --- On Wed, 1/19/11, vtailjeff@aol.com wrote: From: vtailjeff@aol.com Subject: [LML] Re: Airport security? To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wednesday, January 19, 2011, 10:22 AM Death by a thousand cuts. Sent from my iPad On Jan 18, 2011, at 8:13 PM, Terrence O'Neill wrote: If there are hundreds of small airports without gates, what's the logic of = having them at bigger airports? =C2=A0Did you ask 'What's 'logic' mean?"How= about requiring every farmer with a strip to fence=0A in and gate?Or every= one with an ujltralight?What sillyness.terrenceLNC2=C2=A0 On Jan 18, 2011, at 10:49 AM, Sky2high@aol.com wrote: =0A=0AC'mon, this is an opportunity for those in the gate business.=C2=A0 E= mploy =0Aa double gate system where ones vehicle is not allowed to pass the= second gate =0Auntil the first is closed.=C2=A0 Exit must be accomplished = elsewhere with a =0Asingle gate (and toll) to get out.=C2=A0 Think of all t= he people that would be =0Aemployed building, installing and maintaining th= ese gates.=0A=C2=A0=0AMy own airport, KARR,=C2=A0has=C2=A0fences and=C2=A0g= ates.=C2=A0 The Sky =0AHaven hangar complex (www.skyhaven.com) is =0Arequir= ed to operate two gates. =C2=A0However, the fence at the northeast only =0A= goes 50 feet beyond the gate and if you are willing to drive through a smal= l =0Aswale entry, is assured.=0A=C2=A0=0AGrayhawk=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AIn a messag= e dated 1/18/2011 9:11:28 A.M. Central Standard Time, =0Apanelmaker@earthli= nk.net writes:=0A=0A Interesting observations =0A and questions.=20 My question is: by keeping vehicles from entering after =0A you, are you t= he police now? Are you expected to enforce a regulation, law, =0A what eve= r? Is that responsibility passed on to you because you rent space? Our =0A = airport does the same thing and has for a long time. I think it=E2=80=99s = to placate a =0A local congress person.Jim=C2=A0 =0A =0A =0A =0A From: Lancair =0A Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironli= ne.net] On Behalf Of marv@lancair.net Sent: Monday, January 17, 2011 8:50 =0A AM To: =0A lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Airport =0A security?=C2=A0 =0A Posted for "Douglas Brunner" =0A : =C2=A0 =C2=A0Yesterday (1/14), =0A I headed out to my airport (KMTN) to do some w= ork on =0A my =C2=A0plane.=C2=A0=C2=A0Recently, my airport has installed a sliding =0A g= ate with a code to =C2=A0control entry. =C2=A0 =C2=A0On my way in, I =0A observed the car in front of me stop at the keyp= ad, spend =C2=A0some time =0A sitting there and then drive away from the entry.=C2= =A0=C2=A0My =0A inference =C2=A0was that they did not know the access code to the =0A airport.=C2=A0= =C2=A0I pulled up to =C2=A0the gate, punched in the access =0A code and pulled through the gate= .=C2=A0=C2=A0I stopped =C2=A0on the other =0A side of the gate, to limit entry to one car.=C2=A0= =C2=A0The car which =0A had =C2=A0been in front of me (and had failed to gain entry) then tried to =0A = pull around =C2=A0me and go through the gate while it was still =0A open.=C2=A0=C2=A0I= moved my car slightly =C2=A0to block their entry =0A figuring that if they didn't know the code,= they =C2=A0shouldn't be coming =0A in with me. =C2=A0 =C2=A0Well it turned out that the two men in the car, =0A were actually po= lice =C2=A0officers, and they did not take kindly to my =0A blocking their entr= ance.=C2=A0=C2=A0In =C2=A0essence they "copped an =0A attitude" (pun intended) and gave me a h= ard time =C2=A0about blocking =0A them.=C2=A0=C2=A0After a few unkind words were ex= changed, we both =0A went =C2=A0on our ways. =C2=A0=20 =C2=A0Normally, I am not a huge fan =0A of the (pseudo) security procedure= s at =C2=A0airports.=C2=A0=C2=A0And =0A perhaps from time to time, I have been = known to let someone =C2=A0follow me =0A in through the security gate, or to follow others in. = However in =C2=A0this =0A case, it appeared to me that they had demonstrated that the= y did =0A not =C2=A0know the code so I treated them (not knowing they were cops) =0A dif= ferently. =C2=A0 =C2=A0Several =0A questions/observations: =C2=A0 =C2=A0Since the number of terrorist =0A incidents attributable to GA aircr= aft both =C2=A0prior to and after =0A instituting these security precaution is ZERO= , is it =C2=A0logical to infer =0A that the procedures have been a success??? =C2=A0 =C2=A0Since the police =0A appear to regard the security precautions as op= tional =C2=A0should these =0A security precautions should be observed religiously= by non- =0A law =C2=A0enforcement types??? =C2=A0 =C2=A0Has the amount of time =0A and money spent on airport security post = 9/11, (which =C2=A0probably =0A exceeds the GDP of some African and Latin American coun= tries) =0A been =C2=A0well spent??? =C2=A0 =C2=A0Or are these security =0A precautions are an expensive charade desig= ned to =C2=A0persuade gullible =0A people that the government is making them =0A = safer??? =C2=A0--=C2=A0For archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists= /lml/List.html=0A =0A =0A No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus =0A Database: 1435/3384 - Release Date: =0A01/1= 6/11=0A =3D=0A=0A=0A=0A --0-89811409-1295802721=:53824 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is all "Security Theater"
Any bad guy can ge= t on any airport if they really want to...only the foolish don't know this.=
Unfortunately the foolish are forcing the rest of us to forfeit our lib= erty and money in the per suit of stupidity...

If you want something= done badly and cost 10 times what it should, have the government do it...<= br>
Am track          = worse than Bankrupt it wont die
Freddie Mae     Ban= krupt and helped crash our economy
Fannie Mac      ditto..
Post O= ffice       been to one lately...
Social S= ecurity Bankrupt
TSA        &nbs= p;        my wife wont do what these #@*= &^%$ did to me on Thanksgiving day...

Randy Snarr


"Flight by machines heavier than air i= s unpractical and insignificant, if not utterly=0A impossible"
-S= imon Newcomb, 1902

--- On Wed, 1/19/11, vtailjeff@ao= l.com <vtailjeff@aol.com> wrote:

From: vtailjeff@aol.com <vtailjeff@aol.com>
Subject: [LML] = Re: Airport security?
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Date: Wednesday, Janu= ary 19, 2011, 10:22 AM

Dea= th by a thousand cuts.

Sent from my iPad

On Jan 18, 20= 11, at 8:13 PM, Terrence O'Neill <troneill@charter.n= et> wrote:

If= there are hundreds of small airports without gates, what's the logic of ha= ving them at bigger airports?  Did you ask 'What's 'logic' mean?"
= How about requiring every farmer with a strip to fence=0A in and gate?
Or everyone with an ujltralight?
What sillyness.
= terrence
LNC2 


On Jan 18, 2= 011, at 10:49 AM, Sky2high@aol.= com wrote:

=0A
=0A
C'mon, this is an opportunity for those in th= e gate business.  Employ =0Aa double gate system where ones vehicle is= not allowed to pass the second gate =0Auntil the first is closed.  Ex= it must be accomplished elsewhere with a =0Asingle gate (and toll) to get o= ut.  Think of all the people that would be =0Aemployed building, insta= lling and maintaining these gates.
=0A
 
=0A
My own = airport, KARR, has fences and gates.  The Sky =0AHaven = hangar complex (www.skyhaven.com) is =0Arequired to operate two gates. &nb= sp;However, the fence at the northeast only =0Agoes 50 feet beyond the gate= and if you are willing to drive through a small =0Aswale entry, is assured= .
=0A
 
=0A
Grayhawk
=0A
 
=0A=0A
In a message dated 1/18/2011 9:11:28 A.M. Central Standard Time, = =0Apanelmaker@earthlink.net= writes:
=0A
=0A

Interesting observations =0A and questions.
My= question is: by keeping vehicles from entering after =0A you, are you the= police now? Are you expected to enforce a regulation, law, =0A what ever?= Is that responsibility passed on to you because you rent space? Our =0A a= irport does the same thing and has for a long time. I think it=E2=80=99s to= placate a =0A local congress person.

Jim

 
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A

From: L= ancair =0A Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of marv@lancair.net
Sent: Monday, January 17, 2011 8:50 =0A AM
To: =0A lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Airport =0A security?

 
=0A

Poste= d for "Douglas Brunner" =0A <douglasbrunner@earthlink.net>:

 
 Yesterday (1= /14), =0A I headed out to my airport (KMTN) to do some work on =0A my
=  plane.  Recently, my airport has installed a sliding =0A g= ate with a code to
 control entry.
 
 On my way in,= I =0A observed the car in front of me stop at the keypad, spend
 = some time =0A sitting there and then drive away from the entry.  = ;My =0A inference
 was that they did not know the access code to t= he =0A airport.  I pulled up to
 the gate, punched in th= e access =0A code and pulled through the gate.  I stopped
&nb= sp;on the other =0A side of the gate, to limit entry to one car. &nbs= p;The car which =0A had
 been in front of me (and had failed to ga= in entry) then tried to =0A pull around
 me and go through the gat= e while it was still =0A open.  I moved my car slightly
 = ;to block their entry =0A figuring that if they didn't know the code, they=
 shouldn't be coming =0A in with me.
 
 Well it t= urned out that the two men in the car, =0A were actually police
 o= fficers, and they did not take kindly to my =0A blocking their entrance.&n= bsp; In
 essence they "copped an =0A attitude" (pun intended)= and gave me a hard time
 about blocking =0A them.  Afte= r a few unkind words were exchanged, we both =0A went
 on our ways= .
 
 Normally, I am not a huge fan =0A of the (pseudo) se= curity procedures at
 airports.  And =0A perhaps from ti= me to time, I have been known to let someone
 follow me =0A in thr= ough the security gate, or to follow others in. However in
 this = =0A case, it appeared to me that they had demonstrated that they did =0A = not
 know the code so I treated them (not knowing they were cops) = =0A differently.
 
 Several =0A questions/observations: 
 Since the number of terrorist =0A incidents attributable= to GA aircraft both
 prior to and after =0A instituting these sec= urity precaution is ZERO, is it
 logical to infer =0A that the pro= cedures have been a success???
 
 Since the police =0A app= ear to regard the security precautions as optional
 should these = =0A security precautions should be observed religiously by non- =0A law enforcement types???
 
 Has the amount of time =0A = and money spent on airport security post 9/11, (which
 probably = =0A exceeds the GDP of some African and Latin American countries) =0A bee= n
 well spent???
 
 Or are these security =0A prec= autions are an expensive charade designed to
 persuade gullible =0A= people that the government is making them =0A safer???
 
<= /font>

--
 
For arch=
ives and unsub http=
://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html
=0A=
=0A
=0A

= No virus found in this message.
Checked= by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus = =0A Database: 1435/3384 - Release Date: =0A01/16/11

=0A

=3D=0A

=0A=0A --0-89811409-1295802721=:53824--