X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com X-SpamCatcher-Score: 2 [X] Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 21:08:25 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from vms048pub.verizon.net ([206.46.252.48] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.8) with ESMTP id 1990492 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 17 Apr 2007 19:52:38 -0400 Received: from jacky0da39824a ([71.111.172.251]) by vms048.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JGO00HLC2B47P21@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 17 Apr 2007 18:52:19 -0500 (CDT) X-Original-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 16:51:50 -0700 From: "Tom Gourley" Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Lancair's Down X-Original-To: "Lancair Mailing List" Reply-to: "Tom Gourley" X-Original-Message-id: <001a01c7814b$5ecb2390$640610ac@jacky0da39824a> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C78110.B1B97650" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C78110.B1B97650 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Regarding the Nebraska 320, except for a possible control system = malfunction, of which there is so far no indication, engine failure is = not the 'final cause' of an aircraft 'spinning in'. It is loss of = control caused by the pilot pulling (inadvertantly, because without an = AOA he can't see he's causing a stall) the wing's AOA higher than its = stall AOA. Terrence, Do you know for sure this was a stall/spin? Do you know for a fact this = aircraft did not have an AOA? I get a little weary of you beating the = AOA drum every time an aircraft goes down and there is the faintest = possibility that a loss of control may have been involved. Now I'm not = criticizing the use of an AOA, nor your desire to save lives. But we've = all read your, well, almost a rant, many times and it does get tiresome. = After reading several of your posts on this subject I get the = impression that you think having an AOA on all aircraft would eliminate = stall/spin accidents. While it should certainly help I think you would = find that even with AOAs there will be stall/spin accidents. When a = pilot finds himself suddenly in an unexpected critical situation, like = low and slow with some sort of power loss problem and with very little = time to react, there is no guarantee that any device or instrument will = prevent a stall/spin if he is not able to overcome the initial shock and = panic and fly the plane within its limits. Pulling back on the stick = when close to the ground and descending rapidly, or trying to tighten = that turn just a little more to make a clearing, is a very powerful = involuntary reaction. I believe it would be difficult, within a matter = of seconds, to override that reaction and respond in a purely rational = manner. (This is where training really helps.) Would an AOA help? = Most likely. Would it prevent most stall/spin accidents? Probably not. Please give it a rest. For the most part you're preaching to the choir. Tom Gourley ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C78110.B1B97650 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

= Regarding the=20 Nebraska 320, except for a possible control system = malfunction, of=20 which there is so far no indication, engine failure is not the = 'final=20 cause' of an aircraft 'spinning in'. It is loss of control = caused by=20 the pilot pulling (inadvertantly, because without an AOA he can't = see=20 he's causing a stall) the wing's AOA higher than its stall=20 AOA.

Terrence,

Do you know for sure this was a stall/spin? Do you know for a = fact=20 this aircraft did not have an AOA? I get a little weary of you = beating the=20 AOA drum every time an aircraft goes down and there is the faintest = possibility that a loss of control may have been involved. Now I'm = not=20 criticizing the use of an AOA, nor your desire to save lives. But = we've=20 all read your, well, almost a rant, many times and it does get = tiresome. =20 After reading several of your posts on this subject I get the = impression=20 that you think having an AOA on all aircraft would eliminate=20 stall/spin accidents. While it should certainly help I think you = would=20 find that even with AOAs there will be stall/spin accidents. When = a pilot=20 finds himself suddenly in an unexpected critical situation, like low and = slow=20 with some sort of power loss problem and with very little time to react, = there=20 is no guarantee that any device or instrument will prevent a stall/spin = if he is=20 not able to overcome the initial shock and panic and fly the plane = within its=20 limits. Pulling back on the stick when close to the ground and = descending=20 rapidly, or trying to tighten that turn just a little more to make a = clearing,=20 is a very powerful involuntary reaction. I believe it would be = difficult,=20 within a matter of seconds, to override that reaction and respond in a = purely=20 rational manner. (This is where training really helps.) = Would an AOA=20 help? Most likely. Would it prevent most stall/spin=20 accidents? Probably not.

Please give it a rest. For the most part you're preaching to = the=20 choir.

Tom Gourley

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