X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-KAS-Score: 0 [] From: "Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com" Received: from pmg.Logan.com ([207.170.160.161] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.4.0) with ESMTPS id 3619937 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 13 Oct 2024 16:46:55 -0400 Received: from pmg.Logan.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg.Logan.com (Proxmox) with ESMTP id A5D5A1E8A5 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2024 16:46:55 -0400 (EDT) Received-SPF: pass (gmail.com ... _spf.google.com: Sender is authorized to use 'ceengland7@gmail.com' in 'mfrom' identity (mechanism 'include:_netblocks.google.com' matched)) receiver=pmg.Logan.com; identity=mailfrom; envelope-from="ceengland7@gmail.com"; helo=mail-ed1-f49.google.com; client-ip=209.85.208.49 Received: from mail-ed1-f49.google.com (mail-ed1-f49.google.com [209.85.208.49]) by pmg.Logan.com (Proxmox) with ESMTPS for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2024 16:46:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mail-ed1-f49.google.com with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5c9404c0d50so3534974a12.3 for ; Sun, 13 Oct 2024 13:46:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1728852407; x=1729457207; darn=lancaironline.net; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=/4/aY7p/CYxL88CviUPE0SY/E7twhP/hNXR6pRkTDwI=; b=O3Xf5ej5mUfvL6WQjSIcMZ3P/K07po9zkdIKsKHavARmR21KFK7PKLqML/JEKju5hx vaquaNuLcvqPwT9wiQxCZQJ58OVXb/bUVbhiHyPvIAvVPqzkbmUbZjuVPGsE/1tuXDtV CldbB+Fj24rmWBpSraFNBQJgJmdQDzOqdOincjI9dsufGBms6tn9fjgd3/cZ3iFPfOsF eKnU0+i+kjx3T+iZWF8RnwoRQhGDiGI4vDkYHzwU4gpV9SCJ05E400UV9/zdUWVDFV4K vXNbfFf1zj9UryxrPEvL+BvVNnBB0CIIRkxHD/quiAr4AV8TNkTcA5Vo/AFOCczUBkZP AKxA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1728852407; x=1729457207; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=/4/aY7p/CYxL88CviUPE0SY/E7twhP/hNXR6pRkTDwI=; b=GHwrlAXCbtcncUoVkoTX2d2rGXG6Gv8o2DlLkxu/M69LZTLVwP74e8kovXAS3Hdrua We9VEC0GhPhuPLPPlI8J0CmLd5lZhLKRozAuNDBPGoHLp6EK745rrpNIoy0W/pRyAP7d WwOhkSigjLTGrLxYVREcE9EZNgYZ7pav0IP9oQniPQva67cpr50c2JVs8PJEvyJLa165 Mq9iMG8980pyGzQul6kykEAaLG4dUi/Hm58VYq3SwHCEj7MeMUhBvcuovO4pEI6Yynji inEkMmIZZmW/gyReJa0NFGY2/Xzp82oZl4Wilv53VJQVEbwltpnU5aSEMwt+sBF+l20t ONFQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yx4U+No90kAzcyViMjflmfoLfVTMrMVtzpAHEmA/sd8/fWK8as+ aLMg7vie7CzjKns/KQ2vLw9fMGFGUvrrTr8vpepKkT7Ko04sJYTlNFzk+Chk4oUC8U2JgDIh6A6 TzTdGn2Ib5jjwijtQd3Wc+rGHNnLP+Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEbW92zSM7oMyS7MRGffUCix69R8+lu1BxiYlRtqICHqMzsiMLFgRJS6yXnhAoj2zVzKAApNPDT2Mq99rs2slc= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:2682:b0:5c9:70dc:2c56 with SMTP id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5c970dc2ee5mr2204324a12.34.1728852406545; Sun, 13 Oct 2024 13:46:46 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2024 15:46:35 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: RV-9A w13B Update To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008fb3f9062461d1fe" X-SPAM-LEVEL: Spam detection results: 0 AWL 1.282 Adjusted score from AWL reputation of From: address BAYES_00 -1.9 Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% DKIM_SIGNED 0.1 Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid DKIM_VALID -0.1 Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature DKIM_VALID_AU -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's domain DKIM_VALID_EF -0.1 Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from envelope-from domain DMARC_PASS -0.1 DMARC pass policy FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT 0.25 Envelope-from freemail username ends in digit FREEMAIL_FROM 0.001 Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider HTML_MESSAGE 0.001 HTML included in message RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE -0.0001 Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/, no trust RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2 -1.255 Average reputation (+2) SPF_HELO_NONE 0.001 SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record SPF_PASS -0.001 SPF: sender matches SPF record T_REMOTE_IMAGE 0.01 Message contains an external image --0000000000008fb3f9062461d1fe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yeah, aero is often non-intuitive. ex: One of the higher pressure locations on a low wing airframe is the *aft* end of the canopy. The Thorp T-18 had the cabin air entrance near the base of the canopy, in the back. It would part your hair in back if opened during cruise flight. Virus-free.www.avast.com <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> On Sun, Oct 13, 2024 at 8:38=E2=80=AFAM William Schertz wschertz343@gmail.c= om < flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > Actually, if you look at a number of Burt Rutan's planes (tractor, not > pusher) he uses top exit cooling, as Charlie said, the exits were near th= e > front of the cowl which is a low pressure area. The Catbird and the Grizz= ly > in particular had only top exit. > > On Sat, Oct 12, 2024 at 11:27=E2=80=AFPM David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.co= m < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >> also, invariably there is oil mist in out air that goes through the cowl >> and it would probably pretty quickly start getting all over your windscr= een >> and would be continuous PTA to clean it all the time >> >> On Sat, Oct 12, 2024, 9:24=E2=80=AFPM Rob McMillan robmcmillanpls@gmail.= com < >> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >> >>> Ah! Yeah, my F4U time is pretty limited... (But I am willing to fly one >>> in case anybody is willing to loan me one!). I wasn't thinking of cowl >>> flaps on top, but louvers that would be pretty much flush... >>> >>> It was the windshield slope pressure increase that I wasn't thinking >>> about! >>> >>> I really appreciate the great info shared in these emails! >>> >>> Thank you! >>> >>> Rob >>> >>> On Sat, Oct 12, 2024, 5:17=E2=80=AFPM Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.= com < >>> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >>> >>>> If you're talking about putting the exit there, it would have to be >>>> near the front of the cowl, near the prop. (Been done with a/c engines= ; see Garrison >>>> Melmoth 2 >>>> ). >>>> But as you get closer to the windshield, external pressure goes way up= , so >>>> the air would try to go *down* instead of up. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Virus-free.www.avast.com >>>> >>>> <#m_-1059865085369703164_m_3515475279745736576_m_2314378902410756534_m= _1139761703917254549_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> >>>> >>>> On Sat, Oct 12, 2024 at 2:38=E2=80=AFPM Rob McMillan robmcmillanpls@gm= ail.com < >>>> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dumb Question here! >>>>> >>>>> Why don't we put cooling on the top of the cowl? >>>>> >>>>> Seems like the heat would come out better... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sat, Oct 12, 2024, 11:50=E2=80=AFAM David COOK hoursaway1@comcast.= net < >>>>> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Cowl on for cooling tests. We had good #s with it off then found not >>>>>> enough airflow with cowl on and had to add some out-venting to the b= ottom >>>>>> of the cowl with simple SS marine louvers. David >>>>>> >>>>>> On 10/11/2024 9:15 PM EDT Doug Lomheim rv9flyer13b@gmail.com < >>>>>> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I now have 4.2 hrs. of ground run time on the 13B I rebuilt in >>>>>> Feb/Mar, and will now drop the oil and replace with Mobile One and k= eep >>>>>> exploring the upper limits of the power band! I got a bit carried a= way >>>>>> today and pushed it up to 25 inches, and had to go full rich, so wil= l have >>>>>> to tweak the EC2 some more above 16 inches. So far I=E2=80=99m very= happy with the >>>>>> temps while doing the ground runs, and with OATs from 90-95 degrees,= the >>>>>> max water temp has been 178 degrees, and oil temp only 148. I=E2=80= =99ve been able >>>>>> to run 30 minutes straight without a cowling, without any temp issue= s, so >>>>>> am wondering if I=E2=80=99m going to be too cool once I start flying= it?? :) >>>>>> >>>>>> Doug >>>>>> >>>>>> [image: IMG_9906.jpg] >>>>>> >>>>>> --0000000000008fb3f9062461d1fe Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yea= h, aero is often non-intuitive. ex: One of the higher pressure locations on= a low wing airframe is the *aft* end of the canopy. The Thorp T-18 had the= cabin air entrance near the base of the canopy, in the back. It would part= your hair in back if opened during cruise flight.

3D""Virus-free.www.avast.com=

On Sun, Oct 13, 2024 at 8:38=E2=80=AFAM William S= chertz wschertz343@gmail.com &= lt;flyrotary@lancaironline.n= et> wrote:
Actually, if you look at a number of Burt Rutan's pl= anes (tractor, not pusher) he uses top exit cooling, as Charlie said, the e= xits were near the front of the cowl which is a low pressure area. The Catb= ird and the Grizzly in particular had only top exit.

On Sat, Oct 12, 2024 at= 11:27=E2=80=AFPM David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:<= br>

a= lso, invariably there is oil mist in out air that goes through the cowl and= it would probably pretty quickly start getting all over your windscreen an= d would be continuous PTA to clean it all the time


On Sat= , Oct 12, 2024, 9:24=E2=80=AFPM Rob McMillan robmcmillanpls@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironl= ine.net> wrote:
Ah! Yeah, my F4U time is pretty limited... (But I = am willing to fly one in case anybody is willing to loan me one!). I wasn&#= 39;t thinking of cowl flaps on top, but louvers that would be pretty much f= lush...=C2=A0

It was the winds= hield slope pressure increase that I wasn't thinking about!

I really appreciate the great info = shared in these emails!

= Thank you!

Rob

On S= at, Oct 12, 2024, 5:17=E2=80=AFPM Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
If you're talking about putting = the exit there, it would have to be near the front of the cowl, near the pr= op. (Been done with a/c engines; see Garri= son Melmoth 2). But as you get closer to the windshield, external press= ure goes=C2=A0way up, so the air would try to go *down* instead of up.

3D""Virus-free.www.avast.com

On Sat, Oct 12, 2024 at 2:38= =E2=80=AFPM Rob McMillan robmcmillanpls@gmail.com <= flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Dumb Quest= ion here!=C2=A0

Why don't = we put cooling on the top of the cowl?

Seems like the heat would come out better...


On Sat, Oct 12, 2024, 11:50=E2=80=AFAM David COOK hoursaway1@comcast.net <flyrotary@la= ncaironline.net> wrote:
=20 =20 =20
Cowl on for cooling= tests. We had good #s with it off then found not enough airflow with cowl = on and had to add some out-venting to the bottom of the cowl with simple SS= marine louvers. David
=20
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On 10/11/2024 9:15 PM EDT Doug Lomheim rv9flye= r13b@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancairon= line.net> wrote:
=20
=C2=A0
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I now have 4.2 hrs. of ground run time = on the 13B I rebuilt in Feb/Mar, and will now drop the oil and replace with= Mobile One=C2=A0and keep exploring the upper limits of the power band!=C2= =A0 I got a bit carried away today and pushed it up to 25 inches, and had t= o go full rich, so will have to tweak the EC2 some more above 16 inches.=C2= =A0 So far I=E2=80=99m very happy with the temps while doing the ground run= s, and with OATs from 90-95 degrees, the max water temp has been 178 degree= s, and oil temp only 148.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99ve been able to run 30 minutes=C2= =A0straight=C2=A0without a cowling, without any temp issues, so am wonderin= g if I=E2=80=99m going to be too cool once I start=C2=A0flying it?? =C2=A0:= ) =C2=A0
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Doug=C2=A0
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=C2=A0
=20 3D"IMG_9906.=
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