X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Ed Anderson" Received: from [107.14.166.228] (HELO cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.11) with ESMTP id 8926827 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 07 Sep 2016 11:30:16 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=107.14.166.228; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Return-Path: Received: from [71.75.210.154] ([71.75.210.154:57416] helo=EdPC) by cdptpa-oedge03 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 6D/6D-23306-77230D75; Wed, 07 Sep 2016 15:30:00 +0000 Message-ID: To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2016 11:28:20 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001D_01D208FA.EFF51BF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3528.331 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3528.331 X-RR-Connecting-IP: 107.14.168.142:25 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01D208FA.EFF51BF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Not yet Ed From: Todd Bartrim=20 Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2016 10:45 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! any word yet from Max today? Todd Bartrim On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 6:32 PM, Todd Bartrim = wrote: A couple of hours staring at steam guages in a snow storm while over = water with no auto pilot. .... Iron man in a wooden plane. Bet he has a = hairy chest too =F0=9F=98=86! I'm just thinking about autopilot as I'm thinking about pulling the = trigger and ordering a set of servos for my Dynon tonight. And to = convince myself to do it I try to imagine myself in Max's place.=20 I sure hope his engine problem is as simple as your long distance = diagnosis.=20 Further to that, I just installed a canister fuel filter/water = separater with a water detection probe to avoid that very problem.=20 On Tue, Sep 6, 2016, 5:17 PM Ed Anderson = wrote: Thanks, Alex I passed your suggestion on to Max. Have not yet heard from him = whether he checked for water in his fuel. Ed From: alex=20 Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 4:05 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! I don't know the construction of the falconavia wing, but if there's = low spots in the tanks eternity ribs for instance for water to gather = he might want to consider doing a few wing tank drains and moving the = wings fore and aft between draining, leave to settle for 30 min between = each drain. See if he can get more water out, minimize his chances of = getting problems again Alex Molteno On Sep 6, 2016 6:16 PM, "Ed Anderson" = wrote: When I had spark plug sag, the engine did not sputter, it just = lost rpm and power. He had 14 hours with the engine running fine and after a night of = heavy rain with it left outside (which he normally does not do) and then = the sputtering does not start until 5 minutes after take off, sure makes = it sound like water in the fuel to me. Ed From: Kelly Troyer=20 Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:44 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! Ed, I think you may have diagnosed the problem..........It does not = sound like spark plug "SAG"...........Hope So ??............. Kelly Troyer On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Ed Anderson = wrote: Bummer, Max - to hear you had a problem after such a great = start. Grateful that you made it back to the airport. Here is my best guess as to the problem. IF it rained all night = long and the engine was running fine when you landed, it sure sounds like = you got water in your fuel tanks. Five minutes is enough to burn all the uncontaminated fuel out of the lines and your fuel sump and = start sucking in water contaminated fuel. By playing with the fuel mixture you = probably made it rich enough (more fuel) to sort of counteract the water in = the fuel. I would drain some fuel from each tank and check it for water - = I'll bet you find some. IF you can somehow turn off your wing tanks fuel feed and turn = on the aux tank in the cockpit (which should not have water in it), then = see how it runs. If you run the engine on the ground and it is the water causing = the problem, you should use up the water in a few minutes and then it should = start running normally. IF that happens then, in my opinion, that = increase the odds that it was water in the fuel that caused your problem. I'll bet you normally keep you aircraft in the hangar when its = raining. IF so its not uncommon when left out in the rain that rain could = leak past old hard rubber seals around your filler caps - are they located on = the top of the wing?? Let me know what you find. Ed -----Original Message----- From: (null) maximilian Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:06 PM To: Ed Anderson Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow ! What could have happened? it was raining all night long! 5 min after takeoff it started loosening power like sputtering! thank god after playing with the mixture it ran just enough to = get me back to airport very scary! I was fully loaded with fuel! most likely I leave the plane here! max Sent from my iPad On Sep 6, 2016, at 10:52 AM, Ed Anderson = wrote: Great going, Max - you put Lindberg to shame {:>). Onward to = Iceland Ed -----Original Message----- From: (null) maximilian Sent: Monday, September 05, 2016 2:04 PM To: Ed Anderson Cc: Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com ; = dibora@sbg.at ; Karin Raab ; chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalermo Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow ! I'm in Narsasuak Greenland after completing my most difficult = Flight ever! Icing, snow, rain and fog! Mashine and pilot went through the most difficult! 5 hours 20 min total more then 2 hours in solid IFR! wunderbar! Max Sent from my iPad On Sep 4, 2016, at 3:59 PM, Ed Anderson = wrote: Stay High and dry my friend. Let us know as soon as you get = to Greenland. Ed -----Original Message----- From: Max Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 11:12 AM To: eanderson@carolina.rr.com ; Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; = s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin Raab ; = chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalermo Subject: Big day tomorrow ! Got my survival gear, Flieger is loaded with gas, weather = looks good tail wind Going straight from Goose bay to Greenland 5 hours over = water! Sent from my iPhone ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12942 - Release = Date: 09/04/16 ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12949 - Release = Date: 09/05/16 ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release = Date: 09/06/16=20 -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --=20 Kelly Troyer Dyke Delta_"Eventually" 13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2 No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: = 09/06/16 No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: = 09/06/16 No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12963 - Release Date: = 09/07/16 ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01D208FA.EFF51BF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Not yet
 
Ed
 
Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2016 10:45 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow = !
 
any word yet from Max today?
 
Todd Bartrim
 
On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 6:32 PM, Todd Bartrim = <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

A couple of hours staring at steam guages in a snow storm = while=20 over water with no auto pilot. .... Iron man in a wooden plane. Bet he = has a=20 hairy chest too =F0=9F=98=86!
   I'm just thinking about = autopilot as I'm=20 thinking about pulling the trigger and ordering a set of servos for my = Dynon=20 tonight. And to convince myself to do it I try to imagine myself in = Max's=20 place.
  I sure hope his engine problem is as simple as your = long=20 distance diagnosis.
Further to that, I just installed a canister = fuel=20 filter/water separater with a water detection probe to avoid that very = problem.


On Tue, Sep 6, 2016, 5:17 PM Ed Anderson <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Thanks, Alex
 
I passed your suggestion on to Max.  Have not yet heard = from him=20 whether he checked for water in his fuel.
 
Ed
 
From: alex =
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 4:05=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow=20 !
 

I don't know the construction of the falconavia wing, = but if=20 there's low spots in the tanks  eternity ribs for instance for = water to=20 gather he might want to consider doing a few wing tank drains and = moving the=20 wings fore and aft between draining, leave to settle for 30 min = between each=20 drain. See if he can get more water out, minimize his chances of = getting=20 problems again

Alex Molteno

 
On Sep 6, 2016 6:16 PM, "Ed Anderson" = <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
When I had spark plug sag, the engine did not sputter, it = just lost=20 rpm and power.
 
He had 14 hours with the engine running fine and after a = night of=20 heavy rain with it left outside (which he normally does not do) = and then=20 the sputtering does not start until 5 minutes after take off, sure = makes=20 it sound like water in the fuel to me.
 
Ed
 
From: Kelly = Troyer=20
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:44 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow=20 !
 
Ed,
  I think you may have diagnosed the problem..........It = does=20 not sound like spark plug "SAG"...........Hope So = ??.............
 
Kelly Troyer
 
 
 
 
 
On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Ed = Anderson <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> = wrote:


Bummer,=20 Max -  to hear you had a problem after such a great start. = Grateful=20 that
you made it back to the airport.

Here is my best = guess as=20 to the problem.  IF it rained all night long and
the = engine was=20 running fine when you landed, it sure sounds like you = got
water in=20 your fuel tanks.

Five minutes is enough to burn all=20 the
uncontaminated fuel out of the lines and your fuel sump = and start=20 sucking in
water contaminated fuel.  By playing with the = fuel=20 mixture you probably made
it rich enough (more fuel) to sort = of=20 counteract the water in the fuel.

I would drain some fuel = from=20 each tank and check it for water - I'll bet you
find = some.

IF=20 you can somehow turn off your wing tanks fuel feed and turn on = the=20 aux
tank in the cockpit (which should not have water in it), = then see=20 how it
runs.

If you run the engine on the ground and = it is the=20 water causing the problem,
you should use up the water in a = few=20 minutes and then it should start
running normally.  IF = that=20 happens then, in my opinion, that increase the
odds that it = was water=20 in the fuel that caused your problem.

I'll bet you = normally keep=20 you aircraft in the hangar when its raining.  IF
so its = not=20 uncommon when left out in the rain that rain  could leak = past=20 old
hard rubber seals around your filler caps - are they = located on=20 the top of
the wing??

Let me know what you=20 find.

Ed



-----Original Message----- From: = (null)=20 maximilian
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:06 PM
To: = Ed=20 Anderson
Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow !

What could = have=20 happened?
it was raining all night long!
5 min after = takeoff it=20 started loosening power like sputtering!
thank god after = playing with=20 the mixture it ran just enough to get me back
to = airport
very=20 scary! I was fully loaded with fuel!
most likely I leave the = plane=20 here!

max

Sent from my iPad

On=20 Sep 6, 2016, at 10:52 AM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> = wrote:

Great=20 going, Max - you put Lindberg to shame {:>).  Onward = to=20 Iceland

Ed

-----Original Message----- From: = (null)=20 maximilian
Sent: Monday, September 05, 2016 2:04 PM
To: = Ed=20 Anderson
Cc: Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin=20 Raab ; chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph = DiPalermo
Subject:=20 Re: Big day tomorrow !

I'm in Narsasuak Greenland after = completing my most difficult Flight ever!
Icing, snow, rain = and=20 fog!
Mashine and pilot went through the most = difficult!
5 hours=20 20 min total
more then 2 hours in solid=20 IFR!

wunderbar!
Max

Sent from my iPad

On=20 Sep 4, 2016, at 3:59 PM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> = wrote:

Stay=20 High and dry my friend.  Let us know as soon as you get = to=20 Greenland.

Ed

-----Original Message----- From: = Max
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 11:12 AM
To: eanderson@carolina.rr.com ; Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin=20 Raab ; chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph=20 DiPalermo
Subject: Big day tomorrow !

Got my = survival gear, Flieger is loaded with gas, weather looks = good tail=20 wind
Going straight from Goose bay to Greenland 5 hours = over=20 water!










Sent from = my=20 iPhone





-----
No virus found in = this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: = 2016.0.7442=20 / Virus Database: 4649/12942 - Release Date:=20 09/04/16



-----
No = virus=20 found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7442 = / Virus=20 Database: 4649/12949 - Release Date:=20 09/05/16




-----
No virus = found=20 in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version:=20 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: = 09/06/16

--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive=20 and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/Lis= t.html

 
--
Kelly Troyer
Dyke=20 Delta_"Eventually"
13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2

No virus found in this = message.
Checked=20 by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus = Database:=20 4649/12956 - Release Date:=20 = 09/06/16

=

No virus found in this = message.
Checked by=20 AVG - www.avg.com
Version:=20 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date:=20 = 09/06/16

 

No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7442 / = Virus=20 Database: 4649/12963 - Release Date:=20 09/07/16

------=_NextPart_000_001D_01D208FA.EFF51BF0--