X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Ed Anderson" Received: from [107.14.166.227] (HELO cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.2) with ESMTP id 7688387 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 13 May 2015 08:31:01 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=107.14.166.227; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Return-Path: Received: from [174.110.171.30] ([174.110.171.30:49770] helo=EdPC) by cdptpa-oedge02 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 2C/7F-24520-2E343555; Wed, 13 May 2015 12:30:26 +0000 Message-ID: To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System photo of bottom Date: Wed, 13 May 2015 08:30:28 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01D08D57.113F59E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3528.331 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3528.331 X-RR-Connecting-IP: 107.14.168.130:25 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01D08D57.113F59E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01D08D57.113F59E0" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01D08D57.113F59E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, I found that like anything else the Plugs up installation has its = pros and cons.=20 However, the only real con was the lack of vendor support for Plugs Up.=20 Having the exhaust outlet on the bottom simplified plumbing, also reduce = chance of fuel from injectors falling directly on a hot exhaust. No = problem with flooding the engine. I did it a few times, but 4=E2=80=945 = revs of the engine pumped all the excess fuel out the exhaust ports and = of course the spark plug holes being on top did not collect fuel. It = also provided room under the cowl for longer intake runners =E2=80=93 = don=E2=80=99t know if that would be the case with the 20B, but assume it = would. All in all, if I did it again, I would use plugs up everything else = being the same. Oh, yes, much easier to change the spark plugs {} I did have to modify Tracy=E2=80=99s PRSU mounting plate slightly = =E2=80=93 moving the starter position. =20 Good luck on your decision, Bobby =E2=80=93 more power is always hard to = resist {) Ed From: Bobby J. Hughes=20 Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 8:04 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System = photo of bottom Looks like a good arrangement. I=E2=80=99m still on the fence as to = installing the 20B I purchased a few weeks back. If I do make the swap = I=E2=80=99m considering plugs up as an option.=20 =20 Bobby=20 =20 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 4:50 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System = photo of bottom =20 Hi Bobby, =20 Found this old photo of the bottom of the oil pan which may help. The = blue fitting is naturally the drain hole at the lowest part of the sump. =20 Ed =20 From: Bobby J. Hughes=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:39 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System =20 Thanks Ed. The standoff is not visible in the picture but I had guessed = you did something similar. Any issues with sealing the oil pickup tube = to the block off plate and front iron? =20 Bobby =20 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:23 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System =20 Hi Bobby, =20 I believe the things you have the arrows pointing to are triangular = shaped braces that support the oil sump to the oil pan. The are welded = to top of sump and plate. =20 To access the bolts in the area of the sump, I stood the 4=E2=80=9Dx = 4=E2=80=9D tubing I used for the sump off from the pan about 1 =E2=80=93 = 1 1/2=E2=80=9D. I did this by using a 1=E2=80=9D x 1 1/2=E2=80=9D = rectangular tube (its end=E2=80=99s plugged) welded to both the plate = and the sump. Then 3/4=E2=80=9D dia (I think around 6 holes) holes = were drilled through plate, standoff and sump for the oil to return to = the sump =E2=80=93 probably best to drill holes before welding = components together, but they can be drilled from the inside plate side = =E2=80=93 just make sure you get all shavings out. This stand-off also = gave you access to around 3-4 pan bolts. Depending on your set up these = may or may not be a pain to unscrew, but it can be done. =20 The round tall blue tube served as oil fill tube and dip stick tube. It = was threaded internally at the top and a threaded plug with a hole = drilled in it for the dip stick was used. =20 The aluminum tubes were coolant (front) and air/oil separator (which I = took off after two years of flying with it and it collecting no oil, = because the rotary simply was not spitting any out. =20 Ed =20 From: Bobby J. Hughes=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 2:57 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System =20 Ed, I have a couple of question about your plug up installation. How do you = access the oil pan bolts located behind the oil reservoir and allow for = oil drain back? Also I see what looks like an additional tube (black = arrow) in the attached photo. Can=E2=80=99t figure out what it=E2=80=99s = for. Is it a support bracket? =20 Thanks, =20 Bobby Hughes =20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- -- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ Archive and UnSub: = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.5863 / Virus Database: 4342/9756 - Release Date: = 05/12/15 No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.5863 / Virus Database: 4342/9759 - Release Date: = 05/12/15 No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.5863 / Virus Database: 4342/9764 - Release Date: = 05/13/15 ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01D08D57.113F59E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, I found that like anything else the Plugs up installation has = its=20 pros and cons.
 
However, the only real con was the lack of vendor support for Plugs = Up.=20
 
Having the exhaust outlet on the bottom simplified plumbing, also = reduce=20 chance of fuel from injectors falling directly on a hot exhaust.  = No=20 problem with flooding the engine.  I did it a few times, but = 4=E2=80=945 revs of=20 the engine pumped all the excess fuel out the exhaust ports and of = course the=20 spark plug holes being on top did not collect fuel.  It also = provided room=20 under the cowl for longer intake runners =E2=80=93 don=E2=80=99t know if = that would be the case=20 with the 20B, but assume it would.
 
All in all, if I did it again, I would use plugs up everything else = being=20 the same.  Oh, yes, much easier to change the spark plugs {}
 
I did have to modify Tracy=E2=80=99s PRSU mounting plate slightly = =E2=80=93 moving the=20 starter position. 
 
Good luck on your decision, Bobby =E2=80=93 more power is always = hard to resist=20 {3D"Open-mouthed)
 
Ed
 
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 8:04 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP = Oil=20 System photo of bottom
 

Looks like a good = arrangement.=20 I=E2=80=99m still on the fence as to installing the 20B I purchased a = few weeks back. If=20 I do make the swap I=E2=80=99m considering plugs up as an option. =

 

Bobby =

 

From: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Tuesday, = May 12,=20 2015 4:50 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject:=20 [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil System photo of=20 bottom

 

Hi=20 Bobby,

 

Found=20 this old photo of the bottom of the oil pan which may help.  The = blue=20 fitting is naturally the drain hole at the lowest part of the=20 sump.

 

Ed

 

From: Bobby J. Hughes=20

Sent:=20 Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:39 PM

To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20

Subject:=20 [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil=20 System

 

Thanks Ed. The = standoff is not=20 visible in the picture but I had guessed  you did something = similar. Any=20 issues with sealing the oil pickup tube to the block off plate and front = iron?

 

Bobby

 

From:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironlin= e.net]=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:23 PM
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Questions for Ed Anderson- = Plugs UP=20 Oil System

 

Hi=20 Bobby,

 

I=20 believe the things you have the arrows pointing to are triangular shaped = braces=20 that support the oil sump to the oil pan.  The are welded to top of = sump=20 and plate.

 

To=20 access the bolts in the area of the sump, I stood the 4=E2=80=9Dx = 4=E2=80=9D tubing I used for=20 the sump off from the pan about 1 =E2=80=93 1 1/2=E2=80=9D.  I did = this by using a 1=E2=80=9D x 1=20 1/2=E2=80=9D rectangular tube (its end=E2=80=99s plugged) welded to both = the plate and the=20 sump.  Then 3/4=E2=80=9D dia  (I think around 6 holes) holes = were drilled=20 through plate, standoff and sump for the oil to return to the sump = =E2=80=93 probably=20 best to drill holes before welding components together, but they can be = drilled=20 from the inside plate side =E2=80=93 just make sure you get all shavings = out.  This=20 stand-off also gave you access to around 3-4 pan bolts.  Depending = on your=20 set up these may or may not be a pain  to unscrew, but it can be=20 done.

 

The=20 round tall blue tube served as oil fill tube and dip stick tube. It was = threaded=20 internally at the top and a threaded plug with a hole drilled in it for = the dip=20 stick was used.

 

The=20 aluminum tubes were coolant (front) and air/oil separator (which I took = off=20 after two years of flying with it and it collecting no oil, because the = rotary=20 simply was not spitting any out.

 

Ed

 

From: Bobby J. Hughes=20

Sent:=20 Tuesday, May 12, 2015 2:57 PM

To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20

Subject:=20 [FlyRotary] Questions for Ed Anderson- Plugs UP Oil=20 System

 

Ed,

I have a couple of = question about=20 your plug up installation. How do you access the oil pan bolts located = behind=20 the oil reservoir and allow for oil drain back? Also I see what looks = like an=20 additional tube (black arrow) in the attached photo. Can=E2=80=99t = figure out what it=E2=80=99s=20 for. Is it a  support bracket?

 

Thanks,

 

Bobby = Hughes

 

--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archi= ve and=20 UnSub:   http:= //mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html

No = virus=20 found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.5863 / = Virus=20 Database: 4342/9756 - Release Date:=20 05/12/15

No virus found in this = message.
Checked by AVG=20 - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.5863 = / Virus=20 Database: 4342/9759 - Release Date:=20 05/12/15

No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.5863 / = Virus=20 Database: 4342/9764 - Release Date: = 05/13/15

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