X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Jeff Whaley" Received: from hub026-nj-1.exch026.serverdata.net ([206.225.166.164] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.10) with ESMTPS id 7287381 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 21 Nov 2014 16:26:45 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=206.225.166.164; envelope-from=jwhaley@datacast.com Received: from MBX026-E1-NJ-2.exch026.domain.local ([10.240.14.52]) by HUB026-NJ-1.exch026.domain.local ([10.240.14.30]) with mapi id 14.03.0174.001; Fri, 21 Nov 2014 13:26:11 -0800 To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re [FlyRotary] : New Rotary PowerPlant Thread-Topic: Re [FlyRotary] : New Rotary PowerPlant Thread-Index: AdAF0cQ2Rv1AGbBdTZ+Tlptf4EezmQ== Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 21:26:09 +0000 Message-ID: <234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140E@mbx026-e1-nj-2.exch026.domain.local> Accept-Language: en-CA, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [209.87.232.162] Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="_005_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_"; type="multipart/alternative" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_005_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_" --_000_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yes, this is a very interesting development. Looks like it would make an a= wesome weed-wacker. And very promising for future aircraft use - will any = of us live long enough? The question is: Are they trying to develop an engine or get paid for a ve= ry interesting science project? The technological problems of the engine is not likely their biggest hurdle= but rather the NIH factor; i.e., "Not Invented Here" - therefore none the= existing big engine companies would touch it with a ten foot pole much lik= e what the 13B experience has been for Mazda. If more companies had pursue= d the Wankle 40 years ago this Liquid Piston development would already be c= ommon-place. Jeff From: "Ernest Christley" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: New Rotary powerplant Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 11:10:46 -0800 To: Rotary motors in aircraft [Message Header] [Undecoded Message] The 13B's poor fuel burn, extremely hot exhaust and extremely loud exhaust = were all caused in large part by the unburned fuel in the quench areas of t= he cylinder near the apex seals. It appears that this engine is using dir= ect injection into a recess in the combustion chamber. The recess is pract= ically spherical, minimizing heat transfer to the metal in the body of the = engine. The burn occurs there, and then expands out into the larger chambe= r where there will be some fresh air not pushed into the combustion chamber= that will help burn any remaining hydrocarbons and be expanded by the comb= ustion heat as it waits for the exhaust port to come around. This design will still have the same inter-chamber sealing issues that the = 13B has. It still has the same lubricating issues that the rotary has. Bu= t, both are minor issues compared to that of fuel burn and exhaust problems= that are the bane of the Wankel. This could be very promising for experim= ental aircraft use if they started producing larger models (for generators = perhaps). On Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:56 PM, James R. Osborn wrote: Interesting: http://liquidpiston.com/technology/how-it-works/ On Nov 20, 2014, at 7:02 AM, Jack Hilditch > wrote: The Hartford Courant has a story this morning about a new rotary engine man= ufactured by a Connecticut company called LiquidPiston. The company was sta= rted in 2003 and has secured $21 million in development funds since then. C= ompany president and founder Alec Shkolnik holds a doctorate from MIT. He a= nd his physicist father Nikolay started the LiquidPiston company in 2003. T= he story (with videos) can be found here http://www.courant.com/business/hc= -liquid-piston-bloomfield-new-engine-20141119-story.html Regards, Jack Hilditch Email: wmjack@t3cs.net This message, and the documents attached hereto, is intended only for the a= ddressee and may contain privileged or confidential information. Any unauth= orized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message= in error, please notify us immediately so that we may correct our internal= records. Please then delete the original message. Thank you. --_000_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Yes, this is a very interesting development.  L= ooks like it would make an awesome weed-wacker.  And very promising fo= r future aircraft use – will any of us live long enough?

The question is:  Are they trying to develop an= engine or get paid for a very interesting science project?

The technological problems of the engine is not like= ly their biggest hurdle but rather the NIH factor; i.e., “Not Invente= d Here”  – therefore none the existing big engine companie= s would touch it with a ten foot pole much like what the 13B experience has been for Mazda.  If more companies had pursued the= Wankle 40 years ago this Liquid Piston development would already be common= -place.

Jeff

 

From:

"Ernest Christley" <flyrotary@lancairon= line.net>

Subject:=

Re: [FlyRotary] Re: New Rotary powerplant

Date:

Thu, 20 Nov 2014 11:10:46 -0800

To:

Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironlin= e.net>

3D"Message

3D"Undecoded

The 13B's poor = fuel burn, extremely hot exhaust and extremely loud exhaust were all caused= in large part by the unburned fuel in the quench areas of the cylinder near the apex seals.   It appears that this engine = is using direct injection into a recess in the combustion chamber.  Th= e recess is practically spherical, minimizing heat transfer to the metal in= the body of the engine.  The burn occurs there, and then expands out into the larger chamber where there will be some fres= h air not pushed into the combustion chamber that will help burn any remain= ing hydrocarbons and be expanded by the combustion heat as it waits for the= exhaust port to come around.

 

This design will still have the same inter= -chamber sealing issues that the 13B has.  It still has the same lubri= cating issues that the rotary has.  But, both are minor issues compared to that of fuel burn and exhaust problems that are the bane of th= e Wankel.  This could be very promising for experimental aircraft use = if they started producing larger models (for generators perhaps).

 

 

On= Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:56 PM, James R. Osborn <flyrotary@lancai= ronline.net> wrote:

 

Interesting:

 

http://liqu= idpiston.com/technology/how-it-works/

 

On Nov 20, 2014= , at 7:02 AM, Jack Hilditch <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:=

 

The Hartford Courant has a story this morning about a new rotary engine = manufactured by a Connecticut company called LiquidPiston. The company was = started in 2003 and has secured $21 million in development funds since then. Company president and founder Alec Shkoln= ik holds a doctorate from MIT. He and his physicist father Nikolay started = the LiquidPiston company in 2003. The story (with videos) can be found here=  http://www.courant.com/business/hc-liquid-piston-bloomfield-new-engin= e-20141119-story.html

 

Regards,

 

Jack Hilditch

Email: wmjack@t3cs.net

 

This message, and the documents attached hereto, is intended only for the a= ddressee and may contain privileged or confidential information. Any unauth= orized disclosure is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message= in error, please notify us immediately so that we may correct our internal records. Please then delete the origin= al message. Thank you. --_000_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_-- --_005_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_ Content-Type: image/gif; name="image001.gif" Content-Description: image001.gif Content-Disposition: inline; filename="image001.gif"; size=849; creation-date="Fri, 21 Nov 2014 21:26:09 GMT"; modification-date="Fri, 21 Nov 2014 21:26:09 GMT" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R0lGODdhCgANAPcAAAAAAIAAAACAAICAAAAAgIAAgACAgMDAwMDcwKbK8AAAAAAAKgAAVQAAfwAA qgAA1AAqAAAqKgAqVQAqfwAqqgAq1ABVAABVKgBVVQBVfwBVqgBV1AB/AAB/KgB/VQB/fwB/qgB/ 1ACqAACqKgCqVQCqfwCqqgCq1ADUAADUKgDUVQDUfwDUqgDU1CoAACoAKioAVSoAfyoAqioA1Coq ACoqKioqVSoqfyoqqioq1CpVACpVKipVVSpVfypVqipV1Cp/ACp/Kip/VSp/fyp/qip/1CqqACqq KiqqVSqqfyqqqiqq1CrUACrUKirUVSrUfyrUqirU1FUAAFUAKlUAVVUAf1UAqlUA1FUqAFUqKlUq VVUqf1UqqlUq1FVVAFVVKlVVVVVVf1VVqlVV1FV/AFV/KlV/VVV/f1V/qlV/1FWqAFWqKlWqVVWq f1WqqlWq1FXUAFXUKlXUVVXUf1XUqlXU1H8AAH8AKn8AVX8Af38Aqn8A1H8qAH8qKn8qVX8qf38q qn8q1H9VAH9VKn9VVX9Vf39Vqn9V1H9/AH9/Kn9/VX9/f39/qn9/1H+qAH+qKn+qVX+qf3+qqn+q 1H/UAH/UKn/UVX/Uf3/Uqn/U1KoAAKoAKqoAVaoAf6oAqqoA1KoqAKoqKqoqVaoqf6oqqqoq1KpV AKpVKqpVVapVf6pVqqpV1Kp/AKp/Kqp/Vap/f6p/qqp/1KqqAKqqKqqqVaqqf6qqqqqq1KrUAKrU KqrUVarUf6rUqqrU1NQAANQAKtQAVdQAf9QAqtQA1NQqANQqKtQqVdQqf9QqqtQq1NRVANRVKtRV VdRVf9RVqtRV1NR/ANR/KtR/VdR/f9R/qtR/1NSqANSqKtSqVdSqf9SqqtSq1NTUANTUKtTUVdTU f9TUqtTU1AAAAAwMDBkZGSYmJjMzMz8/P0xMTFlZWWZmZnJycn9/f4yMjJmZmaWlpbKysr+/v8zM zNjY2OXl5fLy8v/78KCgpICAgP8AAAD/AP//AAAA//8A/wD//////ywAAAAACgANAAAINgDxCRw4 EAC+fwgTIjT4DwCAAwIXHlSYkKHDhxEZUpTYEONEjRstOoR4ECRFkSQ5bux4saXDgAA7 --_005_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_ Content-Type: image/gif; name="image002.gif" Content-Description: image002.gif Content-Disposition: inline; filename="image002.gif"; size=857; creation-date="Fri, 21 Nov 2014 21:26:09 GMT"; modification-date="Fri, 21 Nov 2014 21:26:09 GMT" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R0lGODdhCgANAPcAAAAAAIAAAACAAICAAAAAgIAAgACAgMDAwMDcwKbK8AAAAAAAKgAAVQAAfwAA qgAA1AAqAAAqKgAqVQAqfwAqqgAq1ABVAABVKgBVVQBVfwBVqgBV1AB/AAB/KgB/VQB/fwB/qgB/ 1ACqAACqKgCqVQCqfwCqqgCq1ADUAADUKgDUVQDUfwDUqgDU1CoAACoAKioAVSoAfyoAqioA1Coq ACoqKioqVSoqfyoqqioq1CpVACpVKipVVSpVfypVqipV1Cp/ACp/Kip/VSp/fyp/qip/1CqqACqq KiqqVSqqfyqqqiqq1CrUACrUKirUVSrUfyrUqirU1FUAAFUAKlUAVVUAf1UAqlUA1FUqAFUqKlUq VVUqf1UqqlUq1FVVAFVVKlVVVVVVf1VVqlVV1FV/AFV/KlV/VVV/f1V/qlV/1FWqAFWqKlWqVVWq f1WqqlWq1FXUAFXUKlXUVVXUf1XUqlXU1H8AAH8AKn8AVX8Af38Aqn8A1H8qAH8qKn8qVX8qf38q qn8q1H9VAH9VKn9VVX9Vf39Vqn9V1H9/AH9/Kn9/VX9/f39/qn9/1H+qAH+qKn+qVX+qf3+qqn+q 1H/UAH/UKn/UVX/Uf3/Uqn/U1KoAAKoAKqoAVaoAf6oAqqoA1KoqAKoqKqoqVaoqf6oqqqoq1KpV AKpVKqpVVapVf6pVqqpV1Kp/AKp/Kqp/Vap/f6p/qqp/1KqqAKqqKqqqVaqqf6qqqqqq1KrUAKrU KqrUVarUf6rUqqrU1NQAANQAKtQAVdQAf9QAqtQA1NQqANQqKtQqVdQqf9QqqtQq1NRVANRVKtRV VdRVf9RVqtRV1NR/ANR/KtR/VdR/f9R/qtR/1NSqANSqKtSqVdSqf9SqqtSq1NTUANTUKtTUVdTU f9TUqtTU1AAAAAwMDBkZGSYmJjMzMz8/P0xMTFlZWWZmZnJycn9/f4yMjJmZmaWlpbKysr+/v8zM zNjY2OXl5fLy8v/78KCgpICAgP8AAAD/AP//AAAA//8A/wD//////ywAAAAACgANAAAIPgDxCRw4 EAC+fwcQKjxgMCHDhAD+GUQYEcDDhhIzVjwIkSJDfA8zQjxYUWRDixVHmnSI0aHCiS5ZAphJs2ZA ADs= --_005_234B758DE9A64449BEB6BB5D1345CA7A361F140Embx026e1nj2exch_--