X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fmailhost06.isp.att.net ([207.115.11.56] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.16) with ESMTP id 3849365 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 13 Sep 2009 15:39:29 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=207.115.11.56; envelope-from=bbradburry@bellsouth.net Received: from desktop (adsl-157-63-231.mco.bellsouth.net[68.157.63.231]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc06) with SMTP id <20090913193852H0600o0077e>; Sun, 13 Sep 2009 19:38:52 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [68.157.63.231] From: "Bill Bradburry" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Coolant Plumbing Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2009 15:38:52 -0400 Message-ID: <25D4BA72EC114E73A9245725429DC752@Desktop> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01CA3488.4C719830" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Aco0n12zwsfRd4tVQwmoH+k7j1WMDwABpj4w X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6001.18049 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01CA3488.4C719830 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am not sure how to do a drawing of my system, but following along with your drawing=85 From the water pump, I don=92t have a thermostat or restrictor or = swirlpot. The line goes from the pump to the inlet of the double pass radiator, = across the top of the radiator, where there is a radiator cap. At this point = the =BC inch line from the top of the rear iron comes into the radiator just = below the cap. I also read my system pressure at this point. The cap is a = fill cap, not a pressure cap, so air that comes up under it can travel down a 3/16 tube to a modified fire extinguisher with a pressure cap on it. = (just like your RX-2 make up bottle with the lever cap) This fire = extinguisher is kept about 1/3-1/2 full of coolant. I currently do not have an overflow bottle on the outlet of this pressure cap. So far I have not had any = liquid come out of that overflow. I am thinking that it may be a good idea to = add one, but it would need to be small for weight. Now back in the narrative to the inlet under the radiator fill cap. = When coolant comes into the radiator at this point, it travels down the side = of the radiator and across the bottom half of the radiator and into the = suction of the pump. One downside for my setup is that the coolant coming from = the rear iron will only get one pass of the two pass radiator, but it = hasn=92t been thru but one pass of the two pass engine. I plan to use the coolant for a heater, so currently there is a hose = that connects from the heater outlet on the side of the rear iron and goes = around to the suction side of the pump. I am still looking for a suitable = heater heat exchanger so I don=92t have this hooked up to a heater yet. Anyone = with a good idea here would be appreciated. I don=92t have much room for the = heat exchanger so it must be pretty small. I have a cable operated valve to = shut the coolant flow on and off after I have installed the heat exchanger. =20 I think my system would work very similar to yours. It may take more = than a couple of heat cycles due to no swirl pot, but when air comes out, it is trapped and only coolant can return. I always check the fire = extinguisher after an engine run and after a while??? Don=92t have to add more = coolant. Where does one come across an RX-2/3 pressure bottle?? =20 =20 I welcome comments on this set up. =20 Bill B =20 _____ =20 From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Lynn Hanover Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 2:23 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Coolant Plumbing Lynn, You sent that drawing some time ago during a previous discussion on = cooling. My system is set up very similar, but I wonder what the effects of the differences might be. =20 I don=92t have a swirl pot, but the cap on the radiator is like in your drawing where it doesn=92t seal for pressure. Another difference is = that my radiator is a double pass, so the radiator cap is after the first pass = of the radiator. You don=92t show where you come in with the air bleed = from the top of the front iron. Mine comes in just under the radiator cap. This allows the air to move into the make up bottle quickly. But the down = side is that whatever coolant comes thru that =BC inch line bypasses the = first pass of the radiator and only goes thru the last pass. However, I think that this coolant has only made one pass thru the engine as well.=20 ( I have no clue how the coolant flows thru the block, but I think it = goes down one side and back up the other side to the water pump???) I would = like someone to set me straight on this coolant flow thru the engine. There = are two outlets, this one and the heater supply that come off the front = iron. They must somehow only get contact with half the engine since the water = pump is on the other end of the engine. ??? Bill B The air from the engine leaves the top of the swirl pot (in my case) = and enters the stock RX-2 make up bottle at the bottom center. I have no = other lines to the make up bottle other than the line from the neck above the pressure seal that runs to the catch tank required by rules.=20 =20 The dynamic fluid flow does not require exact top collection of air as = would a static system. Air is swept along with the coolant and tends to = collect only in still or very low flow areas like the top of the radiator tanks. Thus the swirl pot, that removes air from a high energy flow.=20 =20 My radiator is a double pass to get more energetic flow and have both = inlet and outlet on the same end.=20 =20 Coolant flows back along the sparkplug side to the rear iron, across the rear iron and forward from rear to front along the intake and exhaust = side, then out through the water pump housing.=20 =20 Lynn E. Hanover ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01CA3488.4C719830 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I am not sure how to do a drawing of my system, but following = along with your drawing…

From the water pump, I don’t have a thermostat or = restrictor or swirlpot.=A0 The line goes from the pump to the inlet of the double pass radiator, across the top of the radiator, where there is a radiator = cap.=A0 At this point the =BC inch line from the top of the rear iron comes into the = radiator just below the cap.=A0 I also read my system pressure at this point.=A0 = The cap is a fill cap, not a pressure cap, so air that comes up under it can travel = down a 3/16 tube to a modified fire extinguisher with a pressure cap on it. = (just like your RX-2 make up bottle with the lever cap)=A0 This fire extinguisher = is kept about 1/3-1/2 full of coolant.=A0 I currently do not have an overflow = bottle on the outlet of this pressure cap.=A0 So far I have not had any liquid = come out of that overflow.=A0 I am thinking that it may be a good idea to add one, = but it would need to be small for weight.

Now back in the narrative to the inlet under the radiator fill = cap.=A0 When coolant comes into the radiator at this point, it travels down the side = of the radiator and across the bottom half of the radiator and into the suction = of the pump.=A0 One downside for my setup is that the coolant coming from the = rear iron will only get one pass of the two pass radiator, but it hasn’t = been thru but one pass of the two pass engine.

I plan to use the coolant for a heater, so currently there is a = hose that connects from the heater outlet on the side of the rear iron and = goes around to the suction side of the pump.=A0 I am still looking for a = suitable heater heat exchanger so I don’t have this hooked up to a heater = yet.=A0 Anyone with a good idea here would be appreciated.=A0 I don’t have much = room for the heat exchanger so it must be pretty small.=A0 I have a cable = operated valve to shut the coolant flow on and off after I have installed the heat = exchanger.

 

I think my system would work very similar to yours.=A0 It may = take more than a couple of heat cycles due to no swirl pot, but when air comes = out, it is trapped and only coolant can return.=A0 I always check the fire = extinguisher after an engine run and after a while??? Don’t have to add more = coolant.

Where does one come across an RX-2/3 pressure bottle?? =  

 

I welcome comments on this set up.

 

Bill B

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Lynn Hanover
Sent: Sunday, September = 13, 2009 2:23 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Coolant Plumbing

Lynn,

You = sent that drawing some time ago during a previous discussion on cooling.  My = system is set up very similar, but I wonder what the effects of the differences = might be. 

I = don’t have a swirl pot, but the cap on the radiator is like in your drawing where = it doesn’t seal for pressure.  Another difference is that my = radiator is a double pass, so the radiator cap is after the first pass of the radiator.  You don’t show where you come in with the air = bleed from the top of the front iron.  Mine comes in just under the radiator cap.  This allows the air to move into the make up bottle = quickly.  But the down side is that whatever coolant comes thru that =BC inch line = bypasses the first pass of the radiator and only goes thru the last pass.  = However, I think that this coolant has only made one pass thru the engine as = well.

( I = have no clue how the coolant flows thru the block, but I think it goes down one side = and back up the other side to the water pump???)  I would like someone = to set me straight on this coolant flow thru the engine.  There are two = outlets, this one and the heater supply that come off the front iron.  They = must somehow only get contact with half the engine since the water pump is on = the other end of the engine. ???

Bill = B

 The air from the engine leaves the top of the swirl pot = (in my case) and enters the stock RX-2 make up bottle at the bottom center. I = have no other lines to the make up bottle other than the line from the neck = above the pressure seal that runs to the catch tank required by rules. =

 

The dynamic fluid flow does not require exact top collection of = air as would a static system. Air is swept along with the coolant and tends to = collect only in still or very low flow areas like the top of the radiator tanks. = Thus the swirl pot, that removes air from a high energy flow. =

 

My radiator is a double pass to get more energetic flow and have = both inlet and outlet on the same end.

 

Coolant flows back along the sparkplug side to the rear iron, = across the rear iron and forward from rear to front along the intake and = exhaust side, then out through the water pump housing.

 

Lynn E. Hanover

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