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Message-ID: <20081204171543.WLGIL.409042.imail@eastrmwml43>
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 17:15:43 -0500
From:  <taspilot@cox.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Hose and Expansion Tank ... was Hose
Cc: wrjjrs@aol.com
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Bill
Please remove me from your mailing lists.
taspilot@cox.net

---- wrjjrs@aol.com wrote:=20
Jeff,
Many systems with restricted height run a bleed hose from the highest point=
 in the system to the bottom of the expansion tank. Usually a restrictor is=
 used, about .030-.060 inches. any bypass isn't sagnifigant, but air will l=
eave the system that way.=C2=A0
Bill Jepson=C2=A0


-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Whaley <jwhaley@datacast.com>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 12:16 pm
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Hose and Expansion Tank ... was Hose


If there is any doubt about the hose I=E2=80=99ll remove it =E2=80=A6 I wou=
ld never have guessed how that expansion tank is working with this setup.

Originally I wanted the tank to be the highest point in the system and be c=
onnected to the inlet side of the pump where pressures are lower and it wou=
ld make an ideal filling point for entire system; however, there isn=E2=80=
=99t enough height under the cowl to mount it above the water pump outlet.

During first flight the pressure got pegged to >20 psi > cap pressure =E2=
=80=A6 I removed that cap and put back the old one at 16 psi =E2=80=A6 now =
if the system is pressurized through the snifter valve it is regulated at 1=
6 psi by the cap, as I would expect. So I relieved the pressure to 10 psi a=
nd ground-operated the engine; it pressurized and regulated itself back to =
16 psi from 130F water temp all the way up to 200F water temp =E2=80=A6 but=
 what is startling is that the tank is actually cool to the touch =E2=80=A6=
 the water pump is hot,
 radiator and its hoses are hot =E2=80=A6 hot pressurized air is exiting th=
e engine through that hose and 1 cup of coolant but having very little temp=
erature effect on either =E2=80=A6 I love it =E2=80=A6 I believe the system=
 is working perfectly and don=E2=80=99t see any reason to operate at pressu=
re above 16 psi.

Jeff

(Just waiting for the weekend and flight #2)

=C2=A0


From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Beh=
alf Of Ed Anderson
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 2:41 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Hose was Re: First Flight, short and hot


=C2=A0

Jeff, you might check with Tracy Crook.=C2=A0 Way back when, he attempted t=
o use some clear plastic/nylon cored reinforced hose for his coolant system=
 for the same reason (I think) =E2=80=93 so you could see what was going on=
.=C2=A0 As best I recall, it was not up to the task due to heat and pressur=
e =E2=80=93 but these were the main line hoses and not just to the header t=
ank.=C2=A0=20

=C2=A0

I can not recall the type =E2=80=93 but think he got them at the local hard=
ware store.

=C2=A0

Ed

=C2=A0


Ed Anderson

Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered

Matthews, NC

eanderson@carolina.rr.com

http://www.andersonee.com

http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW

http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html


From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Beh=
alf Of Jeff Whaley
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 2:03 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: First=20
Flight, short and hot


=C2=A0

Thanks Kelly, I copied (Bill Eslick=E2=80=99s) installation (seen at Round-=
up) and the see-through aspect of that hose was a major selling point; it=
=E2=80=99s easy to see whether there=E2=80=99s air or fluid in the line, wh=
ich is very helpful =E2=80=A6 ideally there should be fluid in the line and=
 about 1 cup in the expansion tank; I suppose removing the cap would provid=
e same information =E2=80=A6 but the tank has to be de-pressurized, cap rem=
oved and re-pressurized before flight.

Bill any comments on durability of that hose?

Jeff=20

=C2=A0


From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Beh=
alf Of Kelly Troyer
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 12:24 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] First Flight, short and hot


=C2=A0


=C2=A0=C2=A0 Jeff,


=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 You might keep an eye on the plastic hose goinng to the =
bottom of your


expansion tank..........This particular hose is not durable and under the h=
igh


heat under the cowl (perhaps not during your Canadian winter) might have


a short service life..........Project looks great and am looking forward to=
 all


further flight test info..........


--
Kelly Troyer=20
"Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20


=C2=A0


-------------- Original message from Jeff Whaley <jwhaley@datacast.com>: --=
------------=20

Thanks to you all for the congratulatory comments =E2=80=A6 attached is a p=
icture of expansion tank and preflig
ht roll-out =E2=80=A6 the orange line is fuel return; the brass is pressure=
 gauge pickup and snifter valve installation.

After reading Eds=E2=80=99 email I now know why the water temperature was s=
o high. =C2=A0I installed a thermostat with the onset of cold weather, but =
I couldn=E2=80=99t use the original Mazda thermostat because my temperature=
 bulb protrudes across the bypass hole. =C2=A0Originally the bypass hole wa=
s plugged and there was no thermostat; however, I removed the bypass plug a=
nd used a non-Mazda thermostat !! =E2=80=A6 so that=E2=80=99s why the under=
side of the Mazda thermostat is so long! Thanks Ed for setting me straight =
and based on your comment about 20% loss of efficiency, I could possibly se=
e 230F x 0.8 or as low as 184F on next flight =E2=80=A6 that would be great=
! For now the thermostat is gone and bypass is re-plugged.

Closer examination of the belt and rubber deposits on underside of top cowl=
ing suggests the belt got jammed in the pulley and cut by friction.

I tried again last night to remove the alternator pulley nut =E2=80=A6 what=
=E2=80=99s the secret? Left-hand thread? Loctite or what? It=E2=80=99s so t=
ight I=E2=80=99m afraid of damaging something trying to get it off.

Jeff

=C2=A0

=C2=A0