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Ed,
I didn't try the mixture adjustment when it bottomed out. I'm not sure why
I didn't as that would be an obvious next step. I did throttle down and up
several times, and did get the lean mixture each time at the same spot.
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
Behalf Of Ed Anderson
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 8:33 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Hard starting - the saga continues
Ok, I understand, now, Steve.
Well, if it is starting to trail off on power and to indicate lean and you
can not richen it with the mixture control, then you may have less than
sufficient fuel flow/pressure. But still if its enough to get your engine
up to 30" hg then it would seem it could surely provides sufficient fuel for
idle.
Yes, you test of the cold start switch indicates it is not the culprit.
I agree, it doesn't sound like you did anything with fixing your master
switch that would cause the type of problem you are seeing, unless perhaps
something did not get grounded again properly.
Lets not forget that injectors can be a problem, although they are
frequently suspect but seldom indicted {:>)
Well, I'll think about it a bit more, but all out of suggestions at this
point.
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Brooks" <cozy4pilot@gmail.com>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 8:20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Hard starting - the saga continues
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
> Behalf Of Ed Anderson
> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:56 PM
> To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Hard starting - the saga continues
>
> You mention that you had voltage to all four injectors which is good.
> However, you made the statement that
>
> "....I also verified using the second battery, that I get a click on each
> injector, when applying power. "
>
> I took all four of the injectors to the truck, where I used the 2nd
> battery,
> and some test clips to apply power to each injector to make sure that it
> clicked.
>
> I knew what I meant, but I wasn't very clear about it.
>
>
> I'm thinking that if you can run the engine at 30" HG then your fuel
> pressure and flow sound like it is not the problem.
>
> Actually at 30 HG the mixture drops off the scale to lean, and stays
> there.
> Engine does continue to run, but definitely doesn't sound as good.
>
>
> Ok, one last question. I seem to recall that you mentioned in one of your
> e
> mails doing some electrical work of some kind before these problems
> started.
> What was that, Steve?
>
> While parked, some water had gone into the Cessna style ignition switch.
> The first indication I had of this was when the starter would not engage.
> If you hit the start position several times, it would eventually start.
> Still ran normally at that time, just had to fiddle with it to get it to
> crank. I traced the problem to the switch, and when I opened it up, the
> water came out. Probably 1/2 teaspoon. The contact had some gunk on it
> which I cleaned up. I use that switch to also do the ignition test (mag
> test positions). Other than take the switch apart, clean the contacts,
> and
> put it back together. That was about it. I did remove the wires from the
> starter contacts, install new heat shrink, and re-solder them. The
> ignition
> test contacts are separate, and they get pulled to ground when in the mag
> test position. Unlike the starter contact, which gets 12 volts applied
> when
> in the start position. The 12 volt pulls a 30 amp ice cube relay, which
> powers the starter solenoid.
>
> Steve
>
> Ed
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Brooks" <cozy4pilot@gmail.com>
> To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 6:58 PM
> Subject: [FlyRotary] Hard starting - the saga continues
>
>
>>I spent about 4 hours today, at the airport, trying to fin a solution to
>>my
>> engine hard starting issue.
>> I went there with two fully charged batteries. I verified power leaving
>> the
>> breakers to the coils and the injectors. I also replaced three of the
>> slide
>> on connectors, because they seemed a little looser fitting than most of
>> the
>> others. I also verified that the cold start lead was not grounded.
>> Measuring it with an ohm meter at the EC-2 connector, I could see the
>> transition of the switch. It changed from sever thousand ohms off, to
>> less
>> than one ohm with the cold start switch on.
>>
>> Came time to crank the engine, and I had the same issue. It wouldn't
>> start.
>> I did, however, only have the fuel pump on for a few seconds, because I
>> assumed that I was going to flood the engine. After it failed to start,
>> I
>> pulled one of the spark plugs. The plug was dry. Seeing that it wasn't
>> flooded, I decided to verify ignition on each coil. I pulled one plug on
>> e
>> each rotor, and hooked up a spark plug to each of the 2 leads. Cranking
>> the
>> engine (which spins really well with 2 spark plugs removed) I had good
>> spark
>> on the front rotor, but the rear rotor plug seemed to spark a couple of
>> times initially, but then did not spark on several engine revolutions.
>> Repeated the test for the other two coils, with the same result.
>>
>> Even though the spark seemed to be not up to snuff, I decided to try to
>> start the engine again. After replacing the plugs, I hit the primer 3
>> times, and cranked the engine. It fired up after a few revolutions, but
>> was
>> only running on one rotor. I turned the cold start switch off, and the
>> other rotor fired up as well. I ran the engine at about 2800 RPM's for
>> several minutes. I tried both A and B controllers. Each seemed to run
>> about the same. Since I had adjusted the mixture the last time, I
>> retuned
>> the A controller at several MAP locations to get the desired mixture.
>> Running it at higher per levels, however caused the mixture to bottom out
>> at
>> about 30 MAP. I didn't try a higher power level, since I was still
>> sitting
>> close to other aircraft, and still tied down.
>>
>> At this point, I decided to take Ed's suggestion and verify power to the
>> injectors. To do this, I had to unbolt the fuel rail, and slide it out
>> with
>> the injectors to get to the connectors. I removed the retaining clip (RC
>> Engineering injectors) and verified that I do indeed have power to all
>> four
>> injectors. I also verified using the second battery, that I get a click
>> on
>> each injector, when applying power. Unfortunately, while re assembling
>> the
>> fuel rail, I have an seal leaking when I turn on the fuel pump. I had to
>> order some new seals, and that ended the testing for today.
>>
>> My next steps at this point, are to get the seals and fix the fuel leak.
>> And also find my fuel pressure gauge and hook it up, so I can see what
>> the
>> fuel pressure is doing.
>>
>> The only thing I'm confused about is the intermittent spark on the rear
>> rotor that I observed, yet once it started, it ran fairly well up to 30
>> MAP.
>>
>>
>> Steve Brooks
>>
>>
>
>
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