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From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
References: <list-2552479@logan.com>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Hard starting - the saga continues
Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 19:55:31 -0500
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Sorry, to hear you have not be able to isolate the problem.  Poor spark on a 
rotor could cause it to be hard to start.  Causes me to wonder if perhaps 
something is causing a voltage drop to the rear coils (like a corroded or 
loose terminal) or if possibly you timing could have changed - although that 
shouldn't affect whether a spark is produced - just when its produced (the 
timing).

You mention that you had voltage to all four injectors which is good. 
However, you made the statement that

"....I also verified using the second battery, that I get a click on each 
injector, when applying power.  "

which does not sound right.  What I am referring to is the only ground the 
injectors should have (in your case since  you do no have the disable 
switches) is through the EC2.  So just applying voltage to the injectors 
should not cause them to click - because there is no grounding circuit - 
except through the EC2.  However, you may have meant that with power applied 
you could get a click by then grounding the opposite terminal of the 
injector - in that case, everything sounds OK.  But, on the off chance you 
are getting a clicking sound just by providing power, then it sounds like to 
me you have a ground - but, that doesn't make sense either, otherwise how 
would it run at all?

I'm thinking that if you can run the engine at 30" HG then your fuel 
pressure and flow sound like it is not the problem.

Poor spark, lack of fuel at low rpm or poor compression all could make 
starting hard, but the engine once started would probably run fine at higher 
rpm.

Ok, one last question.  I seem to recall that you mentioned in one of your e 
mails doing some electrical work of some kind before these problems started. 
What was that, Steve?

Ed


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Brooks" <cozy4pilot@gmail.com>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 6:58 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Hard starting - the saga continues


>I spent about 4 hours today, at the airport, trying to fin a solution to my
> engine hard starting issue.
> I went there with two fully charged batteries.  I verified power leaving 
> the
> breakers to the coils and the injectors.  I also replaced three of the 
> slide
> on connectors, because they seemed a little looser fitting than most of 
> the
> others.  I also verified that the cold start  lead was not grounded.
> Measuring it with an ohm meter at the EC-2 connector, I could see the
> transition of the switch.  It changed from sever thousand ohms off, to 
> less
> than one ohm with the cold start switch on.
>
> Came time to crank the engine, and I had the same issue.  It wouldn't 
> start.
> I did, however, only have the fuel pump on for a few seconds, because I
> assumed that I was going to flood the engine.  After it failed to start, I
> pulled one of the spark plugs. The plug was dry.  Seeing that it wasn't
> flooded, I decided to verify ignition on each coil.  I pulled one plug on 
> e
> each rotor, and hooked up a spark plug to each of the 2 leads.  Cranking 
> the
> engine (which spins really well with 2 spark plugs removed) I had good 
> spark
> on the front rotor, but the rear rotor plug seemed to spark a couple of
> times initially, but then did not spark on several engine revolutions.
> Repeated the test for the other two coils, with the same result.
>
> Even though the spark seemed to be not up to snuff, I decided to try to
> start the engine again.  After replacing the plugs, I hit the primer 3
> times, and cranked the engine.  It fired up after a few revolutions, but 
> was
> only running on one rotor.  I turned the cold start switch off, and the
> other rotor fired up as well.  I ran the engine at about 2800 RPM's for
> several minutes.  I tried both A and B controllers.  Each seemed to run
> about the same.  Since I had adjusted the mixture the last time, I retuned
> the  A controller at several MAP locations to get the desired mixture.
> Running it at higher per levels, however caused the mixture to bottom out 
> at
> about 30 MAP.  I didn't try a higher power level, since I was still 
> sitting
> close to other aircraft, and still tied down.
>
> At this point, I decided to take Ed's suggestion and verify power to the
> injectors.  To do this, I had to unbolt the fuel rail, and slide it out 
> with
> the injectors to get to the connectors.  I removed the retaining clip (RC
> Engineering injectors) and verified that I do indeed have power to all 
> four
> injectors.  I also verified using the second battery, that I get a click 
> on
> each injector, when applying power.  Unfortunately, while re assembling 
> the
> fuel rail, I have an seal leaking when I turn on the fuel pump.  I had to
> order some new seals, and that ended the testing for today.
>
> My next steps at this point, are to get the seals and fix the fuel leak.
> And also find my fuel pressure gauge and hook it up, so I can see what the
> fuel pressure is doing.
>
> The only thing I'm confused about is the intermittent spark on the rear
> rotor that I observed, yet once it started, it ran fairly well up to 30 
> MAP.
>
>
> Steve Brooks
>
>


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