X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from ms-smtp-04.southeast.rr.com ([24.25.9.103] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.10) with ESMTP id 2197180 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 24 Jul 2007 19:26:09 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=24.25.9.103; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Received: from edward2 (cpe-024-074-103-061.carolina.res.rr.com [24.74.103.61]) by ms-smtp-04.southeast.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l6ONPCL2027781 for ; Tue, 24 Jul 2007 19:25:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001501c7ce49$e4e58510$2402a8c0@edward2> From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: FUEL SYSTEM PRESSURE Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2007 19:25:16 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7CE28.5D82DEE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3138 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7CE28.5D82DEE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I acknowledge your points, Mark. My Memory and reflex time are fading - = but, on the other hand, since I can not respond as fast, it gives me = more time to think about the response {:>) Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Steitle=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 5:16 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FUEL SYSTEM PRESSURE Ed, I totally understand, but in the end I figured that the relay was = probably more reliable than my memory, and certainly quicker. ;-) = Besides, it has a manual over ride so I can turn it on and off as I = choose. The efi pumps are located right under my feet, so I ought to be = able to hear them running. Good points though...=20 Mark S. =20 On 7/24/07, Ed Anderson wrote:=20 Hi Mark,=20 I looked into installing the same kind of system early on, but did = not. I came to the conclusion (that for me and my type of flying) that = this system added no safety factor for me that running both pumps on = take off and landing did not do.=20 If the "automatic" system failed to turn on your second pump = (sensor failure, wiring failure, relay failure, etc), you could spend = precious seconds figuring out what is wrong and hitting your manual = override - I presume it does have that. I would assume it also has some = means of letting you know that a pump has failed, warning light? tone?=20 I always take off and land with both EFI high pressure pumps (and = boost pump) running. Once at cruise altitude I switch one EFI and the = boost pump off. If pump failure should happen in that regime of flight, = I have plenty of time to observe the decreasing fuel pressure and/or = stuttering engine and switch on the other pump.=20 Not knocking that set up ( if designed and implemented well), but I = have a dislike of having anything critical being automatically done for = me - I'd rather do it myself. I never like talking cars either {:>)=20 Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Steitle=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 4:24 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FUEL SYSTEM PRESSURE =20 Dave,=20 You've got much more actual experience than I do, but I set my = system up like the Eggenfellner guys do. They use a pressure sensor = coupled to a relay to monitor the fuel pressures. The relay = automatically turns on the second efi pump if the pressure drops below a = certain limit (determined by the pressure sensor). That way the engine = won't falter, skip, run lean, etc. due to low fuel pressures. =20 The good thing about an efi system such as you have described is = the fuel in the fuel rails is always cool. Hot starts should be a = non-issue. =20 Mark S. =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7CE28.5D82DEE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I acknowledge your points, Mark.  My Memory = and=20 reflex time are fading - but, on the other hand, since I can not respond = as=20 fast, it gives me more time to think about the response = {:>)
 
Ed
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mark = Steitle=20
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 = 5:16=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FUEL = SYSTEM=20 PRESSURE

Ed,
I totally understand, but in the end I figured that the relay was = probably more reliable than my memory, and certainly quicker.  = ;-) =20 Besides, it has a manual over ride so I can turn it on and off as I=20 choose.  The efi pumps are located right under my feet, so I = ought to be=20 able to hear them running.  Good points though...
 
Mark S.

 
On 7/24/07, Ed=20 Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com&g= t;=20 wrote:=20
Hi Mark,
 
I looked into installing the same kind of = system early=20 on, but did not.  I came to the conclusion (that for me and my = type of=20 flying) that this system added no safety factor for me that running = both=20 pumps on take off and landing did not do.
 
  If the "automatic" system failed to = turn on=20 your second pump (sensor failure, wiring failure, relay failure, = etc), you=20 could spend precious seconds figuring out what is wrong and hitting = your=20 manual override - I presume it does have that.  I would assume = it also=20 has some means of letting you know that a pump has failed, warning = light?=20 tone?
 
I always take off and land with both EFI = high pressure=20 pumps (and boost pump) running.  Once at cruise altitude I = switch one=20 EFI and the boost pump off.  If pump failure should happen = in that=20 regime of flight, I have plenty of time to observe the decreasing = fuel=20 pressure and/or stuttering engine and switch on the other pump.=20
 
Not knocking that set up ( if designed and = implemented=20 well), but I have a dislike of having anything critical being = automatically=20 done for me - I'd rather do it myself.  I never like talking = cars=20 either {:>)
 
Ed
 
----- Original Message -----
From: = Mark = Steitle
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, = 2007 4:24=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = FUEL SYSTEM=20 PRESSURE

 
Dave,
You've got much more actual experience than I do, but I set = my system=20 up like the Eggenfellner guys do.  They use a pressure=20 sensor coupled to a relay to monitor the fuel=20 pressures.  The relay automatically turns on the = second efi=20 pump if the pressure drops below a certain limit = (determined by=20 the pressure sensor).  That way the engine won't falter, = skip, run=20 lean, etc. due to low fuel pressures. 
 
The good thing about an efi system such as you have described = is the=20 fuel in the fuel rails is always cool.  Hot starts should be = a=20 non-issue. 
 
Mark S.
 
=
 

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