X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from zproxy.gmail.com ([64.233.162.196] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3.4) with ESMTP id 1003101 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 14:30:32 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.233.162.196; envelope-from=wdleonard@gmail.com Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 34so1744944nzf for ; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:29:45 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=WHv6zvIx1GpOgf5mPFRkvTUOkKUxWFXCdQXbwySy08Jqb2hXPE/WyQUXSOyai9eS7uu8/rEzxq2vbyz0NjF2Lwcfmi8d0qbmM7tqqp3dubQnLV60p1V9zpjOt9tqu+JQOuHbedoPt9XrRdWOAf1BmOARarMVkeU8We4C/tfZJhg= Received: by 10.36.19.20 with SMTP id 20mr4599508nzs; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.9.4 with HTTP; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:29:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1c23473f050615112955d8a728@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 11:29:44 -0700 From: David Leonard Reply-To: David Leonard To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: Re: EFIS lite G3 In-Reply-To: <000001c570eb$1a2fe8a0$6101a8c0@rd> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_3945_6936851.1118860184327" References: <1c23473f050613204378b42584@mail.gmail.com> <000001c570eb$1a2fe8a0$6101a8c0@rd> ------=_Part_3945_6936851.1118860184327 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Mornin Dave, =20 Hello Rusty,=20 Thanks for the explanation. I'm not instrument rated, and don't plan to= =20 be, unless maybe it becomes real easy to install enough stuff to make the= =20 plane capable. Even then, I don't really care to do much flying in clouds,= =20 particularly with an experimental engine.=20 Technically, with just the G3, a T&B, a nav/com & transponder you have wha= t=20 is required for IFR. Of course you would want some sort of back-up for the= =20 G3. I use the rockymountain micro-encoder and a electric horizon. I just go= t=20 my instrument rating (in my RV), and have already made plenty of use of it= =20 getting in and out of the marine layer that so often hangs over San Diego. = I=20 much prefer not to be in the clouds, but it sure is nice to have the abilit= y=20 to pop through a layer if you want to/need to. As for the G3 though, my impression is that you're still very happy with= =20 it, despite the limited moving map. Is that a correct impression? Do they= =20 plan to improve the map? If so, do you expect that a unit purchased today= =20 would be able to update to the new map easily? =20 Yes,yes, and yes. VERY happy with the G3. They have just posted a new=20 data-base that fixes 1/2 the problems with the moving map, but the other 1/= 2=20 of the problem is the hardware. The screen is just not designed to be a=20 moving map. It is not big enough either, nor does it have the resolution.= =20 That being said, if you are looking at the moving map on the G3 you are=20 wasting 95% of its more useful functions. Besides, it is less than optimal= =20 to be switching between screens. Clearly, even for VFR it is better to have= =20 a separate moving map. The the availability of quality hand held moving map= s=20 that do not cost very much, this is really a non-issue. If you wanted to have 2 G3's for IFR redundancy of the gyros, you could us= e=20 one as the moving map most of the time. With the new software upgrades (and= =20 more to come), the map is acceptable but will never be as good as some of= =20 the hand-helds. (except for the better vis) I looked at a D10A the other day, and it was sweet. The only thing I had= =20 against it was that it was a little dim in bright sunlight maybe. I=20 understand the G3 is probably brighter, and it certainly has more features.= =20 Much brighter. It laughs at full direct sunlight. You never even notice= =20 when in the sun. At night you have to turn the brightness down to 5% of the= =20 daytime amount..=20 Another question, are there any remote electronics boxes to install, such= =20 as a compass sensor? I know the D10A can be standalone, but has a compass= =20 module available in cases where there is too much interference at the panel= =20 location. They also use the compass module as the input for OAT, so if you= =20 want OAT, you need the box. By the time you add that stuff up, you close th= e=20 gap in price, plus have the hassle of installing that extra stuff. Still,= =20 the D10A doesn't have as many features.=20 It comes with an external compass module included. I bulit a small mount= =20 in the tail cone and attached it with 2-sided tape. Took about an hour for= =20 me to make and install. No internal compass so if you want Mag. info you=20 have to attach it. However, if the compass is not attached it will still=20 display GPS course in the HSI that is slaved to the gyro... you just have t= o=20 me moving. All the other attitude data works fine without the compass. You also need to install an included OAT sensor (if you want TAS), and the= =20 GPS antenna if you want. And of course pitot/static (very nice easy=20 disconnect connectors). No other external box. Go For it :-) --=20 Dave Leonard Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html http://members.aol.com/vp4skydoc/index.html ------=_Part_3945_6936851.1118860184327 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline

 

 

Mornin Dave,

 

Hello Rusty,

 

 

Thanks for the explanation. = I'm not instrument rated, and don't plan to be, unless maybe it becomes&nbs= p;real easy to install enough stuff to make the plane capable.  &= nbsp;Even then, I don't really care to do much flying in clouds, particular= ly with an experimental engine.  

 

Technically, with just the G3, a T&= amp;B, a nav/com & transponder you have what is required for = IFR.  Of course you would want some sort of back-up for the G3.  = I use the rockymountain micro-encoder and a electric horizon.  I just = got my instrument rating (in my RV), and have already made plenty of use of= it getting in and out of the marine layer that so often hangs over San Die= go.  I much prefer not to be in the clouds, but it sure is nice to hav= e the ability to pop through a layer if you want to/need to.

 

 

As for the G3 though, m= y impression is that you're still very happy with it, despite the limited m= oving map.  Is that a correct impression?  Do they plan= to improve the map?  If so, do you expect that a unit = purchased today would be able to update to the new map easily?

 

Yes,yes, and yes.  VERY happy with = the G3.  They have just posted a new data-base that fixes 1/2 the prob= lems with the moving map, but the other 1/2 of the problem is the hardware.=   The screen is just not designed to be a moving map.  It is not = big enough either, nor does it have the resolution.  That being said, = if you are looking at the moving map on the G3 you are wasting 95% of its m= ore useful functions.  Besides, it is less than optimal to be switchin= g between screens.  Clearly, even for VFR it is better to have a separ= ate moving map.  The the availability of quality hand held moving maps= that do not cost very much, this is really a non-issue.

 

If you wanted to have 2 G3's for IFR red= undancy of the gyros, you could use one as the moving map most of the time.=   With the new software upgrades (and more to come), the map is accept= able but will never be as good as some of the hand-helds. (except for the b= etter vis)

 

 

I looked at a D10A the other= day, and it was sweet.  The only thing I had against it was that= it was a little dim in bright sunlight maybe.  I understand the G3 is= probably brighter, and it certainly has more features.  

 

 

Much brighter.  It laughs at full d= irect sunlight.  You never even notice when in the sun.  At night= you have to turn the brightness down to 5% of the daytime amount.. 

 

Another question, are there&= nbsp;any remote electronics boxes to install, such as a compass sensor?&nbs= p; I know the D10A can be standalone, but has a compass module availab= le in cases where there is too much interference at the panel loc= ation.  They also use the compass module as the input for OAT, so if y= ou want OAT, you need the box.  By the time you add that stuff up= , you close the gap in price, plus have the hassle of installing that extra= stuff.  Still, the D10A doesn't have as many features.  

 

 

It comes with an external compass module= included.  I bulit a small mount in the tail cone and attached it wit= h 2-sided tape.  Took about an hour for me to make and install.  = No internal compass so if you want Mag. info you have to attach it.  H= owever, if the compass is not attached it will still display GPS course in = the HSI that is slaved to the gyro... you just have to me moving.  All= the other attitude data works fine without the compass.

 

You also need to install an included OAT= sensor (if you want TAS), and the GPS antenna if you want.  And of co= urse pitot/static (very nice easy disconnect connectors).  No other ex= ternal box.

 

Go For it  :-)
--
Dave Leona= rd
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html<= /a>
http://members.aol.= com/vp4skydoc/index.html

 

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