X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [199.185.220.224] (HELO priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c5) with ESMTP id 952399 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 21 May 2005 20:55:36 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=199.185.220.224; envelope-from=haywire@telus.net Received: from Endurance ([205.250.241.163]) by priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.6.01.04.04 201-2131-118-104-20050224) with SMTP id <20050522005448.ZNIH6715.priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net@Endurance> for ; Sat, 21 May 2005 18:54:48 -0600 From: "Todd Bartrim" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Crash investigation Date: Sat, 21 May 2005 17:54:29 -0700 Message-ID: <001e01c55e68$cf5f82c0$0101a8c0@Endurance> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001F_01C55E2E.23053EA0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C55E2E.23053EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi David; I think you've got a heck of a good idea there, I just hope that the organization never has anything to do. While the FAA or Transport Canada may not want outsiders doing their investigations, it is clear that they have little interest in fully investigating an accident cause and are satisfied with filling in the blanks. While I don't feel I may be fully qualified for this task, I realize that at least in this part of Canada, I may be a contender for the job, which I hope to be never called upon to do. So how would we go about setting up an organization with official status that would be taken seriously by the bureaucrats? Another thought that I'd like to add; If this ever happened to me, I'd like to have some legal statement in place instructing Transport Canada to allow one of our community to participate in the investigation or at the very least (if nobody is able to travel this far north:-), release any data from the long-hoped-for and much-begged-for, EM2 datalogger if it ever becomes a reality. That would probably carry more weight than any quasi-official organization and is something that we can each take care of now. We don't want to think of it happening to us, but it's much the same as the organ donor card, can't deal with it when were dead. I'd like to think that if my number was up, at least some good could come from it. I believe there was a lawyer in the group? Any opinion on the legal aspect of this. Would this simply be ignored by the feds until the investigation had concluded? In any case, I'm going down to tell the wife right now what my wishes are, so at least there is a verbal statement from me that I'd want you guys involved. Not that I'm planning on giving you something to do :-) Todd Bartrim RV9Endurance 13B Turbo Rotary C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard work and determination to the things they do." My suggestion is that WE.. the rotary community.. need to incorporate and establish ourselves.. just like any other type-club. We need to establish ourselves as a bonafide entity, with qualified individuals who are 1) intelligent 2) educated 3) detail oriented 4) OBJECTIVE and 5) able to drop what they are doing for 3 or 4 days and travel on their own nickel to perform a role similar to what Paul did. Hell.. even INCLUDE him.. but make sure the "go team" aspect of this organization is able to focus on the FACTS of the situation and not draw premature conclusions. We would need to petition the NTSB and FAA to make them acutely aware at the regional level in EACH region that we have representatives on hand to assist with investigations of rotary powered aircraft. WE would be the experts on wether something was acceptable or not (oil premix, for instance) in the rotary community, and would be able to render input to the board reps/investigators but we would have to be able to BACK IT UP WITH FACTS in any case. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C55E2E.23053EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi=20 David;
    I think you've got a heck of a good idea there, = I just hope=20 that the organization never has anything to do. While the FAA or = Transport=20 Canada may not want outsiders doing their investigations, it is clear = that they=20 have little interest in fully investigating an accident cause and are = satisfied=20 with filling in the blanks. While I don't feel I may be fully qualified = for this=20 task, I realize that at least in this part of Canada, I may be a = contender for=20 the job, which I hope to be never called upon to do. So how would we=20 go about setting up an organization with official status that would be = taken=20 seriously by the bureaucrats?
    Another thought that I'd like to add; If this = ever happened=20 to me, I'd like to have some legal statement in place instructing = Transport=20 Canada to allow one of our community to participate in the = investigation or=20 at the very least (if nobody is able to travel this far north:-), = release any=20 data from the long-hoped-for and much-begged-for, EM2 datalogger if it = ever=20 becomes a reality. That would probably carry more weight than any = quasi-official=20 organization and is something that we can each take care of now. We = don't want=20 to think of it happening to us, but it's much the same as the organ = donor card,=20 can't deal with it when were dead. I'd like to think that if my number = was up,=20 at least some good could come from it.
    I believe there was a lawyer in the group? Any = opinion on=20 the legal aspect of this. Would this simply be ignored by the feds until = the=20 investigation had concluded? In any case, I'm going down to tell the = wife right=20 now what my wishes are, so at least there is a verbal statement from me = that I'd=20 want you guys involved. Not that I'm planning on giving you something to = do=20 :-)
Todd Bartrim
 
RV9Endurance
13B Turbo Rotary
C-FSTB
http://www3.telus.= net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
 
          &nbs= p; =20 "The world will always have a place for those that bring hard work and=20 determination to the things they do."

My suggestion is that = WE.. the=20 rotary community.. need to incorporate and establish ourselves.. just = like any=20 other type-club. We need to establish ourselves as a bonafide entity, = with=20 qualified individuals who are 1) intelligent 2) educated 3) detail = oriented 4)=20 OBJECTIVE and 5) able to drop what they are doing for 3 or 4 days and = travel=20 on their own nickel to perform a role similar to what Paul did. Hell.. = even=20 INCLUDE him.. but make sure the "go team" aspect of this organization = is able=20 to focus on the FACTS of the situation and not draw premature = conclusions. We=20 would need to petition the NTSB and FAA to make them acutely aware at = the=20 regional level in EACH region that we have representatives on hand to = assist=20 with investigations of rotary powered aircraft. WE would be the = experts on=20 wether something was acceptable or not (oil premix, for instance) in = the=20 rotary community, and would be able to render input to the board=20 reps/investigators but we would have to be able to BACK IT UP WITH = FACTS in=20 any case.  
 
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