X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 08 Sep 2010 11:48:43 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from [205.186.160.203] (HELO server.rmcginc.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.9) with ESMTPS id 4458805 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 07 Sep 2010 22:47:56 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.186.160.203; envelope-from=r.rickard@rcginc-us.com Received: (qmail 26282 invoked from network); 7 Sep 2010 19:47:19 -0700 Received: from ip24-56-41-43.ph.ph.cox.net (HELO ?192.168.1.101?) (24.56.41.43) by rmcomserver.com with SMTP; 7 Sep 2010 19:47:19 -0700 X-Original-Message-Id: <89CFE3BC-4052-4069-827F-B319B2842B3F@rcginc-us.com> From: Bob Rickard X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-1-664160010 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: iPad Mail (7B500) Mime-Version: 1.0 (iPad Mail 7B500) Subject: Re: [LML] Re: ThermaWing Deice installed on Lacair IVP (N213LB) X-Original-Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2010 19:47:17 -0700 References: --Apple-Mail-1-664160010 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Nothing at all against Mark and the gang at RDD, but I had the = thermawing system DE-modded from my aircraft. 3 main problems- one, it = never worked reliably. I even took the airplane and left it with them = for a weekend and it only worked once. Secondly, even if the system = works, it does not protect the air intake (critical for = MAP/pressurization) and you cant stay up high even with clean wings. = Third, and most importantly, the starter drive adapter and pulley = mounted on the back side of the motor (TSIO 550E) that is used to power = the system or the ac compressor (we tried both configurations) would not = last long before failing. In the year and a half the system was on my = airplane we went thru 3 starter drive adapters. Once, on a night flight = from Phoenix to St. Louis, the adapter failed and oil started leaking = profusely. I had no cockpit indications. Luckily, it failed near = landing because I only lost about a quart in flight and another on the = ground. But if it had failed a couple of hours earlier in the = flight.....you can imagine the rest. In the end, I decided I needed a = good starter drive adapter ALL of the time, and deice protection about = 2% of the time, or never if I make good airmanship decisions. Not to = mention I got about 8-15 knots back in airspeed depending on cruise alt. Maybe I just had a bad batch of starter drive adapters, maybe not. But = the TCM guys will blame the deice system, and the deice boys will say = it's a bad design on the motor side. Bottom line is- you lose either = way. If you are putting the system on a different motor, this may be = irrelevant information, but talk thru this topic when deciding to mount = something on the back of a 550.=20 Having said all of this, when the system did work ( I actually saw it 2 = times in 18 months), it certainly rid the leading edges of ice....=20 Bob Rickard IV-P N619SJ=20 On Sep 7, 2010, at 6:48 PM, Jack Cowell wrote: > Mark Mahnke and his crew in Redmond installed the Therma-Wing system = on my IVP several years ago. After some teething problems, its function = as a get-out-of-trouble device has worked as claimed. Article on the = system and installation in KitPlanes in 2008. > =20 >=20 > =20 > On Tue, Sep 7, 2010 at 10:48 AM, Jeffrey Liegner, MD = wrote: >=20 > I saw a small blurb in AOPA magazine (Aug 2010, p 14) about the Kelly = Aerospace ThermaWing installed onto a Lancair IVP, N213LB. >=20 > http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/N213LB.html >=20 > http://www.kellyaerospace.com/thermawing.html >=20 > Anyone have details to share? >=20 > Jeff L > New Jersey > LIVP >=20 >=20 > http://www.kellyaerospace.com/faq_KATS.html >=20 > -- > For archives and unsub = http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html >=20 --Apple-Mail-1-664160010 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Nothing at all against Mark and the = gang at RDD, but I had the thermawing system DE-modded from my aircraft. =  3 main problems- one, it never worked reliably.  I even took = the airplane and left it with them for a weekend and it only worked = once.  Secondly, even if the system works, it does not protect the = air intake (critical for MAP/pressurization) and you cant stay up high = even with clean wings.  Third, and most importantly, the starter = drive adapter and pulley mounted on the back side of the motor (TSIO = 550E) that is used to power the system or the ac compressor (we tried = both configurations) would not last long before failing.  In the = year and a half the system was on my airplane we went thru 3 starter = drive adapters.  Once, on a night flight from Phoenix to St. Louis, = the adapter failed and oil started leaking profusely.  I had no = cockpit indications.  Luckily, it failed near landing because I = only lost about a quart in flight and another on the ground.  But = if it had failed a couple of hours earlier in the flight.....you can = imagine the rest.  In the end, I decided I needed a good starter = drive adapter ALL of the time, and deice protection about 2% of the = time, or never if I make good airmanship decisions.  Not to mention = I got about 8-15 knots back in airspeed depending on cruise = alt.

Maybe I just had a bad batch of starter = drive adapters, maybe not.  But the TCM guys will blame the deice = system, and the deice boys will say it's a bad design on the motor side. =  Bottom line is- you lose either way.

If = you are putting the system on a different motor, this may be irrelevant = information, but talk thru this topic when deciding to mount something = on the back of a 550. 

Having said all of = this, when the system did work ( I actually saw it 2 times in 18 = months), it certainly rid the leading edges of = ice.... 

Bob Rickard
IV-P =  N619SJ 



On Sep 7, 2010, at 6:48 PM, = Jack Cowell <jfcowell@gmail.com> = wrote:

Mark = Mahnke and his crew in Redmond installed the Therma-Wing system on my = IVP several years ago. After some teething problems, its function as a = get-out-of-trouble device has worked as claimed.  Article on = the system and installation in KitPlanes in 2008.
 

 
On Tue, Sep 7, 2010 at 10:48 AM, Jeffrey = Liegner, MD <liegner@embarqmail.com><= /span> wrote:

I saw a small blurb = in AOPA magazine (Aug 2010, p 14) about the Kelly Aerospace ThermaWing = installed onto a Lancair IVP, N213LB.

http://www.airpo= rt-data.com/aircraft/N213LB.html

http://www.kellyaer= ospace.com/thermawing.html

Anyone have details to share?

Jeff L
New = Jersey
LIVP


http://www.kellyaeros= pace.com/faq_KATS.html

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