X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 21:52:24 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.89.70] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.3) with ESMTP id 2926220 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sat, 17 May 2008 09:00:32 -0400 Received-SPF: neutral receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.86.89.70; envelope-from=mnewman@dragonnorth.com Received: from [70.91.142.49] (helo=PCMIKE3) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1JxM0w-0002dL-A6 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sat, 17 May 2008 08:59:54 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Michael Newman" X-Original-To: "'Lancair Mailing List'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Optimum Bank for return to Airport turn X-Original-Date: Sat, 17 May 2008 08:59:20 -0400 Organization: Dragonnorth Group X-Original-Message-ID: <025501c8b81d$d2e207d0$78a61770$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: Aci4BOTquZuhW4+cTe6+0hEKmPGFdQAFoIqQ Content-Language: en-us x-cr-hashedpuzzle: ACGR AL1h AlBm A5KO D92i EfuB FHAk GH8J GT5Y GmAq GyX3 G6DQ HD1D HZHw IQxr I0sb;1;bABtAGwAQABsAGEAbgBjAGEAaQByAG8AbgBsAGkAbgBlAC4AbgBlAHQA;Sosha1_v1;7;{87A0DF39-24C0-4C5C-9036-789AAE74EAD0};bQBuAGUAdwBtAGEAbgBAAGQAcgBhAGcAbwBuAG4AbwByAHQAaAAuAGMAbwBtAA==;Sat, 17 May 2008 12:59:18 GMT;TwBwAHQAaQBtAHUAbQAgAEIAYQBuAGsAIABmAG8AcgAgAHIAZQB0AHUAcgBuACAAdABvACAAQQBpAHIAcABvAHIAdAAgAHQAdQByAG4A x-cr-puzzleid: {87A0DF39-24C0-4C5C-9036-789AAE74EAD0} X-ELNK-Trace: 4981850a937e3365551c28c27865cf0a239a348a220c2609ef7501f05740981a39b87a810f1006ae548b785378294e88350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 70.91.142.49 When turning back to the airport after an engine failure (rope break for glider pilots like me) there is an optimum bank angle. Perhaps someone can enhance the race turns.xls spreadsheet with the correct formula for height lost in the turn. Sink rate increases with G load (bank angle) increasing height lost per second. Rate of turn increases with bank angle and thus a decrease in time in the turn and total height lost for a 180 degree turn. The optimum does occur about 45 degrees. The penalty for steeper bank (up to 60 degrees) is small. At coordinated steeper banks there is actually little risk of stall spin, you don't have enough elevator. When we train glider pilots for rope breaks we teach them to lower the nose, keep the 'ball centered', and to use a very steep bank. My pre-solo glider students are all taught a rope break at 200 feet (an impossible height for our Lancairs). One surprising observation is that once you accomplish the emergency course reversal during which you are desperate about being too low you are high for a normal landing on the runway. The more wind the worse this situation gets.