X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 11:24:21 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.89.70] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.2) with ESMTP id 1544452 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 10:18:37 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.86.89.70; envelope-from=rtitsworth@mindspring.com DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=YhUszUKlIPOEq8WWSvGoBl1uGlaUxoNgZU9AlKlh4warSNMa0DyfJcp1E75cb6NC; h=Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Mailer:x-mimeole:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.125.111] (helo=RDTVAIO) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Ghozt-0005DR-FZ for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 10:05:50 -0500 From: "rtitsworth" X-Original-To: "'Lancair Mailing List'" Subject: RE: [LML] Re: Lancair down in Georgia X-Original-Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 10:04:02 -0500 X-Original-Message-ID: <003401c70347$3583f430$84affea9@RDTVAIO> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0035_01C7031D.4CADEC30" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Thread-Index: AccC7iDaQYNd19j0Q9mQpwD9BiFHrQAVaaYw In-Reply-To: X-ELNK-Trace: b17f11247b2ac8f0a79dc4b33984cbaa0a9da525759e2654e6bcab1dfa98624cf307d8b51e5a5f7110da127345fe7d85350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.125.111 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C7031D.4CADEC30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0036_01C7031D.4CADEC30" ------=_NextPart_001_0036_01C7031D.4CADEC30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's always sensitive to speculate without full data/insight. However, one might "guess" that the initial rapid descent (dive) was to get down to high/normal pressure air, being the cabin would de-pressurize without bleed air??? I'm also guessing that the speeds shown are ground speed (raw radar speed)? Even without any wind, IAS at altitude would be somewhat less (~30% less at 20,000ft). I'm not sure exactly how accurate the radar is, which would effect the accuracy of speed shown/calculated between radar returns, but the "37" @ 4400ft would seem to be a problem (unless there was a huge headwind or perhaps a sharp turn such that 37 was a inferred speed based on straight line distance between radar returns rather than the actual flight path of a 180 turn - i.e. the "calculated" speed of a large circle could be zero). Rick _____ From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of colyncase on earthlink Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 11:26 PM To: Lancair Mailing List Subject: [LML] Re: Lancair down in Georgia from flight aware looks like power loss happened about 12:23 at 21000 initial descent rate > 3000fpm not sure if anything after 12:31 is valid I had always hoped for -600fpm/120 knots prop at full feather if I encountered this situation. That would have been good for 32 minutes and 64 nm. I wonder what else was going on. If these are decimal lat/long the sequence starts over DNN and ends 3.1nm further north. I must have something wrong. 12:22PM 34.72 -84.85 280 21000 12:23PM 34.68 -84.87 197 21000 12:24PM 34.68 -84.95 156 16400 descending 12:25PM 34.73 -84.98 234 14000 descending 12:25PM 34.73 -85.00 143 14200 climbing 12:26PM 34.78 -84.95 129 11700 descending 12:27PM 34.82 -84.88 134 9800 descending 12:28PM 34.83 -84.83 154 7700 descending 12:29PM 34.85 -84.83 177 6700 descending 12:29PM 34.87 -84.85 97 6300 descending 12:30PM 34.85 -84.88 37 4400 descending 12:31PM 34.82 -84.88 55 2700 descending 12:32PM 34.78 -84.88 97 2500 descending 12:32PM 34.78 -84.88 80 1300 descending 12:36PM 34.78 -84.88 97 2500 climbing 12:41PM 34.78 -84.88 97 2500 12:44PM 34.78 -84.88 97 2500 ------=_NextPart_001_0036_01C7031D.4CADEC30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

It’s always sensitive to = speculate without full data/insight.  However, one might “guess” = that the initial rapid descent (dive) was to get down to high/normal pressure = air, being the cabin would de-pressurize without bleed = air???

 

I’m also guessing that the = speeds shown are ground speed (raw radar speed)?  Even without any wind, = IAS at altitude would be somewhat less (~30% less at = 20,000ft).

 

I’m not sure exactly how = accurate the radar is, which would effect the accuracy of speed shown/calculated = between radar returns, but the “37” @ 4400ft would seem to be a = problem (unless there was a huge headwind or perhaps a sharp turn such that 37 = was a inferred speed based on straight line distance between radar returns rather than = the actual flight path of a 180 turn – i.e. the = “calculated” speed of a large circle could be zero).

 

Rick

 

From: = Lancair Mailing List = [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of colyncase on = earthlink
Sent: Tuesday, November = 07, 2006 11:26 PM
To: Lancair Mailing List
Subject: [LML] Re: = Lancair down in Georgia

 

from flight aware

looks like power loss happened about 12:23 at = 21000

initial descent rate > = 3000fpm

not sure if anything after 12:31 is = valid

 

I had always hoped for -600fpm/120 knots prop at full feather if

I encountered this situation.   That would = have been good for 32

minutes and 64 nm.   I wonder what else was = going on.

 

If these are decimal lat/long the sequence starts = over DNN

and ends 3.1nm further north.   I must have something wrong.

 

12:22PM

34.72

-84.85

280

21000

12:23PM

34.68

-84.87

197

21000

12:24PM

34.68

-84.95

156

16400 3Ddescending

12:25PM

34.73

-84.98

234

14000 3Ddescending

12:25PM

34.73

-85.00

143

14200 3Dclimbing

12:26PM

34.78

-84.95

129

11700 3Ddescending

12:27PM

34.82

-84.88

134

9800 3Ddescending

12:28PM

34.83

-84.83

154

7700 3Ddescending

12:29PM

34.85

-84.83

177

6700 3Ddescending

12:29PM

34.87

-84.85

97

6300 3Ddescending

12:30PM

34.85

-84.88

37

4400 3Ddescending

12:31PM

34.82

-84.88

55

2700 3Ddescending

12:32PM

34.78

-84.88

97

2500 3Ddescending

12:32PM

34.78

-84.88

80

1300 3Ddescending

12:36PM

34.78

-84.88

97

2500 3Dclimbing

12:41PM

34.78

-84.88

97

2500

12:44PM

34.78

-84.88

97

2500

 

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