X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=Cs7BjUwD c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=zH84+iQVYCMqht19D97Ieg==:117 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=Cs6MGpLMSVwA:10 a=3JhidrIBZZsA:10 a=A9eoELD5AAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=7g1VtSJxAAAA:8 a=hcmNMweX55k7ceuXC_cA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=KJFYFJxGBmYA:10 a=Qa1je4BO31QA:10 a=gvSQh4r-fQ0A:10 a=nuYH9IAO2NritQ7XZZ8A:9 a=lDNl2lIEhZKvKMjIUR5gOGDH5rM=:19 a=YFwTN1oyYYpaMDF1:21 a=6Wz-K7ujeLwSwgrTWX1j:22 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=grOzbf7U_OpcSX4AJOnl:22 From: "Max maxfly55@gmail.com" Received: from mail-oi1-f180.google.com ([209.85.167.180] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.10) with ESMTPS id 12133821 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 20 Jan 2019 10:35:41 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.167.180; envelope-from=maxfly55@gmail.com Received: by mail-oi1-f180.google.com with SMTP id x23so12698566oix.3 for ; Sun, 20 Jan 2019 07:35:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=wovJ+HP4SGDvRCrJqzYC9DCA4HrTbZvV0gINUVgHJG8=; b=iWzM+Yl1AVK3kHfdyxhxGj5cwjpbSWoNSiPxXF1Zj0y9/O4AzAxdxuRYiy5O0My6BD 0mHMODHEy1Cm0J6pWow2pl6XJOFKDD7gw3cF7AF4X7YlrfJ45qdS+zJjmbl9ZWCfKiGi Ol98QkSLZJAfRDHFEnaw+BmZLjaGE+Hy/Vw7AV7n6OSfHoZGxfqiUak/1Mofjd9oQhf0 m4g5F2HTWr9AKdDoHcgEVWkURMGji4HKclz+JNMZHpSiD9vyki7QjN5pspDFFiaGP0DN 2QOOy29gZ8ryL63U5aMruH+/GxubQTGh0rl/FEXp5H38oGhQYv3U705/2upaO7Rn871n FEmg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=wovJ+HP4SGDvRCrJqzYC9DCA4HrTbZvV0gINUVgHJG8=; b=K6CzUaENoKvvvTUPCNbYPILyPKzz+9NVS2Qz0q16cIySIJc1rvMzvvNg6H4/OgCyVP SxY//HbUBXAHA5Vd2o4fZKJlR+OEmpJ+iaruF8AfeE5/2Cf8NTIweGSr7Do9pv8zNLmU TubuDmVvPxzzXcgx5A9d0PYK4m2xFUseS659PItocHkajOcZHTn7fhnHE1/TKQO7PVKZ 0B6s97IkGVuL1poxdlDjsR7UbEVPC/yN3mZwgv/g2m4G6QV8gAIfNUyWJuzWWBYNryRG HUcEJln0JhjWLC3XLxbpvStmIqut+nxSZitiPm69aVKhONBl9D/IJPUMalswuMLBYyEM N7gA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJcUukdUkFpJweMpb0LjaGL7QkinaQal3AHrY/s9rhWy5LPatKBszQkE jKlH5itrXvkwrw8vS75e0Fi4bPlWfxwejwTv2HGyTA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ALg8bN6qTUqtmBQQsgYTZsS8ISbo58E1sG5drnd7Oe1VsMLnP1NQHpFxXtXItZ4wxxQznHf1oNKNoFXoGkREXXce0kk= X-Received: by 2002:aca:5a06:: with SMTP id o6mr3506218oib.341.1547998524633; Sun, 20 Jan 2019 07:35:24 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2019 10:35:12 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Please take my Dad, Thomas Phy off of this list. To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002c7666057fe57e94" --0000000000002c7666057fe57e94 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you for letting me know. My Dad passed away in July (2018) aneesa's i'm just trying to go through his emails to keep only the essential items necessary. On Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 9:58 AM Nigel Baker nigel@limbachaustralia.com < flyrotary@lancaironline.net wrote: > It=E2=80=99s a self-serve situation. > > Your Dad put himself on the list and can get off anytime he wants. > > Go to the source =E2=80=9CRotary motors in aircraft=E2=80=9D flyrotary@la= ncaironline.net > and follow the navigation. > > Cheers. > > Nige. > > > > > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Sent:* Friday, January 18, 2019 1:18 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: gearbox drain > > > > Hello, > > > > Please take my Dad, Thomas Phy maxfly55@gmail.com, off of this and all > email lists. > > > > Thank You, > > > > Liz Finch > > > > On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 11:58 AM Steven W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > > Tracy and Neil, > > > > I installed a -4 fitting at the top of both the -C drive and also the -A > drive that I converted to 3.17 to one ratio. At idle with oil at about 5= 0 > degrees, a gauge connected to that top fitting read about 4 psi inside th= e > gearbox. With oil at about 180 degrees, the gauge read about 2 psi. The= 2 > psi was unchanged when the engine rpm was increased to 5000. Both > gearboxes behaved the same. > > > > I also installed a ball valve in the -6 drain line that I could close > immediately after shutting the engine off. Then I could disconnect the > drain line and collect the oil that was inside the gearbox. The converte= d > -A drive with a 3 pinion planetary contained 22 oz of oil after shutdown > while the -C drive with the 6 pinion planetary contained 18 oz of oil. > This was with the top fitting dead ended to the gauge and not venting > anything during operation. > > > > The oil flow rate from the prop end of the gearbox was found to be about > 1/4 oz per minute while the total oil flow rate through the gearbox was > found to be about 90 oz per minute. This explains why installing separat= e > -6 drain lines to the engine did not change the behavior. During the flo= w > rate measurement, the oil draining from the gearbox just after starting t= he > engine had a lot of entrained air for a short time. > > > > So the conclusion is that the gearboxes are completely filled with oil > during operation and any air initially inside them is entrained in the oi= l > and forced out the drain by the incoming oil. The gearbox recommendatio= ns > that I could find do not recommend running with the components completely > submerged due to the power consumed by churning the oil and resultant > generation of heat. Those sources also say that if the gearbox is > partially filled with oil but the level is too high, the oil will foam an= d > lubrication will be degraded if the system circulates the oil using an > external pump. In our case, it may be better to accept the power loss an= d > extra heat as opposed to returning a lot of aerated oil to the engine. > > > > An impeller was added to the planet carrier of the converted -A drive but > that gearbox still operated completely filled with oil. > > > > The gearbox drain and the engine drain connection were increased to 1/2" > NPT and fittings drilled out to 21/32" ID were installed. 3/4" ID hose w= as > installed as the drain line. The drain line was close to level but > slightly down hill in operation. This reduced the gearbox internal > pressure to a value not measurable with a normal gauge. The amount of oi= l > inside the gearbox was measured by clamping off the drain hose immediatel= y > after shutting down the engine, disconnecting the hose from the engine, a= nd > then recovering the oil remaining inside the gearbox. The gearbox was > found to be completely filled with oil just as before. > > > > When the -4 fitting in the top of the gearbox was connected to the engine > crankcase as a vent, the amount of oil recovered from the gearbox after > operation was now found to be about 5 to 6 oz. The recovered oil did not > appear to be foamed and its volume changed very little upon standing for > several hours. > > > Steve Boese > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > > > > -- > > *Thomas Phy* > > *President* > > *EAA Chapter 1345* > > *Bend OR.* > > > > *Classic Construction of Bend LLC* > > *CCB# 195733* > > *541-306-1500* > > > --0000000000002c7666057fe57e94 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you for letting me know. My Dad passed away in July= (2018) aneesa's i'm just trying to go through his emails to keep o= nly the essential items necessary.=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 9:58 AM Nigel Baker nigel@limbachaustralia.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net wro= te:

It=E2=80=99s a self-serve situation.

Your Dad put himself on the list and can get off anytime= he wants.

Go to the source =E2=80= =9CRotary motors in aircraft=E2=80=9D flyrotary@lancaironline.net<= /a> and follow the navigation.

Chee= rs.

Nige.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=

From: Rotary motors in aircraft &l= t;flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Friday, Jan= uary 18, 2019 1:18 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: ge= arbox drain

=C2=A0

Hello,

=C2=A0

Please take my Dad, Thomas Phy maxfly55@gmail.com= , off of this and all email lists.

<= p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0

Thank You,

=C2=A0

Liz Finch<= /u>

=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 11:58 AM Stev= en W. Boese SBoese@uwyo.edu <flyrotary@lancaironline.net&g= t; wrote:

Tracy and Neil,<= /p>

=C2=A0

I installed a -4 fitting at the top of both the -C drive and also t= he -A drive that I converted to 3.17 to one ratio.=C2=A0 At idle with oil a= t about 50 degrees, a gauge connected to that top fitting read about 4 psi = inside the gearbox.=C2=A0 With oil at about 180 degrees, the gauge read abo= ut 2 psi.=C2=A0 The 2 psi was unchanged when the engine rpm was increased t= o 5000.=C2=A0 Both gearboxes behaved the same.

<= span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0

=

I also installed a ball val= ve in the -6 drain line that I could close immediately after shutting the e= ngine off.=C2=A0 Then I could disconnect the drain line and collect the oil= that was inside the gearbox.=C2=A0 The converted -A drive with a 3 pinion = planetary contained 22 oz of oil after shutdown while the -C drive with the= 6 pinion planetary contained 18 oz of oil.=C2=A0 This was with the top fit= ting dead ended to the gauge and not venting anything during operation.<= /u>

=C2=A0

Th= e oil flow rate from the prop end of the gearbox was found to be about 1/4 = oz per minute while the total oil flow rate through the gearbox was found t= o be about 90 oz per minute.=C2=A0 This explains why installing separate -6= drain lines to the engine did not change the behavior.=C2=A0 During the fl= ow rate measurement, the oil draining from the gearbox just after starting = the engine had a lot of entrained air for a short time.

=C2=A0

So the conclusion = is that the gearboxes are completely filled with oil during operation and a= ny air initially inside them is entrained in the oil and forced out the dra= in by the incoming oil. =C2=A0 The gearbox recommendations that I could fin= d do not recommend running with the components completely submerged due to = the power consumed by churning the oil and resultant generation of heat.=C2= =A0 Those sources also say that if the gearbox is partially filled with oil= but the level is too high, the oil will foam and lubrication will be degra= ded if the system circulates the oil using an external pump.=C2=A0 In our c= ase, it may be better to accept the power loss and extra heat as opposed to= returning a lot of aerated oil to the engine.

<= span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0

=

An impeller was added to th= e planet carrier of the converted -A drive but that gearbox still operated = completely filled with oil.

=C2=A0

The gearbox drain and the engine drain connect= ion were increased to 1/2" NPT and fittings drilled out to 21/32"= ID were installed. =C2=A03/4" ID hose was installed as the drain line= .=C2=A0 The drain line was close to level but slightly down hill in operati= on.=C2=A0 This reduced=C2=A0the gearbox internal pressure to a value not me= asurable with a normal gauge.=C2=A0 The amount of oil inside the gearbox wa= s measured by clamping off the drain hose immediately after shutting down t= he engine, disconnecting the hose from the engine, and then recovering the = oil remaining inside the gearbox.=C2=A0 The gearbox was found to be complet= ely filled with oil just as before.

=C2=A0

When the -4 fitting in the top of the= gearbox was connected to the engine crankcase as a vent, =C2=A0the amount = of oil recovered from the gearbox after operation was now found to be about= 5 to 6 oz.=C2=A0 The recovered oil did not appear to be foamed and its vol= ume changed very little upon standing for several hours.

<= br>Steve Boese

=

--
Homepage:=C2=A0 http://www.flyrotary.com/<= br>Archive and UnSub:=C2=A0 =C2=A0http://m= ail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html



-- <= /u>

Thomas Phy<= /p>

President

=

EAA Chapter 1345

Bend OR.

=C2=A0

Classic Construction of Bend LLC

CCB# 195733

541-306-1500

=C2=A0

=
--0000000000002c7666057fe57e94--