X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=UschDK4B c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=lJsrbrKi/Kdh1Ege8BKFPQ==:117 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=JZygid9Izu4A:10 a=JHtHm7312UAA:10 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=UKPAHat8AAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=VzZN73YCbPk-bzWX8xEA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=xW-ziAKfGd5GdZlnPogA:9 a=pv6HgW7zKFi3SXR7:21 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=Fc6xXSS-RxGHxrvp76Qp:22 From: "Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com" Received: from mail-ot1-f43.google.com ([209.85.210.43] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.9) with ESMTPS id 11868498 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 12 Nov 2018 16:24:58 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.210.43; envelope-from=keltro@gmail.com Received: by mail-ot1-f43.google.com with SMTP id n46so9349281otb.9 for ; Mon, 12 Nov 2018 13:24:59 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=0sKA8INxMTPgYIkPF7kiL7Acb00KMq69BN+BCrtM3YA=; b=T0CMDxNsf5r6+Uba86f/5tq6tygQd1nTrECehEaDH7FXG6+140LsqIQAIAj4AZcPaQ hVmtlP2yfAc/aoICqT+k+SO9WTAMUTdEfR9tSSWtpiDvHL2/kq4TzjWGCO6PFxSbTolD XjjCNNkh7kZViuhTPCmqhwqx928QZKqgJdF6POBrUgSVr0yKNHx69N+ablg2dUcSg68q KdfkhjtTEZzkqNIElnQkR0b+RGND/N6DvugCqqWBTe9LYVJJ5YFu7jWqU6FqhY+tCK9w 56r4UQbCKFZ/q+I2aQVZgedL7VAdt5V579SbTQjvEYmtcZv+Fu7ZOaMj+6vTDEfPsmQk kyPw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=0sKA8INxMTPgYIkPF7kiL7Acb00KMq69BN+BCrtM3YA=; b=hlgLjOT36yTbLIwxXq3B/pyjKTVbClEPSRIVaToHpBxXS9EdkejlgccNNtZjA1gpCU 2jCvQ7cFiT29uvp/XXDfClzEdRX3DOVLN8ZUNr3wibHwUcIyS8KV+JzopomHECks20Tl Zuk/aLrXQvze+7JrnCxOGK/084wNSa3ZsB0hIeAqh4b3dyzWTKRfiAViylgVUZPuc+Kl P1HpQXA7EClQjuNGf/ZGjnKgeF6pJIKu7PcVMkReOrvKX0Xyjymm64WknU8h+vpLcC9i 8Z+kIef96ieSsTYInH4h4SiWPDsPf0mdFqxaF+I6TEjNxrOXbmrm9eQO+xXuTiClXqHK Y00Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AGRZ1gKPVqv/BLMbV+5kepXPT5ht5Uqe1zvuxroftzZI1WMYuaNI+CXC 9H90CNa6xhyWzWMJX2w8XPx3P0uOYNz22zUU9KRREw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AJdET5cGNiw3hlftuk5vkp0SWLy9xAA0sxCDs9i6ZoHxJ7YeKxKuhAnMuILnCBRuIZpLEzwWmNXWBIm8O6YUERxi6QI= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:2cbc:: with SMTP id p57mr1511458otb.1.1542057881876; Mon, 12 Nov 2018 13:24:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2018 15:23:15 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: 1mm thrust washer To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000045bf1f057a7e544f" --00000000000045bf1f057a7e544f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks Neil and All.........My brain is now connected with what needs to be accomplished......... Kelly Troyer On Mon, Nov 12, 2018 at 2:49 PM Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com < flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > Charlie, > > Sounds simple, but to cut the depression in the plate > accurately will take a lot of setup time. Then whatever depression you c= ut > will have to be added to the nylon snubber washer and the whole gear trai= n > will be moved backwards as well. Couls end up time consuming and very > messy IMHO. > > Neil. > > On 11/13/2018 2:53 AM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com wrote: > > Could the same effect be achieved by milling a depression in the 1/2" > plate? How thick are the thicker washers; 2 mm? If so, mill a 1mm > depression in the plate, and replace the thin 1 mm washer with a 3rd 2 mm > washer. IIRC, Locktite makes a 'stickum' that could keep the washer > embedded in the plate, so it doesn't un-nest when the shaft is unloaded. > Would this excessively compromise the strength of the plate? > > Charlie > > On 11/12/2018 7:10 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote: > > Neil, > > > > Looking good. The cup ID may need to be a few thousands over 52mm so not > sure if there=E2=80=99s room for a mounting spigot. Depending on material > thickness, the cup will fully enclose one of the 2MM bearings and part o= f > the 3.5mm thrust washer. Possibly add oil path grooves to the front and > rear of the cup at 45 degree clocking. Depending on the material thicknes= s > the channels may need to be offset. Oil channels may not be necessary. > > > > Too early for wine but well caffeinated! > > > > Bobby > > > > > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net > ] > *Sent:* Monday, November 12, 2018 2:26 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: 1mm thrust washer > > > > Kelly, I really should not draw freehand --- see if you can make sense o= f > the scribble. Neil. > > > > On 11/12/2018 4:15 PM, Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com wrote: > > Neil and All, > > Not sure I am visualizing the shape of the of the cup to encapsulate > the > > 1mm thrust washer but would certainly be a customer if Randy Kempf were > > to gear up to produce them........How about sketch of the proposed shape > > for those of us that are somewhat mechanically inept...........<:) > > > > Kelly Troyer > > > > On Sun, Nov 11, 2018 at 6:52 PM Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > > Bobby, > > Sorry I misunderstood you. By all means contact > Randy as he may be able to fit you in. He has a complete reduction > drive of mine there to measure, and certainly has the machinery to make > same. > > Neil. > > > On 11/12/2018 7:41 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote: > > Neil > > > > I was asking if Randy would consider making the 1mm washer mounting cup= . > I have a chip detector but removed it due to the 1mm washer / shaft wear > creating fuzz every few hours and setting off an alert. I also measure t= he > gearbox oil temp output. > > > > Bobby > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > >> On Nov 11, 2018, at 3:15 PM, Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >> > >> Bobby, > >> > >> =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 = =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3= =82 Another way is what I did, > was to put a temp sensor in the pSRU which will let you know if all is no= t > well with elevated temps.=C3=82 This is standard in heavy trucks,=C3=82 = One in the > gear box, and one each in both diffs.=C3=82 Simple and effective. > >> > >> Neil. > >> > >> > >>> On 11/12/2018 6:58 AM, Neil Unger wrote: > >>> Bobby, > >>> > >>> =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82= =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3= =82 I put a magnet in the > return line to catch any metal, but only got the "fuzz" you are talking > about so simply removed it. > >>> > >>> Will discuss with Randy re stocking a chip detector.=C3=82 That will= be > his commercial decision. > >>> > >>> Neil. > >>> > >>> > >>>> On 11/12/2018 3:29 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote: > >>>> Neil, > >>>> > >>>> That should work. I believe Tracy has suggested the same solution. I= t > would allow for replacing the 1mm washer if needed. I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2= =84=A2m thinking aluminum > instead of steel to minimize any wear on the washer outer edge if it > rotated. I would like to start using my gearbox chip detector again. The > 1mm washer shaft contact caused enough fuzz to activate it every few hour= s > so I removed it. Would this be an item Randy Kempf would consider > supplying? We need four in Austin TX and I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2m sure = others would retrofit > if the part was available.=C3=82 The cup OD would need to increased but = I think > we have plenty of room to accommodate modification. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Bobby > >>>> > >>>> Sent from my iPad > >>>> > >>>>> On Nov 10, 2018, at 4:01 PM, Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Bobby, > >>>>> > >>>>> =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3= =83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80= =9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83= =E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A = =C3=83=E2=80=9A=C3=82 Tried my > bearing blokes with no joy, over that size they are all 1.5mm.=C3=83=E2= =80=9A=C3=82 There is > another way however if there is room.=C3=83=E2=80=9A=C3=82 I suggest a s= mall alloy (or > steel) "cup" with mounting flanges like the washer you want, except in th= e > middle the 1mm washer fits flat against the mounting plate as usual, and > the cup then tapers upwards (after the 1mm thick retaining hole at the > bottom ) and out slightly (for say another 3mm?) to prevent the 1mm thrus= t > washer to "jump out of bed" and moving sideways. If it does move forward > the taper will force it back into place when the load comes on again.=C3= =83=E2=80=9A=C3=82 > My $0.02 worth, > >>>>> > >>>>> Neil. > > > > > > > > > > > > Virus-free= . > www.avast.com > > <#m_-1011805083258417811_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > > --00000000000045bf1f057a7e544f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks Neil and All.........My brain is now connected with= what needs to be accomplished.........

Kelly Troyer
On Mon, Nov 12, 2018 at 2= :49 PM Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com<= /a> <flyrotary@lancaironl= ine.net> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

Charlie,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Sounds simple, but to cut the depression in = the plate accurately will take a lot of setup time.=C2=A0 Then whatever depression you cut will have to be added to the nylon snubber washer and the whole gear train will be moved backwards as well.=C2= =A0 Couls end up time consuming and very messy IMHO.

Neil.


On 11/13/2018 2:53= AM, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com wrot= e:
=20
Could the same e= ffect be achieved by milling a depression in the 1/2" plate? How thick are the thicker washers; 2 mm? If so, mill a 1mm depression in the plate, and replace the thin 1 mm washer with a 3rd 2 mm washer. IIRC, Locktite makes a 'stickum' that could keep the washer embedded in the plate, so it doesn't un-nest when the shaft is unloaded. Would this excessively compromise the strength of the plate?

Charlie

On 11/12/2018 7:10 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote:
=20 =20 =20

Neil,=

=C2=A0

Looking good. The cup ID may need to be a few thousands over 52mm so not sure if there=E2=80=99s room for a mounting spigot. Depending on material thickness, =C2=A0the cup will fully enclose one of the 2MM bearings and part of the 3.5mm thrust washer. Possibly add oil path grooves to the front and rear of the cup at 45 degree clocking. Depending on the material thickness the channels may need to be offset. Oil channels may not be necessary.

=C2=A0

Too early for wine but well caffeinated!

=C2=A0

Bobby=

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From:<= /span> Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2018 2:26 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 1mm thrust washer<= u>

=C2=A0

Kelly,=C2=A0 I really should not draw freehand --- see if you can make sense of the scribble.=C2=A0 Neil.

=C2=A0

On 11/12/2018 4:15 PM, Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com wrote:

Neil and All,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Not sure I am visualiz= ing the shape of the of the cup to encapsulate the=C2=A0

1mm thrust washer but would certainly be a customer if Randy Kempf were=

to gear up to produce them........How about sketch of the proposed shape=

for those of us that are somewhat mechanically inept...........<:)

=C2=A0

Kelly Troyer=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Sun, Nov 11, 2018 at 6:52 PM Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Bob= by,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Sorry I misunderstood you.=C2=A0 By all means contact
Randy as he may be able to fit you in.=C2=A0 He has a complete reduction
drive of mine there to measure,=C2=A0 and certainly has the machinery to make
same.

Neil.


On 11/12/2018 7:41 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote:
> Neil
>
> I was asking if Randy would consider making the 1mm washer mounting cup. I have a chip detector but removed it due to the 1mm washer / shaft wear creating fuzz every few hours and setting off an alert.=C2=A0 I also measure the gearbox oil temp output= .
>
> Bobby
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Nov 11, 2018, at 3:15 PM, Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com &l= t;flyrotar= y@lancaironline.net> wrote:
>>
>> Bobby,
>>
>> =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3= =82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 = =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82=C2=A0 Another way is what I did, was to put a temp sensor in the pSRU which will let you know if all is not well with elevated temps.=C3=82=C2=A0 This is standard = in heavy trucks,=C3=82=C2=A0 One in the gear box, and one = each in both diffs.=C3=82=C2=A0 Simple and effective.
>>
>> Neil.
>>
>>
>>> On 11/12/2018 6:58 AM, Neil Unger wrote:
>>> Bobby,
>>>
>>> =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 = =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3= =82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82 =C3=82=C2=A0 I put a magnet in the return line to catch= any metal, but only got the "fuzz" you are talkin= g about so simply removed it.
>>>
>>> Will discuss with Randy re stocking a chip detector.=C3=82=C2=A0 That will be his commercial decision.
>>>
>>> Neil.
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 11/12/2018 3:29 AM, Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote:
>>>> Neil,
>>>>
>>>> That should work. I believe Tracy has suggested the same solution. It would allow for replacing the 1mm washer if needed. I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2= =84=A2m thinking aluminum instead of steel to minimize any wear on the washer outer edge if it rotated. I would like to start using my gearbox chip detector again. The 1mm washer shaft contact caused enough fuzz to activate it every few hours so I removed it. Would this be an item Randy Kempf would consider supplying? We need four in Austin TX and I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2m sure o= thers would retrofit if the part was available.=C3=82=C2=A0 The cup= OD would need to increased but I think we have plenty of room to accommodate modification.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Bobby
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 10, 2018, at 4:01 PM, Neil Unger 12348ung@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Bobby,
>>>>>
>>>>> =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A = =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2= =80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83= =E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A =C3=83=E2=80=9A = =C3=83=E2=80=9A=C3=82=C2=A0 Tried my bearing blokes with no joy, over that size they are all 1.5mm.=C3=83= =E2=80=9A=C3=82=C2=A0 There is another way however if there is room.=C3=83=E2= =80=9A=C3=82=C2=A0 I suggest a small alloy (or steel) "cup" with m= ounting flanges like the washer you want, except in the middle the 1mm washer fits flat against the mounting plate as usual, and the cup then tapers upwards (after the 1mm thick retaining hole at the bottom ) and out slightly (for say another 3mm?) to prevent the 1mm thrust washer to "jump out of bed" an= d moving sideways. If it does move forward the taper will force it back into place when the load comes on again.=C3=83=E2=80=9A=C3=82=C2=A0 My $0.02 worth,
>>>>>
>>>>> Neil.


=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0



3D"" Virus-fr= ee. www.avast.com




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