X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=QoAc5h6d c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=KEL5k4CtlTUHR7+issqm/A==:117 a=SfK9DJsZnIFapiPutv7ZGA==:17 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=VqmtQeTB-p0A:10 a=dapMudl6Dx4A:10 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=UKPAHat8AAAA:8 a=VAMm1qzQAAAA:8 a=zeCeww8OAAAA:8 a=2qmK6-J4Uu4hJGVk1UEA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=mEAMa8ODXzMR5Gm0oZIA:9 a=uRdk1up_YJQY8zx4:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=Fc6xXSS-RxGHxrvp76Qp:22 a=xmGugT5kI7RWeT601fq3:22 From: "Tracy Crook rwstracy@gmail.com" Received: from mail-pg1-f172.google.com ([209.85.215.172] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.6) with ESMTPS id 11555193 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 23 Aug 2018 13:34:09 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.215.172; envelope-from=rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by mail-pg1-f172.google.com with SMTP id b129-v6so2948564pga.13 for ; Thu, 23 Aug 2018 10:34:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:date:subject:message-id :references:in-reply-to:to; bh=6OxMjgqLFRD2M7AF3pm0S/S+IOCVB30E9ot4QKBTnwo=; b=iAeB2M/2VQOVx6DlzrdXy79PpC/Oxh1SvEY0EK74qq0O/GwvVpUCAVjuk9l2ZcJ15f +oCXlzbLNq+ZSZU7UNhBlwO2RElr9AXqFCogntlAkwpiYrI3Fp+CyFd5N7WMYGQG20P2 Z+C++2BTUAag0ziTbrmJXe01UJdsssRNeAESyfI6BX101S58Lfrklo114v03+BAl9qQZ TWIUps3t/aTh4EQMFAjX0pm6y/td94K/8Fx6FpJuClK2mdFYB1GSi+9ITvwVCDtxoXDm iHda9gamrnRNFqz222Zes9kYAfJKDg5tPWSPsc71KNKwBJdpe4XAEl75sj4lVuJsharO cPcA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:date :subject:message-id:references:in-reply-to:to; bh=6OxMjgqLFRD2M7AF3pm0S/S+IOCVB30E9ot4QKBTnwo=; b=ks7PL/0LSr6HKRY306O77lmMjFFTOAUIyCQzWtpOXv6s1oB/3iOE3eDlY/qksrzW0B 2VBtAM9K+tBCnO5ErgXiYMdFFuW1Q3U95Ub6h62h9wb55AaD2KcPK8qIIxMA0Yt4hrQZ 9wyje6vMPBB08fUbG1sHSTaW3K2jd0V//A4HCxZg3mwQf0OfgqZvyQXtrPluTyE2Gr/y hH0ciFw+JYLV6foIVEaV9KwRQkZI2hgSNER/IW92ScDDAh03s+ZPjcCnDNSCIBMnCraN 93FHSZA2H7agSceNavnYjhhJyLqXErxLBu5NjXLOa+8woH7lfiKNhZdUNf6Sv8xuf69h URcA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOUpUlGEFqxUSImk3bX0EI5LCpZn+P3lY1yemG933f0CLDEhCTgSqJNb 0RjETqNkH2ZeE9HNLcBOQLykqwGl X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA+uWPwPz+VzVw8imuz+G32bvVGYACzQo3FhGqLSZ2z0WlgGdAVDvrqI8NzBtM5Kk19Ye5StRb5C2g== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:a502:: with SMTP id s2-v6mr20320157plq.311.1535045631367; Thu, 23 Aug 2018 10:33:51 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from [172.20.10.6] (65.sub-97-44-4.myvzw.com. [97.44.4.65]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id k1-v6sm6311060pfi.62.2018.08.23.10.32.31 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 23 Aug 2018 10:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-3FF644AF-EEC3-40CC-9214-0C71E6ED6A15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2018 10:59:30 -0600 Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: tailwheel training; was: Re: Turbo report Message-Id: <8B90F65E-2C00-45E4-931C-649BE1B51998@gmail.com> References: In-Reply-To: To: Rotary motors in aircraft X-Mailer: iPad Mail (15G77) --Apple-Mail-3FF644AF-EEC3-40CC-9214-0C71E6ED6A15 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What Charlie said. Tracy Crook Sent from my iPad > On Aug 23, 2018, at 06:14, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com wrote: >=20 > Hi Todd,=20 >=20 > You'll get diametrically opposed opinions on this, but I'm in the 'don't r= isk your airplane doing fast taxi runs' camp. In my opinion (with around a t= housand t/w hours and about 30 nose wheel hours), running a taildragger down= a runway at high speed while trying to *prevent* a takeoff is begging for d= isaster. It really doesn't teach you anything because you never do this in n= ormal operation. And you've added a *lot* of workload, because you must both= keep the tail in exactly the right attitude to prevent liftoff without ding= ing the prop, and play meatpuppet cruise control with the throttle, for the s= ame reasons. All that while performing the normal duty of keeping the plane s= traight on the runway. I equate it to trying to balance on one foot on a bas= ketball, instead of dribbling it. For you, maybe spinning a hockey puck on o= ne finger while skating & maneuvering another puck with your stick. Why try= ? :-) >=20 > If the runway's long enough and I felt compelled to practice while tied to= the ground, I'd perform a normal takeoff to well above stall speed, then sm= oothly pull power & perform a normal landing. But if you're completely new t= o taildraggers, I wouldn't be doing any of that stuff without an instructor i= n the right seat, until he tells you you're ok to play alone. Why risk your p= lane? >=20 > FWIW, >=20 > Charlie >=20 >> On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 1:40 AM, Todd Bartrim bartrim@gmail.com wrote: >> Hi Dave; >> How far downstream of the turbo are you measuring your TOT?=20 >> I measure mine about 16" downstream and so far in static ground runs I on= ly see about 550C max. But I also measure both rotor exhaust ports and while= I see temps of 950C, only 2" further downstream where the two streams enter= the turbo I measure the TIT at usually 50C or more lower. So distance certa= inly does allow the the flame to cool, but I also assumed that the turbo was= converting some of the heat energy to mechanical energy along with the mech= anical energy it is already harvesting from the exhaust gas flow. >>=20 >> I hope to get better data soon but smokey skies from nearby forest fires h= ave darkened our skies and kept me on the ground. Been doing some hi-speed r= uns on the inactive runway between water-bombers coming and going from their= base which use that runway as a taxiway, while I'm trying to get a handle o= n this tailwheel thing. I think it will be much easier when I can just fly i= t off, instead of just the tail. >>=20 >> Todd Bartrim >>=20 >>=20 >>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 5:26 PM Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote: >>> Dave >>>=20 >>> That=E2=80=99s great news. TOT is the outlet temperature? If so I would h= ave expected it to be lower. The last coupe of years I have been successful i= n keeping climb EGT=E2=80=99s under 1600F on most flights. High OAT and quic= k fuel stops are the exception. But I think the heat soaked engine and super= charger is the cause. Performance actually increases after climbing and eve= rything cools off. Typical F/A for initial climb is 11.3 :1 for 1600F EGT=E2= =80=99s. I ended up with an O2 bung on each rotor and tuned for a near perfe= ct match between 28-40=E2=80=9D MP. Unfortunately the EGT spread varies a l= ot in other flight conditions. I=E2=80=99m slowly working on a turbo FWF to= replace the supercharger. I=E2=80=99ve done most of the work on the header w= ith he exception of wastegate, down pipe and bungs. The turbo is located as f= araway from the exhaust ports as I could mount it in hopes of dropping EGT=E2= =80=99s a little more.=20 >>>=20 >>> Link to photos >>> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/41hrm00tyqapp0s/AAAiusuG0BHTJy9inZujGj-Va?dl=3D= 0 >>>=20 >>> Bobby >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Sent from my iPad >>>=20 >>>> On Aug 22, 2018, at 5:54 PM, David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.com wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> Hi Bobby, >>>>=20 >>>> Yes, no new torbo failures since I decided to keep TOT (the only place I= measure exhaust) less than 890C. Basically, I treat it like an aircraft e= ngine. Rich of peak for climbing and decending (TOT around 810C) then lean a= t altitude when the MAP is lower (around 870C). Peak TOT is around 915C. =20= >>>>=20 >>>> Dave Leonard=20 >>>>=20 >>>>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018, 3:18 PM Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net wrote: >>>>> Dave >>>>>=20 >>>>> How is the turbo holding up? Is keeping EGT=E2=80=99s under 1600F kee= ping it alive? >>>>>=20 >>>>> Bobby=20 >>>>> 500 hrs >>>>>=20 >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>=20 >>>>>> On Aug 22, 2018, at 5:06 PM, David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.com wrote: >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Thanks Kelly! >>>>>> Yes, I am still using the flywheel and strongly suggest not using the= flex plate. Adaption was easy with a trip to a local machine shop. Detail= s are in the archives.=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018, 2:41 PM Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com wrote: >>>>>>> Dave, >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Not aware of a flexplate/flywheel replacement made specifically f= or use with=20 >>>>>>> Tracy's redrive but Dave Leonard (Turbo/13B-RV6) adapted an aluminum= racing >>>>>>> manual transmission flywheel to his redrive after his flexplate deve= loped serious >>>>>>> cracks while qualifying to race at the Reno National Air-Races sever= al years ago. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Perhaps Dave will jump in here with how he did it.......I know the= re are a series=20 >>>>>>> of E mails in the archives with photos of how he did it....As far as= I know he still >>>>>>> is flying with this flywheel........FWIW >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Kelly Troyer >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 4:17 PM, Pam & Dave Williams padajute@idcne= t.com wrote: >>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> I am looking for a flex plate for hooking up my 13B to Tracy Crooks= redrive. >>>>>>>> If that is not available, is anybody making a flywheel replacement?= >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Dave Williams=20 >>>>>>>> Whitewater WI >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net= ]=20 >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, June 29, 2018 9:37 AM >>>>>>>> To: Rotary motors in aircraft >>>>>>>> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: flyrotary : Re Tension Bolts >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> I too broke a tension bolt several years ago and was fortunate enou= gh to get >>>>>>>> a set of the NEW ones 0.500" from a friend - highly recommended. >>>>>>>> Mazda increased the size of those bolts for a reason and my origina= l set >>>>>>>> were all spiraled with silicone ... put a little silicone on the 0.= 50" as >>>>>>>> well. >>>>>>>> Jeff >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Dave, >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Run a spiral of RTV around the body of those tension bolts next tim= e you >>>>>>>> remove them. That will pretty much eliminate the vibration breakag= e. Don't >>>>>>>> put it on the threads. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Bill B >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> I am a newbie on the site. I have a Tailwind with a 13B and Tracy's= controls >>>>>>>> with his redrive. To this point I have been very pleased with the >>>>>>>> combination. Last month I broke a tension bolt and have ordered new= and >>>>>>>> improved .500" bolts from Mazdatrix. My original .312" bolts broke f= rom >>>>>>>> vibration. I have 20 hours on the motor and never had any cooling i= ssues. I >>>>>>>> suppose that means I am over cooled, but that is okay with me. I wi= ll make >>>>>>>> cooling improvements when I am back in the air. My 13B is stock and= I run it >>>>>>>> at 6,300 RPM. >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Dave Williams >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-3FF644AF-EEC3-40CC-9214-0C71E6ED6A15 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What Charlie said.

Tracy= Crook

Sent from my iPad
On Aug 23, 2018, at 06:14, Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Hi Todd, 

You'll g= et diametrically opposed opinions on this, but I'm in the 'don't risk your a= irplane doing fast taxi runs' camp. In my opinion (with around a thousand t/= w hours and about 30 nose wheel hours), running a taildragger down a runway a= t high speed while trying to *prevent* a takeoff is begging for disaster. It= really doesn't teach you anything because you never do this in normal opera= tion. And you've added a *lot* of workload, because you must both keep the t= ail in exactly the right attitude to prevent liftoff without dinging the pro= p, and play meatpuppet cruise control with the throttle, for the same reason= s. All that while performing the normal duty of keeping the plane straight o= n the runway. I equate it to trying to balance on one foot on a basketball, i= nstead of dribbling it. For you, maybe spinning a hockey puck on one finger w= hile skating & maneuvering another puck with  your stick. Why try? := -)

If the runway's long enough and I felt compelled= to practice while tied to the ground, I'd perform a normal takeoff to well a= bove stall speed, then smoothly pull power & perform a normal landing. B= ut if you're completely new to taildraggers, I wouldn't be doing any of that= stuff without an instructor in the right seat, until he tells you you're ok= to play alone. Why risk your plane?

FWIW,

Charlie

On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 1:40 AM, Todd Bartrim bartrim@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.ne= t> wrote:
Hi= Dave;
  How far downstream of the turbo are you measuring your TOT= ? 
I measure mine about 16" downstream and so far in static g= round runs I only see about 550C max. But I also measure both rotor exhaust p= orts and while I see temps of 950C, only 2" further downstream where the two= streams enter the turbo I measure the TIT at usually 50C or more lower. So d= istance certainly does allow the the flame to cool, but I also assumed that t= he turbo was converting some of the heat energy to mechanical energy along w= ith the mechanical energy it is already harvesting from the exhaust gas flow= .

I hope to get better data soon but smokey skies f= rom nearby forest fires have darkened our skies and kept me on the ground. B= een doing some hi-speed runs on the inactive runway between water-bombers co= ming and going from their base which use that runway as a taxiway, while I'm= trying to get a handle on this tailwheel thing. I think it will be much eas= ier when I can just fly it off, instead of just the tail.

Todd Bartrim


On W= ed, Aug 22, 2018 at 5:26 PM Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrot= e:
Dave

That=E2=80=99s great news. TOT is the o= utlet temperature? If so I would have expected it to be lower. The last coup= e of years I have been successful in keeping climb EGT=E2=80=99s under 1600F= on most flights. High OAT and quick fuel stops are the exception. But I thi= nk the heat soaked engine and super charger is the cause. Performance actual= ly increases after climbing and everything cools off. Typical F/A for initia= l climb is 11.3 :1 for 1600F EGT=E2=80=99s. I ended up with an O2 bung on ea= ch rotor and tuned for a near perfect match between 28-40=E2=80=9D MP. = Unfortunately the EGT spread varies a lot in other flight conditions. = I=E2=80=99m slowly working on a turbo FWF to replace the supercharger. I=E2= =80=99ve done most of the work on the header with he exception of wastegate,= down pipe and bungs. The turbo is located as faraway from the exhaust ports= as I could mount it in hopes of dropping EGT=E2=80=99s a little more. =

Link to photos

Bobby

<= br>
S= ent from my iPad

On Aug 22, 2018, at 5:54 PM, David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.com <flyr= otary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Hi Bobby,

Yes, no new torbo failures since I decided to keep TOT (the only place I= measure exhaust) less than 890C.  Basically,  I treat it like an a= ircraft engine.  Rich of peak for climbing and decending (TOT around 81= 0C) then lean at altitude when the MAP is lower  (around 870C).  P= eak TOT is around 915C.  

Dave Leonard 

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018, 3:18 PM Bobby J. Hughes bhughes@qnsi.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.n= et> wrote:
D= ave

How is the turbo holding up?  Is keeping EGT=E2=80= =99s under 1600F keeping it alive?

Bobby 
500 hrs

Sent from my iPad
On Aug 22, 2018, at 5:06 PM, David Leonard wdleonard@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Thanks Kelly!
Yes, I am st= ill using the flywheel and strongly suggest not using the flex plate.  A= daption was easy with a trip to a local machine shop.  Details are in t= he archives. 

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018, 2:41 PM Kelly Troyer keltro@gmail.com <fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Dave,

   Not aware of a flexplat= e/flywheel replacement made specifically for use with 
Tracy'= s redrive but Dave Leonard (Turbo/13B-RV6) adapted an aluminum racing
<= div>manual transmission flywheel to his redrive after his flexplate develope= d serious
cracks while qualifying to race at the Reno National Air= -Races several years ago.

  Perhaps Dave will j= ump in here with how he did it.......I know there are a series 
of E mails in the archives with photos of how he did it....As far as I kn= ow he still
is flying with this flywheel........FWIW

Kelly Troyer

On Wed, Aug 22, 2018 at 4:17 PM, Pam & Dave Williams <= a href=3D"mailto:padajute@idcnet.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D= "_blank">padajute@idcnet.com <fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Hello,

I am looking for a flex plate for hooking up my 13B to Tracy Crooks redrive.=
If that is not available, is anybody making a flywheel replacement?

Thanks,
Dave Williams
Whitewater WI

-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@la= ncaironline.net]
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2018 9:37 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline= .net>
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: flyrotary : Re Tension Bolts

I too broke a tension bolt several years ago and was fortunate enough to get=
a set of the NEW ones 0.500" from a friend - highly recommended.
Mazda increased the size of those bolts for a reason and my original set
= were all spiraled with silicone ... put a little silicone on the 0.50" as well.
Jeff


Dave,

Run a spiral of RTV around the body of those tension bolts next time you
= remove them.  That will pretty much eliminate the vibration breakage.&n= bsp; Don't
put it on the threads.

Bill B

Hello,

I am a newbie on the site. I have a Tailwind with a 13B and Tracy's controls=
with his redrive. To this point I have been very pleased with the
combination. Last month I broke a tension bolt and have ordered new and
improved .500" bolts from Mazdatrix. My original .312" bolts broke from
vibration. I have 20 hours on the motor and never had any cooling issues. I<= br> suppose that means I am over cooled, but that is okay with me. I will make cooling improvements when I am back in the air. My 13B is stock and I run it=
at 6,300 RPM.

Thanks,
Dave Williams








= --Apple-Mail-3FF644AF-EEC3-40CC-9214-0C71E6ED6A15--