X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=K8pgJGeI c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=0T8DnW5xlUJKQG3F+FVMbQ==:117 a=ELru21G5goYvQnHqZ8aA5Q==:17 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=A-0mRrAPPO4A:10 a=RgaUWeydRksA:10 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=pKIvBwQkAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=69EAbJreAAAA:8 a=bsATwsvZAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=xPyZ54XvAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=gwP49RevflCojNeI84kA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=SJCFYyG4B-UA:10 a=77x-yTWI9uoA:10 a=HfdpfQiixUcA:10 a=gvSQh4r-fQ0A:10 a=4PR2P7QzAAAA:8 a=kPR48rpoAAAA:8 a=fEgQh6Ig5-u9U1gcFiEA:9 a=LxBBm_M4DF7DpcVd:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=RTTcFYj4BG8A:10 a=xWmF-2C7K6YA:10 a=AcrfXRWS_UMA:10 a=a607N7b_M7cA:10 a=PpS2hZJ425QA:10 a=e3wm5Yygu-IA:10 a=HSc_A1uije0A:10 a=nLfs02IPoIQ3qSvAB1Ui:22 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=YgZUEpoybBZZp_vkc61X:22 a=5YQ6H4ZxyGn-KoBYtt8s:22 a=LQCduUwlY3eUW_MavTj7:22 a=4dqwQCo7Po2mVW515mGf:22 a=Y3nQ7mX9hcbL2wwZa1q_:22 From: "Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com" Received: from mail-yb0-f172.google.com ([209.85.213.172] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.1) with ESMTPS id 10616736 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 23 Jan 2018 23:15:15 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.213.172; envelope-from=ceengland7@gmail.com Received: by mail-yb0-f172.google.com with SMTP id l3so1064353ybk.5 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2018 20:15:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language; bh=tKXTO16P5dYOqUpVbqITcbhwLxopy1sKJABc4Db1uy0=; b=evF0qsn5/avhOfz1ZvI6dpmsdW1dR6zmn+GWiRuDhCeBDjf/JCY7RN/KKfireaBajP 8YVK8f/+v/4PIqatFX+8sOSYbAlM8QtJDda94eMfRUwREs1fBorHB6tCCmL83uiKgPS7 zaaMLHbUhaoVn046JHSmZGFWnvQjP88veEYnm4H/jjcNf4D7j2Sv+EcijqyEWTdp02Nz /zbF8AuUl1PzOIMUUHCci82wn7//3viVrDiV1MeaOsOLRjrChzqjBIax8SVUzEtK7dT5 6ug8vzIMHmEcN62chdGCE7gJKkPQaKQYSPUx5csXOI6iGOoN9w87SdLmFIQ945nri96r 6A+Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=tKXTO16P5dYOqUpVbqITcbhwLxopy1sKJABc4Db1uy0=; b=Ajg0OASBjfrlxh3b9faCVO2hVLfAB6SI+9wEaRV5hiSfWkrxHmEwzzFlSmLAhDrYKT RZGcO0/4Ut5/dlz4R+jDCH5+jUMxnIaFrw6602qd5syaGlHslzpgy27WwHz4zIrrOubB 1yro2zEjWxo+4Zv39Lxvm7ogtvMS5ilbp2CAtteIOgCZfETmrKotHqw46A/2vX7T7oXo TrDILSd1IWM8AMJV8QK0b/+gKuSvJUvfvchsqltFwng8QEUEDTndlReA1ATGb0QL0a0g aIjl8gZDP4LhecEKqPZeQexhM8cwCzzPZbBScekfB7UH9NEIoHCT69GfVc0T+WWLerz0 C7ag== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxyteaR2o1oC8M1D4Ys+zxrA0N7pVi45v09zk+r9eTf/uokGYkhNVy 5RptpueC+Hbj+pvGRLh9mekjXEdn X-Google-Smtp-Source: AH8x226xRqf51rHO5a8cEZ+cMbfe0mkdt/zZ5tnC9Zure1he/BVjU/VDR9Qybt7GO0AiUUd9V/ZCOA== X-Received: by 10.37.133.79 with SMTP id f15mr4463250ybn.463.1516767297973; Tue, 23 Jan 2018 20:14:57 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.10.217] (mobile-166-173-248-37.mycingular.net. [166.173.248.37]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id k2sm871756ywi.52.2018.01.23.20.14.56 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 23 Jan 2018 20:14:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Simple bullet proof Ignition systems? To: Rotary motors in aircraft References: Message-ID: <4b11a3f1-788a-633e-f980-5579f6f31df2@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2018 22:20:13 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------D77604BAFC1F1EC9939F1AC8" Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus: Avast (VPS 180123-8, 01/23/2018), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------D77604BAFC1F1EC9939F1AC8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit \ We might be straying off the path of 'simple', but an option functionally similar to Ross' ignition only setup might be: https://www.autosportlabs.com/product/megajolte/ Like Ross' box, it would also require a different trigger wheel. But the controller price is well under $200. update: I finally found Lynn Hanover's dual pickup drawing for use with two MSDs or two Chrysler ignition modules. Same issue with risk of killing one rotor, but pretty cheap: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/Message/38794.html?altLanguage= Hope that helps, Charlie On 1/23/2018 4:55 PM, William Jepson wrjjrs@gmail.com wrote: > Will, > Ross doesn't generally list Rotary engines in his catalog, but he > isn't against them. He has a injection that still lists rotary > engines. To run his ignition only you would likely need to get an > aluminum e-shaft pulley to install his magnets. He has his own Hall > effect sensors. He used to sell both ignition units and full EMS > systems. Don't know if he is still doing it individually. The > advantage of his system is that he does do aircraft stuff. His > business has in fact gravitated towards aircraft since so many cars > now come with their own systems unless it is a full custom build they > often don't need an EMS. BTW I don't work for them or get anything for > recommending their products. I met Ross at Reno while crewing for a > friend on a Sport Class entry. Ross was providing an EMS for a very > fast Questair Venture running a turbo Lyc. Very good guy. A 4 cylinder > unit with dual plug coils will run the rotary just fine. The timing is > the same, except that the coil isn't wasting a spark in the exhaust, > instead it is firing both plugs on a single rotor.  Ross' site still > lists his "coil pack ignition" for vehicles with mechanical injection > or carburetors. > Bill > > On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 12:24 PM, william Aldridge > willja67@hotmail.com > > wrote: > > Looked over his site this morning and if i read It right there was > only a fuel injection controller/ system,  no ignition control. > Out was here: http://www.sdsefi.com/prices.html > > > If I'm reading that chart at the top of the page right he doesn't > supply ignition systems for the rotary. > > > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > -------- Original message -------- > From: "William Jepson wrjjrs@gmail.com " > > > Date: 1/23/18 12:14 PM (GMT-07:00) > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Simple bullet proof Ignition systems? > > Guys, I don't know if he is still offering it but SDSEFI (Simple > Digital Systems, www.SDSEFI.com ) has both > an ignition only system and a full engine management system that > will work for a 13B. His system doesn't have split firing, but > most people running a high performance rotary do both plugs at > once anyway. He has a newer dual in one box system, FOR AIRCRAFT > that could be run simultaneously to do a split fire and be fully > redundant. > Bill Jepson > > On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 6:08 AM, Finn Lassen > finn.lassen@verizon.net > > > wrote: > > Maybe someone out there has a RWS original ignition controller > they want to let go of. No programming required, uses 13-B > standard pickup and ignition coils. Of course you'll have to > use carburetor(s). > > I have one, but really don't want to let go if it. Its > simplicity is nice if just want to get 13-B running. (All you > have to do is set timing and tune carburetors.) > > Finn > > On 1/22/2018 11:31 PM, william Aldridge willja67@hotmail.com > wrote: >>  I'm building a one off experimental, therefore, i need a >> simple bullet proof Ignition system and am wondering what is >> currently available?  I have the 2007 version of Tracy's >> conversion manual in which he gives the option of either >> using the stock distributor etc, or use a computerized >> ignition system with stock or Chevy ls coils. >> >> To reiterate, since the airframe is unproven i only want to >> be worried about flying the plane not the engine. It's a >> small plane the size that would normally have 100hp installed >> (1200 lbs gross) so if I only have 150 hp I'll still be doing >> good. In other words I'm willing to sacrifice a little power >> for a lot of reliability and simplicity. >> >> I don't like the idea of the stock distributor, since there >> isn't much room in the cowl and there's no redundancy. I also >> don't like the idea of electronic ignition. I've read enough >> stories of lengthy battles to get the computers to play nice >> with the engine and don't want to go that route. Again >> simplicity and reliability at the expense of power and fuel >> efficiency is what I'm after. Also planning on using a carb >> for the same reason. I can always upgrade the engine later if >> i want. >> >> I figure there has to have been some other options come up in >> the last 10 years. I used to subscribe to the other guys >> list, but don't know if any of the ideas he put forth have >> merit. >> >> Thanks, >> Will Aldridge >> >> Ps my build thread on hba here: >> http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16831 >> >> >> >> >> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > > > > --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --------------D77604BAFC1F1EC9939F1AC8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit




\

We might be straying off the path of 'simple', but an option functionally similar to Ross' ignition only setup might be:
https://www.autosportlabs.com/product/megajolte/
Like Ross' box, it would also require a different trigger wheel. But the controller price is well under $200.
update:
I finally found Lynn Hanover's dual pickup drawing for use with two MSDs or two Chrysler ignition modules. Same issue with risk of killing one rotor, but pretty cheap:
http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/Message/38794.html?altLanguage=

Hope that helps,

Charlie



On 1/23/2018 4:55 PM, William Jepson wrjjrs@gmail.com wrote:
Will,
Ross doesn't generally list Rotary engines in his catalog, but he isn't against them. He has a injection that still lists rotary engines. To run his ignition only you would likely need to get an aluminum e-shaft pulley to install his magnets. He has his own Hall effect sensors. He used to sell both ignition units and full EMS systems. Don't know if he is still doing it individually. The advantage of his system is that he does do aircraft stuff. His business has in fact gravitated towards aircraft since so many cars now come with their own systems unless it is a full custom build they often don't need an EMS. BTW I don't work for them or get anything for recommending their products. I met Ross at Reno while crewing for a friend on a Sport Class entry. Ross was providing an EMS for a very fast Questair Venture running a turbo Lyc. Very good guy. A 4 cylinder unit with dual plug coils will run the rotary just fine. The timing is the same, except that the coil isn't wasting a spark in the exhaust, instead it is firing both plugs on a single rotor.  Ross' site still lists his "coil pack ignition" for vehicles with mechanical injection or carburetors.
Bill

On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 12:24 PM, william Aldridge willja67@hotmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Looked over his site this morning and if i read It right there was only a fuel injection controller/ system,  no ignition control. Out was here: http://www.sdsefi.com/prices.html

If I'm reading that chart at the top of the page right he doesn't supply ignition systems for the rotary. 



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------
Date: 1/23/18 12:14 PM (GMT-07:00)
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Simple bullet proof Ignition systems?

Guys, I don't know if he is still offering it but SDSEFI (Simple Digital Systems, www.SDSEFI.com) has both an ignition only system and a full engine management system that will work for a 13B. His system doesn't have split firing, but most people running a high performance rotary do both plugs at once anyway. He has a newer dual in one box system, FOR AIRCRAFT that could be run simultaneously to do a split fire and be fully redundant.
Bill Jepson 
 

On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 6:08 AM, Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Maybe someone out there has a RWS original ignition controller they want to let go of. No programming required, uses 13-B standard pickup and ignition coils. Of course you'll have to use carburetor(s).

I have one, but really don't want to let go if it. Its simplicity is nice if just want to get 13-B running. (All you have to do is set timing and tune carburetors.)

Finn

On 1/22/2018 11:31 PM, william Aldridge willja67@hotmail.com wrote:
 I'm building a one off experimental, therefore, i need a simple bullet proof Ignition system and am wondering what is currently available?  I have the 2007 version of Tracy's conversion manual in which he gives the option of either using the stock distributor etc, or use a computerized ignition system with stock or Chevy ls coils. 

To reiterate, since the airframe is unproven i only want to be worried about flying the plane not the engine. It's a small plane the size that would normally have 100hp installed (1200 lbs gross) so if I only have 150 hp I'll still be doing good. In other words I'm willing to sacrifice a little power for a lot of reliability and simplicity. 

I don't like the idea of the stock distributor, since there isn't much room in the cowl and there's no redundancy. I also don't like the idea of electronic ignition. I've read enough stories of lengthy battles to get the computers to play nice with the engine and don't want to go that route. Again simplicity and reliability at the expense of power and fuel efficiency is what I'm after. Also planning on using a carb for the same reason. I can always upgrade the engine later if i want. 

I figure there has to have been some other options come up in the last 10 years. I used to subscribe to the other guys list, but don't know if any of the ideas he put forth have merit. 

Thanks, 
Will Aldridge 




Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone






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