X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "William Jepson" Received: from mail-vk0-f47.google.com ([209.85.213.47] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2c3) with ESMTPS id 9828865 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 15 Jun 2017 18:49:00 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.213.47; envelope-from=wrjjrs@gmail.com Received: by mail-vk0-f47.google.com with SMTP id y70so14347374vky.3 for ; Thu, 15 Jun 2017 15:49:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=IAcTLOLWZFAKP3zpHqHEDcxfNH17hVJo95DRxwfCw3g=; b=HyrlK5xHCDP0sgc0urUpJRswM3gYIHSPe0m+KxUJQTxVNL9PzoesxYrc6gt+4PvZPh S/tb3oFvFGqKZDmAO1XsFUf27Jpj89Mnd0cKv3QT+A4YiYpJtR5Lm+ZuXs3vTHrIWfN+ o6lSuRhRN0rheLKeToGzMyDeHbPlxQevw/iA+BMg1q2NPsqEMbk7gZVccdLlWe1nVXRb FhnP6yEM174IizV3i2Y3/AFbTMI3V/VqNSiqwAUICEMQy/74MxBkkNL5E7VvIAB2+20T BzyqkOO+4yT7VXoi3tW4Jlvn1xg5w4W91jRXaJ5PTNk6RdE7wXAd6TXQTPfhdQ0uQhGW zQ3g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=IAcTLOLWZFAKP3zpHqHEDcxfNH17hVJo95DRxwfCw3g=; b=SYlPUBDGMxO3hIfnESOxd3S5e/aWZO/ypCb62H0ud+rhDp5+HItzBA2MofysaKfXwd ITKzsN5a44P62js7V4VbMAfOEKEOzvkEArn0xCn5KkJktwCsz1aqTGSibH6McwaLbdHu ZxA1uVzhUy6dlJfaSMrV8ITTCTzQ/bqu1sZMZqnbZsWIj/eQ1I1Ch8SGZpOopzR7ZE0v 6kXqLnLtdho0lLmbCmfH0EMGIO9NuQAqApKsV6RapNkYMrGyS2kuEymxEDr678Ibutsv 4olK9ZCN17C9pAQZpIRzCMrJJUBZveHK51VDzjH1nTcxjY0Q9TShxzBNHKsxdl7xalGD 1f3A== X-Gm-Message-State: AKS2vOzu5bkED3gRNFNvUednzfrc9JSuipgQRRusbr2YL7aqWluU1GLm zNe2ZY9skQm87+H2UJMSHYKgvX5Fr0MN X-Received: by 10.31.224.134 with SMTP id x128mr3848457vkg.21.1497566924506; Thu, 15 Jun 2017 15:48:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.31.163.147 with HTTP; Thu, 15 Jun 2017 15:48:44 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2017 15:48:44 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: ceramic coating To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c07afe2900bdb0552077873" --94eb2c07afe2900bdb0552077873 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Charlie, Agreed on the explainin'. FWIW Jet -hot does make those claims. I can tell you from personal experience that it does work. Yes you must send your parts to them to get them coated. It is a baked on process like powder coating, but with a ceramic base. The best results ARE when doing tubes inside and out. I even found that I picked up just a bit of power on the dyno after the process. Bill Jepson On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 3:41 PM, Charlie England < flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > I did a bit of research a few years ago. The 'bite your butt' aspect of > all of them is that they need to go in the interior to really do some good > (protect the metal of the manifold/exhaust itself, in addition to the > under-cowl stuff), Even the pro coaters I talked to were not very > encouraging about trying to coat a product that has already been in > service; just no way to be sure all the interior surfaces got clean, before > applying the coating. > > If you're willing to accept the process as just being better than the > wrap, but doing the same thing, then go for it. You do need to look closely > at the actual characteristics of the product, too. Some will withstand > extreme heat, but do little to block transmission of that heat. They were > basically just high heat-tolerance finishes. Many of the products I > researched fell into that category, but you really had to dig to get the > info. > > FWIW, I just took a look at the VHT Flameproof web page, and there's no > claim whatsoever that it lowers under-hood (cowl) temps. If it were my > product, and it did that, I'd certainly flaunt the fact that it did, > complete with "twenty-seven 8 x 10 colored glossy photographs with > circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of > each one explainin' what each one was, to be used as evidence" of what a > great product it was. > > Charlie > (Apologies to Arlo.) > > > > > On 6/15/2017 4:45 PM, Todd Bartrim wrote: > > It appears that Jet-Hot is a service business and not a product that I can > buy. They may have their own proprietary coatings but it doesn't appear > that they sell them as a product but only as a service for which I'd have > to send my stuff out-of -country to have them apply it. > I can get it done here in Canada by any number of businesses that use a > variety of products including Cerakote and Ceramakrome. Unfortunately none > of them are local and other than VHT, I haven't been able to find a product > in Canada to do it myself. > So unless somebody speaks up with a glowing recommendation for VHT, then > I'll resign myself to shipping them away to have someone do it for me. > > Todd Bartrim > > On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 12:26 PM, William Jepson < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > >> Todd, I haven't used the VHT coating, but I have used the Jet-Hot >> coatings. They have performed great. They have a high-temp coating that >> will work for rotaries. The wraps tend to cause corrosion since they seem >> to trap condensation. >> Bill Jepson >> >> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 12:21 PM, Todd Bartrim < >> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >> >>> Has anybody tried using VHT Flameproof, ceramic coating ? It's rated up >>> to 2000F intermittent. >>> I've been running my engine with exhaust wraps and am very pleased with >>> the reduction of under cowl temps but am aware of the concerns regarding >>> longevity of the exhaust. >>> As I'm very near to returning to the airport I want to address this and >>> go with a ceramic coating. >>> I have the ability and facilities to apply a proper ceramic coat, but it >>> is difficult to source the material at a reasonable cost and timeframe. >>> I can ship it away and have it done for about the same price and less >>> time. But I can also purchase VHT locally. While it comes in an aerosol >>> can, it is not paint. It can be applied as simple as you would a paint, but >>> for best results, proper cleaning, bead blasting and oven cure are >>> required, not unlike the usual ceramic coats. >>> I always preferr to do things myself, but if anybody can say that this >>> stuff is not up to the hype, then I'll consider shipping out the exhaust to >>> have it done. >>> I have about a week of work to do where I want the exhaust in place, >>> but then I'll be away for a week, during which time I can send it out. >>> Further to this, has anybody ever had their exhaust ceramic coated >>> and then also wrapped it to provide even more heat reduction? >>> >>> Todd Bartrim >>> C-FSTB >>> Turbo 13B RV9a >>> >> >> > > > > Virus-free. > www.avast.com > > <#m_2076244222794039194_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > --94eb2c07afe2900bdb0552077873 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Charlie,
Agreed on the=C2=A0explainin'. FWIW = Jet -hot does make those claims. I can tell you from personal experience th= at it does work. Yes you must send your parts to them to get them coated. I= t is a baked on process=C2=A0like powder coating, but with a ce= ramic base. The best results ARE when doing tubes inside and out. I even fo= und that I picked up just a bit of power on the dyno after the process.=C2= =A0
Bill Jepson

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 3:41 PM, Cha= rlie England <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:<= br>
=20 =20 =20
I did a bit of rese= arch a few years ago. The 'bite your butt' aspect of all of them is that they = need to go in the interior to really do some good (protect the metal of the manifold/exhaust itself, in addition to the under-cowl stuff), Even the pro coaters I talked to were not very encouraging about trying to coat a product that has already been in service; just no way to be sure all the interior surfaces got clean, before applying the coating.

If you're willing to accept the process as just being better than the wrap, but doing the same thing, then go for it. You do need to look closely at the actual characteristics of the product, too. Some will withstand extreme heat, but do little to block transmission of that heat. They were basically just high heat-tolerance finishes. Many of the products I researched fell into that category, but you really had to dig to get the info.

FWIW, I just took a look at the VHT Flameproof web page, and there's no claim whatsoever that it lowers under-hood (cowl) temps. If it were my product, and it did that, I'd certainly flaunt the fact that it did, complete with=C2=A0 "twenty-seve= n 8 x 10 colored = glossy photographs with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of=C2=A0
each one explainin' what each one was, to be used as evidence" of what a great product it was.

Charlie
(Apologies to Arlo.)




On 6/15/2017 4:45 PM, Todd Bartrim wrote:
It appears that Jet-Hot is a service business and not a product that I can buy. They may have their own proprietary coatings but it doesn't appear that they sell them as a product but only as a service for which I'd have to send m= y stuff out-of -country to have them apply it.
I can get it done here in Canada by any number of businesses that use a variety of products including Cerakote and Ceramakrome. Unfortunately none of them are local and other than VHT, I haven't been able to find a product in Canada to do it myself.
=C2=A0 So unless somebody speaks up with a glowing recommendation for VHT, then I'll resign myself to shipping them away to have someone do it for me.

Todd Bartrim

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 12:26 PM, William Jepson <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Todd, I haven't used the VHT coating, but = I have used the Jet-Hot coatings. They have performed great. They have a high-temp coating that will work for rotaries. The wraps tend to cause corrosion since they seem to trap condensation.
Bill Jepson

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 12:21 PM, Todd Bartrim <flyrotary@lancaironline.ne= t> wrote:
Has anybody tried using VHT Flameproof, ceramic coating ? It's rated up to 2000F intermittent.
I've been running my engine with exhaust wraps and am very pleased with the reduction of under cowl temps but am aware of the concerns regarding longevity of the exhaust.
As I'm very near to returning to the airport I want to address this and go with a ceramic coating.
I have the ability and facilities to apply a proper ceramic coat, but it is difficult to source the material at a reasonable cost and timeframe.
=C2=A0 I can ship it away and have it done for about the same price and less time. But I can also purchase VHT locally. While it comes in an aerosol can, it is not paint. It can be applied as simple as you would a paint, but for best results, proper cleaning, bead blasting and oven cure are required, not unlike the usual ceramic coats.
=C2=A0 I always preferr to do things myself, b= ut if anybody can say that this stuff is not up to the hype, then I'll consider shipping out the exhaust to have it done.
=C2=A0 I have about a week of work to do where= I want the exhaust in place, but then I'll be away for a week, during which time I can send it out.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Further to this, has anybody ever= had their exhaust ceramic coated and then also wrapped it to provide even more heat reduction?

Todd Bartrim
=C2=A0C-FSTB
Turbo 13B RV9a




3D"" Virus-free. www.avast.com

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