X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Christian And Tamara Mcdonald" Received: from mail-io0-f176.google.com ([209.85.223.176] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.11) with ESMTPS id 8836024 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 29 Jul 2016 21:20:14 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.223.176; envelope-from=christamarmc@gmail.com Received: by mail-io0-f176.google.com with SMTP id b62so143421425iod.3 for ; Fri, 29 Jul 2016 18:20:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=wLYEaT1nEdtwGhMI89G1UHU+CJms/Qc2m6aF+HSNqpg=; b=UhpWZKDrLVdkHy5O9Jg2ORAhxKfBldilBHlk5i8CPBtGjoKRgrEcQxgYO8CV/NXqE+ tiPtLs7J+hu9jlnkHYp9EypOmzSKGjXPW/TAjcYtV6BorrFxBE+TbDIv0rQhi4bsylpL cqz0Mr78qJhKzvZ8g7I3kq2zKi4+d1pv7WmR1i2Z/vFtsRvZxRJiyhFjPgYO7rRDN9WD 6C59pteROnjXmZQzGi8IooLFYtqo6BmcsUARJEmqsjfgz707/YbDtUcjKolXI4cvy4jg m4g5bU0G5xTXmFcmr4HK7Uzd/1x5CBlHO4gLQBngIQa72H8KKLRY+mScExoVOEit0DDO 8wdg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=wLYEaT1nEdtwGhMI89G1UHU+CJms/Qc2m6aF+HSNqpg=; b=XzSCn/vR4Qdr4el1+EJ1gw9qvEM0VSJ/jqYYdhRvwNub1+sBnsjUTHF90xA5uLodJg 1H3YkFxxFB7b9B+JgYP75XdPJ+xWu34gukQxmRueweU0kejCMFTl3gXGhSMBHORTqCmQ R+VmwvoGxVswEH8fdMluR+o8/muLdqQaiHzUuMxAskumzXbCQRLpJU/VLTqaldUhZhH1 AyI2KPgkPXp7lO+oCGnqQ253G6wc0ZHs3feIfCFiH/B3eE6yw1b4lYK8AuEw3Q3tUl60 yp5/YNcdhTEyueNjuF432jGnqXjwPlArgeLDazhwabhrQ2skKTlRhxx7X1Tq91vS1x// GOdg== X-Gm-Message-State: AEkoouvlDsJWcSrlwn0iTs6sXeZaNnedngPXaqqNnUAcPTbODJmToepzDnZyfMtBnSMLTu2JE3h9FUPhK/EQsg== X-Received: by 10.107.5.10 with SMTP id 10mr48111968iof.104.1469841597288; Fri, 29 Jul 2016 18:19:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.178.136 with HTTP; Fri, 29 Jul 2016 18:19:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 30 Jul 2016 11:19:56 +1000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Further testing To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113ef78448552b0538d02a2d --001a113ef78448552b0538d02a2d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Steve I found it would jump all over the place there was no steady reading until I installed the restricter, that was installed atop of my plenum that I made, then I stuck it at the base of the throttle body and I got a little more accurate readings, but the restricter made all the differance for me the poor old computer didn't know what to make of it at first and was backfiring and carrying on and couldn't get a steady rpm at all. As soon as I changed the position it ran allot better and smooth. Now even with 90mm tb and the p port its like a turbine down to 1800rpm, nice and smooth Cheers On Saturday, 30 July 2016, Neil Unger wrote: > Steve, I did initially install the MAP sensor pipes in the oiling holes > and it was a total failure due to getting both vacuum and pressure in eac= h > cycle. Changed it back to just under the throttle bodies and all was > well. Oil holes definitely not! Neil. > > *From:* steve Izett > > *Sent:* Friday, July 29, 2016 11:37 PM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Further testing > > Hi Christian > What did irregular map signals look like in terms of engine running on > your engine? > What engine/setup do you have? > > Steve > > On 29 Jul 2016, at 7:50 PM, Christian And Tamara Mcdonald < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net > > wrote: > > Hi Steve > Just my 2 cents, I had irregular map signals so I installed a mig welding > tip for .6 wire and that sorted it out simply for me. > > Cheers > Christian > > On Friday, 29 July 2016, steve Izett > wrote: > >> Hi Guys >> >> We did further testing of the Renesis today. Would really appreciate you= r >> heads on this. >> Last series of tests we had this major missing and noise which I think i= s >> fuel exploding in the exhaust. >> This happens at various RPM=E2=80=99s based on load from the adjustable = prop. >> With fine pitch it would spin out to just over 7000rpm before striking >> this mayhem. >> With medium pitch it would get to 6000rpm before the same symptoms. >> From memory these were both at about 22-23 inches of Hg. >> My Wideband O2 is malfunctioning at present. >> The narrowband response time appears to slow to discover what the mixtur= e >> is doing during the episodes. >> >> Also still having trouble with the EM3. Sometimes display reads what >> appears to be an error message and at other times stops reading RPM. >> The Skyview Engine monitor has the same issue at the same RPM so appears >> directly related. >> I changed the input on the Skyview to the Standard RPM input as I >> incorrectly fed the injector pulse to the lower voltage input, but this >> made no difference. >> >> I had wondered if the secondary injectors weren=E2=80=99t getting power = and as a >> consequence when it staged to all 4 injectors the trouble began. >> Using the EM3 display (staging asterisk) and switching power off to the >> secondaries I was able to ascertain that the secondaries appear to be >> functioning fine. >> I did notice that the point of staging appears to be not solid. >> This takes me back to Ed=E2=80=99s comments re damping the manifold sign= al to the >> EC2. >> Sorry Ed, you might have had it right last week. I thought because it wa= s >> running so smoothly up to 23 inches that it wasn=E2=80=99t a signal issu= e. >> Maybe the wavelength/timing of those pulses at ~6000rpm matches the >> manifold signal tap position! >> >> Ed, you mentioned either small orifice or accumulator. I estimate the >> volume of the signal line to be approx 18 cubic centimetres. >> My gut was that the accumulator required to damp the signal would need t= o >> be an order of magnitude larger. (total guess) >> So maybe 180 cc=E2=80=99s but thats half a Coke can! Seem=E2=80=99s way = to big. >> Ed, did I understand you right that a small fuel filter can do the trick= ? >> I thought they would only be about 10 cc=E2=80=99s in volume. >> I suppose if the pulses are very narrow/short maybe thats all to takes t= o >> damp out the pulses. >> >> Can I ask the group please. Who had trouble with manifold signal and wha= t >> was the solution that worked best. >> Paul Lamar advocates tapping the signal from the oil injection ports. >> Has/is anyone using this solution? >> >> Thanks very much everyone. >> >> Steve Izett >> Glasair Super II RG >> Reneis 4 port EC2 EM3 RD1-C >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >> Archive and UnSub: >> http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html >> > > --001a113ef78448552b0538d02a2d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Steve
I found it would jump all over the place there was no steady r= eading until I installed the restricter, that was installed atop of my plen= um that I made, then I stuck it at the base of the throttle body and I got = a little more accurate readings, but the restricter made all the differance= for me the poor old computer didn't know what to make of it at first a= nd was backfiring and carrying on and couldn't get a steady rpm at all.= As soon as I changed the position it ran allot better and smooth.
Now even with 90mm tb and the p port its like a turbine down to 1800rpm, = nice and smooth

Cheers

On Saturday, 30 July= 2016, Neil Unger <flyrot= ary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Steve,=C2=A0 I did initially install the MAP sensor pipes in the oilin= g=20 holes and it was a total failure due to getting both vacuum and pressure in= each=20 cycle.=C2=A0 Changed it back to just under the throttle bodies and all was= =20 well.=C2=A0 Oil holes definitely not!=C2=A0 Neil.
=C2=A0
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 11:37 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Further testing
=C2=A0
= Hi=20 Christian=20
What did irregular map signals look like in terms of engine running on= your=20 engine?
What engine/setup do you have?
=C2=A0
Steve
On 29 Jul 2016, at 7:50 PM, Christian And Tamara Mcdonald <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>=20 wrote:
=C2=A0
Hi Steve=20
Just my 2 cents, I had irregular map signals so I installed a mig we= lding=20 tip for .6 wire and that sorted it out simply for me.
=C2=A0
Cheers
Christian

On Friday, 29 July 2016, steve Izett <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>=20 wrote:
Hi=20 Guys

We did further testing of the Renesis today. Would really= =20 appreciate your heads on this.
Last series of tests we had this majo= r=20 missing and noise which I think is fuel exploding in the exhaust.
Th= is=20 happens at various RPM=E2=80=99s based on load from the adjustable prop= .
With=20 fine pitch it would spin out to just over 7000rpm before striking this= =20 mayhem.
With medium pitch it would get to 6000rpm before the same=20 symptoms.
From memory these were both at about 22-23 inches of Hg.My=20 Wideband O2 is malfunctioning at present.
The narrowband response ti= me=20 appears to slow to discover what the mixture is doing during the=20 episodes.

Also still having trouble with the EM3. Sometimes disp= lay=20 reads what appears to be an error message and at other times stops read= ing=20 RPM.
The Skyview Engine monitor has the same issue at the same RPM s= o=20 appears directly related.
I changed the input on the Skyview to the= =20 Standard RPM input as I incorrectly fed the injector pulse to the lower= =20 voltage input, but this made no difference.

I had wondered if th= e=20 secondary injectors weren=E2=80=99t getting power and as a consequence = when it=20 staged to all 4 injectors the trouble began.
Using the EM3 display= =20 (staging asterisk) and switching power off to the secondaries I was abl= e to=20 ascertain that the secondaries appear to be functioning fine.
I did= =20 notice that the point of staging appears to be not solid.
This takes= me=20 back to Ed=E2=80=99s comments re damping the manifold signal to the EC2= .
Sorry=20 Ed, you might have had it right last week. I thought because it was run= ning=20 so smoothly up to 23 inches that it wasn=E2=80=99t a signal issue.
M= aybe the=20 wavelength/timing of those pulses at ~6000rpm matches the manifold sign= al=20 tap position!

Ed, you mentioned either small orifice or accumula= tor.=20 I estimate the volume of the signal line to be approx 18 cubic=20 centimetres.
My gut was that the accumulator required to damp the si= gnal=20 would need to be an order of magnitude larger. (total guess)
So mayb= e 180=20 cc=E2=80=99s but thats half a Coke can! Seem=E2=80=99s way to big.
E= d, did I understand=20 you right that a small fuel filter can do the trick? I thought they wou= ld=20 only be about 10 cc=E2=80=99s in volume.
I suppose if the pulses are= very=20 narrow/short maybe thats all to takes to damp out the pulses.

Ca= n I=20 ask the group please. Who had trouble with manifold signal and what was= the=20 solution that worked best.
Paul Lamar advocates tapping the signal f= rom=20 the oil injection ports. Has/is anyone using this solution?

Than= ks=20 very much everyone.

Steve Izett
Glasair Super II RG
Reneis= 4=20 port EC2 EM3 RD1-C








--
Homepage:= =C2=A0=20 http://www.flyr= otary.com/
Archive and=20 UnSub:=C2=A0=C2=A0 http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists= /flyrotary/List.html
=C2=A0
--001a113ef78448552b0538d02a2d--