X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Charlie England" Received: from mail-it0-f52.google.com ([209.85.214.52] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.11) with ESMTPS id 8782687 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 19:32:59 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.214.52; envelope-from=ceengland7@gmail.com Received: by mail-it0-f52.google.com with SMTP id h190so96053877ith.1 for ; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 16:32:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to; bh=t+19eS4xxM0AkfpTD2MVh9Z3gZzrp2KIkbDGV4tyqyY=; b=RnIoZe+JFD85jvjXUKfD+gybmJZs9y9F+PYcj8WI2uGpOPdHKsc/BkSB1lw9FMh25l eJGPCmP/0MK745bWTK/zhQJnkXEQkmmjAUyrBEC7LXSmuhciH5dGxcfC0j8udFmrJdVE GmcAo/d7E3zsL3yImhHwowZBSviH4Trnz2ayFrRlaBKH5baqnQPskpACDJXEeavj/u3M wj+q2xe026eEElWzaUiKwu4rcSkatKpakakRZVcyZ6eNxzK/iyv+D/nyRJjt11n8CKco WK5nKcRQ0mTYjKo1BXY1CxN8nQZhL/cbmlpk7ZXeYCQ5xXFDAcYrRBQKNISG37Aj3Uc9 yPYg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=t+19eS4xxM0AkfpTD2MVh9Z3gZzrp2KIkbDGV4tyqyY=; b=VDtv5Ur3fj8lmnohUZbvjWrTUC164IoOO/QALVXg/ZNcaown6LepX9UUKnioDOn/sf BPxsBuPqHKVJLKzv2CU25IvYV75jeqL/EzAeTOX/jBOHym98NJZdSZ1P4bnmJaLNsgGx 5hXI/hsOuvbCFUVJup61WTGEPG9AruCCyRVlaIpFrw16e6Rch+klJhZqS7mDM4/M8XAM +bbNPH7fFQo6IeU+JEEPi12VupZO90NMbvIAVaDY/5MSAmt6mAUbjMGXfv6uQn1dQ4Ax CA3mP0aWVJ2gaJyUGsaUH8QroCNMbNgYA6OO1f8ZVhiriHvVyXBxk9oI6p/TImF94LI/ NECg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tI3la+8fIL+6y/j+AOer4CUKN5SYZhJLD8AKTeryi3lwfiQJCp7MP4eJgj6tmuCGA== X-Received: by 10.36.121.70 with SMTP id z67mr16393677itc.23.1467761560496; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 16:32:40 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from ?IPv6:2602:306:25fa:de19:18b4:4aa0:3ca1:a0bf? ([2602:306:25fa:de19:18b4:4aa0:3ca1:a0bf]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id 41sm567361iod.43.2016.07.05.16.32.39 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Jul 2016 16:32:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis: just the ignition system To: Rotary motors in aircraft References: Message-ID: <44c5ec2d-bf4f-66d1-6a72-05eb5bac2b49@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 18:35:44 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------672F55C102DD99E0434D4091" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------672F55C102DD99E0434D4091 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hey Chad, why not go totally aircraft quality? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Slick-Magneto-2220-2-cylinder-government-surplus-NEW-/261131236190?hash=item3ccca2735e:m:mCxhlxs4nXtIFbbchDrOH6Q ;-) Seriously, which carb do you plan to use? While you can get away without a lot of ignition advance with a rotary, you still need to lean it at altitude. Options are out there, but don't forget that you need to have a plan to control mixture. Charlie On 7/5/2016 1:37 PM, Chad Peterson wrote: > > Might be interested. Was looking at ignition modules and the Pertronix > looks like the only one which actually carries multiple sparks past > 3000RPM. Also has crank angle offset setting which allows you to > adjust when the following sparks fire, would be good for a rotary due > to the longer burn time. Only allows to be set up in 4,6, or 8 > cylinder mode though so not sure how tach output will read. > > They don't offer siamesed coils though, so at minimum i would be > interested in those, and curious about other ignition parts available. > > Chad. > > On Jul 5, 2016 1:25 PM, "Bobby J. Hughes" > wrote: > > Chad, > > If you haven’t purchased the MSD coils I may have some available. > Mark Steitle did some experimenting with a similar setup and has a > box of MSD parts in his hanger. Not sure exactly what’s in the box > but parts were used for a few ground runs. Next trip to the hanger > I’ll do an inventory and take a picture. > > Bobby Hughes > > *From:*Rotary motors in aircraft > [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net > ] > *Sent:* Tuesday, July 05, 2016 12:02 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis: just the ignition system > > Interesting, > > Do you have pictures of this system? > > I haven't heard of firing both plugs per housing at the same time > (most fire the trailing plugs independently and the leading plugs > simultaneously with a waste spark cycle). This sounds pretty good, > considering only needing 2 modules instead of 3. > > On Jul 4, 2016 11:45 PM, "Lehanover" > wrote: > > One thick aluminum disc mounted on the front pulley. One iron > reluctor mounted in the edge of the disc. A length of 1/4" bolt > works fine. Make the disc the same diameter as a Mr. Gasket degree > wheel. Mount the degree wheel on the front of the disc. Makes > setting timing dead easy. > > Two pickups mounted 180 degrees apart to be tripped by the reluctor. > > One pickup fires an MSD or similar so as to light off a double > ended coil (MSD has these) or two Blaster coils in parallel if you > need the extra weight. To fire leading and trailing plugs in > housing one together. > > The second pickup fires housing two. Keep plug wires as short as > is possible. > > Adjust reluctor disc so as to fire plugs at 20 to 26 degrees BTDC. > Good from idle to 10,000 RPM and 250 HP. Used on racing engines > for years. Use NGK 11.5 heat range plugs gapped at .010". > > Non turbo engines only. Ignition timing is so accurate that the > engine appears to be not running when a timing light is used. > > Lynn E. Hanover > > In a message dated 7/4/2016 10:42:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > flyrotary@lancaironline.net > writes: > > Tracy > > I'm wanting to use a carbureted Renesis for my build. > Eliminating both the fuel injection system and the emissions > system, I have no need to keep the stock ECM. What would be > the easiest ignition system to use? I'm thinking a hall effect > crank angle sensor feeding an MSD 6A/Crane Fireball > Hi6/similar low cost unit and three coils: one for each > trailing plug and one for both leading plugs (leading plugs > fire a waste spark similar to the 2nd and 3rd generation RX7s). > > Would this be a matter of simply installing a universal > aftermarket crank trigger kit and having the sensors trigger > an ignition module? Would I need one or three ignition modules > to achieve this? > > Many thanks, > > Chad. > --------------672F55C102DD99E0434D4091 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Hey Chad, why not go totally aircraft quality?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Slick-Magneto-2220-2-cylinder-government-surplus-NEW-/261131236190?hash=item3ccca2735e:m:mCxhlxs4nXtIFbbchDrOH6Q

;-)

Seriously, which carb do you plan to use? While you can get away without a lot of ignition advance with a rotary, you still need to lean it at altitude. Options are out there, but don't forget that you need to have a plan to control mixture.

Charlie

On 7/5/2016 1:37 PM, Chad Peterson wrote:

Might be interested. Was looking at ignition modules and the Pertronix looks like the only one which actually carries multiple sparks past 3000RPM. Also has crank angle offset setting which allows you to adjust when the following sparks fire, would be good for a rotary due to the longer burn time. Only allows to be set up in 4,6, or 8 cylinder mode though so not sure how tach output will read.

They don't offer siamesed coils though, so at minimum i would be interested in those, and curious about other ignition parts available.

Chad.

On Jul 5, 2016 1:25 PM, "Bobby J. Hughes" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Chad,

 

If you haven’t purchased the MSD coils I may have some available. Mark Steitle did some experimenting with a similar setup and has a box of MSD parts in his hanger. Not sure exactly what’s in the box but parts were used for a few ground runs. Next trip to the hanger I’ll do an inventory and take a picture.

 

Bobby Hughes

 

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2016 12:02 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis: just the ignition system

 

Interesting,

Do you have pictures of this system?

I haven't heard of firing both plugs per housing at the same time (most fire the trailing plugs independently and the leading plugs simultaneously with a waste spark cycle). This sounds pretty good, considering only needing 2 modules instead of 3.

On Jul 4, 2016 11:45 PM, "Lehanover" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

One thick aluminum disc mounted on the front pulley. One iron reluctor mounted in the edge of the disc. A length of 1/4" bolt works fine. Make the disc the same diameter as a Mr. Gasket degree wheel. Mount the degree wheel on the front of the disc. Makes setting timing dead easy.

 

Two pickups mounted 180 degrees apart to be tripped by the reluctor.

 

One pickup fires an MSD or similar so as to light off a double ended coil (MSD has these) or two Blaster coils in parallel if you need the extra weight. To fire leading and trailing plugs in housing one together.

 

The second pickup fires housing two. Keep plug wires as short as is possible.

 

Adjust reluctor disc so as to fire plugs at 20 to 26 degrees BTDC. Good from idle to 10,000 RPM and 250 HP. Used on racing engines for years. Use NGK 11.5 heat range plugs gapped at .010". 

 

Non turbo engines only. Ignition timing is so accurate that the engine appears to be not running when a timing light is used.

 

Lynn E. Hanover

 

In a message dated 7/4/2016 10:42:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, flyrotary@lancaironline.net writes:

Tracy

 

I'm wanting to use a carbureted Renesis for my build. Eliminating both the fuel injection system and the emissions system, I have no need to keep the stock ECM. What would be the easiest ignition system to use? I'm thinking a hall effect crank angle sensor feeding an MSD 6A/Crane Fireball Hi6/similar low cost unit and three coils: one for each trailing plug and one for both leading plugs (leading plugs fire a waste spark similar to the 2nd and 3rd generation RX7s).

 

Would this be a matter of simply installing a universal aftermarket crank trigger kit and having the sensors trigger an ignition module? Would I need one or three ignition modules to achieve this?

 

Many thanks,

Chad. 


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