X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Tracy" Received: from mail-oi0-f42.google.com ([209.85.218.42] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.9e) with ESMTPS id 7102748 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 18 Aug 2014 17:42:59 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.218.42; envelope-from=rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by mail-oi0-f42.google.com with SMTP id a3so3990420oib.15 for ; Mon, 18 Aug 2014 14:42:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:references:from:content-type:in-reply-to:message-id:date:to :content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=7YzAHMBWgGvuqyUHIs13ML/9GnEdNIsFq5U7qgRlWOE=; b=ey9t6WZ/D730Bh4mCbIB/Q2O72qw5rFRT/dDIzTrst4xfwVJyJ8Wte3OWeyCy1I5/r wj2ebOYL03vVuaAkk2eYS5czF5tLwWFqmzzEIt2dd1y3OoXI3i6T+HuIrlKH7AYk5Dtg XbNSoM4KId7Akz016cncAPwLPvUpwk31YufEg9f7ztO2IEl/LYF56KIRfVG/Y/Tbn4iW m75yrPkK0h0RURvtjDclpbjFd4zAnL3/19Qo9miLcg5g2tLR/z7ENUNThnJ1VaSG96HU UJGv0gYLfzzcc5GV1omZVaxI7T6PJXJMBvvypeT6hsbp0IoxTcFR3cSB/1XqklNViqzM IEbw== X-Received: by 10.60.160.38 with SMTP id xh6mr4809116oeb.82.1408398143123; Mon, 18 Aug 2014 14:42:23 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from [192.168.1.2] (255.sub-70-196-207.myvzw.com. [70.196.207.255]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id lk2sm19385628obc.15.2014.08.18.14.42.21 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Aug 2014 14:42:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Heated Seats References: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-1B99DC49-A2F3-44AA-9451-5F2EE4D11DBD X-Mailer: iPad Mail (11D257) In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <00FDF921-5B74-4FEE-A30F-FA0CDE3E88D9@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2014 15:42:20 -0600 To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) --Apple-Mail-1B99DC49-A2F3-44AA-9451-5F2EE4D11DBD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Kelly, Still have my place at Shady Bend Airpark but been spending a lot of time= in summer and fall at the shack I built in Colorado. Decided to move the R= V-8 since I missed my flying fixes while in CO and give myself an incentive t= o fix up the RV-4 which has been gathering dust since finishing the -8. =20 Tracy Sent from my iPad > On Aug 18, 2014, at 10:57, "Kelly Troyer" wr= ote: >=20 > Tracy, > Is this a full time move or do you still have the Florida place ??....= .....Nosy minds want to know !!.........<:) >=20 > Kelly troyer >=20 >=20 >> On Mon, Aug 18, 2014 at 6:06 AM, Tracy wrot= e: >> Got the seat heater kits from Dave's source on Amazon and very impressed w= ith the quality for that price. I wondered about the possibility of heat pr= oblems on the memory foam like Charlie mentioned. May try putting some sor= t of insulation between heater and seat foam. >>=20 >> Here is a pic of "Euphoriac" (the RV-8, not the girl) on the ramp at her n= ew home in Salida, CO. Density altitude often exceeds 10,000 ft here so th= e big engine and longer wings make it the perfect airplane for high altitude= airports. =20 >>=20 >> Tracy >>=20 >> >>=20 >> Sent from my iPad >>=20 >>> On Aug 7, 2014, at 13:21, "Charlie England" wrote: >>>=20 >>> I wonder if the heat will have an adverse effect on any of the 'memory f= oam' type seat foams. 120 degrees is nothing, but 140+ makes me wonder a bit= . >>>=20 >>> Charlie >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>> On Thu, Aug 7, 2014 at 11:54 AM, hoursaway1 wrote: >>>> One problem is that with most of our aircraft we have to step onto the s= eat to enter cockpit. In the automotive world we have discovered the highest= number of heated seat failures comes from cust. nealing on the seats to do w= hatever, element breakages are main failure mode. With that being said, I ha= ve the elements, switch & relay to install on my RV6A some day. David R. C= ook ASE Auto Tech 36 years, RV6A Rotary.=20 >>>>=20 >>>> From: "Fly rotary blog, e-mail" >>>> To: "Fly rotary blog, e-mail" >>>> Sent: Thursday, August 7, 2014 9:34:08 AM >>>>=20 >>>> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Heated Seats >>>>=20 >>>> Here is the product description from the web site. 3-5 amps. >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Carbon Fiber technology, heats up in seconds with even heat distributio= n >>>>=20 >>>> 3 Year Warranty for the heat pads. 1 Year Warranty for the Electric par= ts. >>>>=20 >>>> Deluxe illuminated Dual Temperature High/Off/Low Round Switch >>>>=20 >>>> Dual Temperature Control System Electronic thermostat (built into each p= ad) regulates the electricity / temperature circulating within the carbon fi= ber seat heating pad. This system regulates the flow of power and maintains a= narrower temperature range whether in a high or low setting. >>>>=20 >>>> Example: The high setting will have a constant range between 140=C2=B0F= to 145=C2=B0F. The low setting ranges between 120=C2=B0F to 125=C2=B0F. The= se respective temperatures are maintained at these respective levels. >>>>=20 >>>> Included in the wiring harness is a relay that controls the power / tem= perature of the heating pads from high to low with an in-line fuse. Backrest= & Seat Bottom Heating Pads -- 18" x 11" Pads are approximately 1/32" thick.= Either pad can be installed in back or bottom. >>>>=20 >>>> Electrical Specs Wattage: 24~36 Watts per Pad, 48~60 Watts per seat Cur= rent Draw: 3 Amps on Low Heat Setting and 5 Amps on High Setting per Seat. I= t is a 12 V system >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Bob J. Rogers >>>>=20 >>>> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20= >>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2014 7:37 PM >>>> To: Rotary motors in aircraft >>>> Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Heated Seats >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Sounds like the perfect solution Dave. I wondered what results were us= ing water or oil. I'm relieved not to have to even think about doing the pl= umbing either would involve. Will go shopping for the seats and look for th= e specs but do you know the current draw off hand? >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Tracy >>>>=20 >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> On Aug 6, 2014, at 13:35, "David Leonard" = wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> Hi Tracy, thanks for the trip report!. >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> The rotary is hard to get cabin heat. The exhaust is bigger diameter t= han most aircraft exhaust, so off the shelf heat muffs are hard to come by, n= ot to mention difficult to fit (finding space) and potentially dangerous. I= have had poor success at getting sufficient heat off the oil or water coole= r. So besides sealing up cabin leaks, I found the soulution, heated seats.=20= >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Got these on Amazon for $45 for TWO seats. Installed in a couple of ho= urs. Work great. My tush can only take the high setting for 20 min or so. = Makes all the difference. >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005PJ334G >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Dave Leonard >>>>=20 >>>> Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tracy wr= ote: >>>>=20 >>>> Here's some trip data from a flight from Florida to Colorado in the 20B= powered RV-8. It's the first long trip where I was able to fly at or nea= r the altitudes it was optimized for. It didn't do as well as I had hoped i= n terms of fuel economy but the numbers were as good or slightly better than= the typical Lycoming powered RV numbers I hear. It is only slightly faste= r than my Renesis powered RV-4 at cruise conditions and reasonable fuel flow= . But what I like about it is the effortlessness with which it does the job= . There is always a handful of throttle left for reserve in any normal flig= ht situation. >>>>=20 >>>> Full throttle is reserved for those few seconds between rudder effectiv= eness at 30mph and lift off speed at 60. As soon as the wheels break ground= I typically reduce manifold pressure to 24". Cruise climb is done at betw= een 18 and 19" depending on takeoff weight at around 700 FPM. Cruise altitu= de was limited to 15,000 this trip by temperature. I wasn't thinking and wo= re only a thin jacket and I don't have cabin heat. All three legs were flo= wn at 14,500 in a very unusual high pressure system the whole way with almos= t zero wind. Here are the raw numbers: >>>>=20 >>>> Altitude 14,500 >>>> OAT 35 - 43F >>>> TAS 174 - 182 MPH * >>>> Fuel Flow 8 GPH >>>> Engine RPM 5250 - 5450 >>>> Manifold Pressure 14.3" >>>> % Power 30% (As calculated by EM3) >>>> EGT 1450F >>>> Water temp 145 - 150 >>>> Oil Temp 160 (Cowl flap would help temps and airspeed) >>>> Total flight hours on trip 9.2 >>>>=20 >>>> * Fuel flow was held constant, TAS varied with fuel batch. Low number= was with Florida gas with about 8% ethanol. Refueled at Charlie England's= place (Thanks for the hospitality and fuel service Charlie!). Not sure wet= her it had ethanol or not but TAS was a few MPH better. After refueling at= 47K in Kansas with no ethanol mogas, the TAS reached the highest number. >>>>=20 >>>> Tracy >>>>=20 >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> -- >>>> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >>>> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/L= ist.html >>>>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Kelly Troyer > Dyke Delta_"Eventually" > 13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2 --Apple-Mail-1B99DC49-A2F3-44AA-9451-5F2EE4D11DBD Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Kelly,
   Still= have my place at Shady Bend Airpark but been spending a lot of time in summ= er and fall at the shack I built in Colorado.  Decided to move the RV-8= since I missed my flying fixes while in CO and give myself an incentive to f= ix up the RV-4 which has been gathering dust since finishing the -8.  <= /div>

Tracy

Sent from my iPad

On Aug= 18, 2014, at 10:57, "Kelly Troyer" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Tracy,
   Is this a &nb= sp;full time move or do you still have the Florida place ??.........Nosy min= ds want to know !!.........<:)

Kelly troyer


On Mon, Aug 18, 2014 at 6:06 AM, Tracy <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Got the seat heater kits from Dave's source on Amazon= and very impressed with the quality for that price.  I wondered about t= he possibility of heat problems on the memory foam like Charlie mentioned. &= nbsp; May try putting some sort of insulation between heater and seat foam.<= /div>

Here is a pic of "Euphoriac" (the RV-8, not the girl) on= the ramp at her new home in Salida, CO.   Density altitude often excee= ds 10,000 ft here so the big engine and longer wings make it the perfect air= plane for high altitude airports.  

Tracy

<image.jpeg>
Sent from my iPad

On Aug 7, 2014, at 13:21, "Charlie England"= <flyrot= ary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

I wonder if the he= at will have an adverse effect on any of the 'memory foam' type seat foams. 1= 20 degrees is nothing, but 140+ makes me wonder a bit.

Charlie


On Thu, Aug 7, 2014 at 11:54 AM, hoursawa= y1 <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
One p= roblem is that with most of our aircraft we have to step onto the seat to en= ter cockpit. In the automotive world we have discovered the highest number o= f heated seat failures comes from cust. nealing on the seats to do whatever,= element breakages are main failure mode. With that being said, I have t= he elements, switch & relay to install on my RV6A some day.   &= nbsp;David R. Cook ASE Auto Tech 36 years, RV6A Rotary.

From: "= Fly rotary blog, e-mail" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
To: "Fly rotary blog, e-mail" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent= : Thursday, August 7, 2014 9:34:08 AM

Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Heated Seats

Here is the product description from the web site.&= nbsp; 3-5 amps.

 

Carbon Fiber technology, heats up in seconds with even heat dist= ribution

3 Year Warranty for the heat pads. 1 Year Warranty for the E= lectric parts.

Deluxe illuminated Dual Temperature High/Off/Low Round Switch

Dua= l Temperature Control System Electronic thermostat (built into each pad) reg= ulates the electricity / temperature circulating within the carbon fiber sea= t heating pad. This system regulates the flow of power and maintains a narro= wer temperature range whether in a high or low setting.

Example: The high setting will have a constant range between 140=C2=B0F t= o 145=C2=B0F. The low setting ranges between 120=C2=B0F to 125=C2=B0F. These= respective temperatures are maintained at these respective levels.

I= ncluded in the wiring harness is a relay that controls the power / temperatu= re of the heating pads from high to low with an in-line fuse. Backrest &= Seat Bottom Heating Pads -- 18" x 11" Pads are approximately 1/32" thick. E= ither pad can be installed in back or bottom.

Electrical Specs Wattage: 24~36 Watts p= er Pad, 48~60 Watts per seat Current Draw: 3 Amps on Low Heat Setting and 5 A= mps on High Setting per Seat. It is a 12 V system

 

Bob J. Rogers

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] <= br> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2014 7:37 PM
To: Rotary motors i= n aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Heated Seats

<= /div>

 

Sounds like the perfect solution Dave.  I wonder= ed what results were using water or oil.  I'm relieved not to have to e= ven think about doing the plumbing either would involve.  Will go shopp= ing for the seats and look for the specs but do you know the current draw of= f hand?

 

Tracy

Sent from my iPad


On Aug 6, 2014, at 1= 3:35, "David Leonard" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Hi Tracy, thanks for the trip report!.

 

The rotary is hard to get cabin heat.  The exhau= st is bigger diameter than most aircraft exhaust, so off the shelf heat muff= s are hard to come by, not to mention difficult to fit (finding space) and p= otentially dangerous.  I have had poor success at getting sufficient he= at off the oil or water cooler.  So besides sealing up cabin leaks, I f= ound the soulution, heated seats. 

 

Got these on Amazon for $45 for TWO seats.  Inst= alled in a couple of hours.  Work great.  My tush can only take th= e high setting for 20 min or so.  Makes all the difference.

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005PJ334G

 

Dave Leonard

Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY

 

 

 

On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 11:38 AM, Tracy <flyrotary@lancaironli= ne.net> wrote:

Here's some trip data from a flight from Florida to C= olorado in the 20B powered RV-8.    It's the first long trip where= I was able to fly at or near the altitudes it was optimized for.   It d= idn't do as well as I had hoped in terms of fuel economy but the numbers wer= e as good or slightly better than the typical Lycoming powered RV numbers I h= ear.   It is only slightly faster than my Renesis powered RV-4 at cruis= e conditions and reasonable fuel flow.  But what I like about it is the= effortlessness with which it does the job.  There is always a handful o= f throttle left for reserve in any normal flight situation.

Full throttle is reserved for those few seconds between rudder effective= ness at 30mph and lift off speed at 60.  As soon as the wheels break gr= ound I typically reduce manifold pressure to 24".   Cruise climb is don= e at between 18 and 19" depending on takeoff weight at around 700 FPM.  = ;Cruise altitude was limited to 15,000 this trip by temperature.  I was= n't thinking and wore only a thin jacket and I don't have cabin heat.  = All three legs were flown at 14,500 in a very unusual high pressure system t= he whole way with almost zero wind.  Here are the raw numbers:

Altitude       14,500
OAT         &= nbsp;    35 -  43F
TAS           &= nbsp;  174  -   182 MPH  *
Fuel Flow     8 G= PH
Engine RPM  5250 - 5450
Manifold Pressure    14.3"% Power       30%   (As calculated by EM3)
EGT              1450F
Water temp &nbs= p; 145 - 150
Oil Temp       160        = ;(Cowl flap would help temps and airspeed)
Total flight hours on trip &nb= sp;9.2

*  Fuel flow was held constant, TAS varied with fuel batc= h.  Low number was with Florida gas with about 8% ethanol.   Refue= led at Charlie England's place (Thanks for the hospitality and fuel service C= harlie!).  Not sure wether it had ethanol or not but TAS was a few MPH b= etter.   After refueling at 47K in Kansas with no ethanol mogas, the TA= S reached the highest number.

Tracy

Sent from my iPad
--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html

 






<= /div>--
Kelly Troyer
Dyke Delta_"Eventually"
13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2
= --Apple-Mail-1B99DC49-A2F3-44AA-9451-5F2EE4D11DBD--