X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-bw0-f226.google.com ([209.85.218.226] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.2) with ESMTP id 4125786 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 15:10:21 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.218.226; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by bwz26 with SMTP id 26so4168060bwz.7 for ; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 12:09:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=q52G7eaU7sHpd/jwYpAlJL8RGG5GmhbSUllTksMgEKI=; b=uVFdC+Dc+7lNzd0U1fYMGqc6J4ZnSK+dt5uIz4SUSQezbGHca3UoDR+XHjSP2iylKe VaK1lNtjvUP+skwkHUT0lQyWA6dFOJkzN1Y12QqMvg2zeF7nw042/OlXydZIYt1qJ9Ec 68WlLQo9JsjWDtBP/FnXNuOY1d1sSj0BSpy2c= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=OV3FL2kBs0S883vUrP+y2NAvWUQfLe109MimTA6TtQ1eGqvMxXUnzGLEU+q/KJW4fi xO5t3dc84cVmWFPlpzi6xQgs4lO96hHNLBKEyN9cdiUwm7VFSzN35gxzR99rNsWwKUQi zMQBH6H7wl822saY1Nd9uX4Z+NjW3TsI12UlI= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.15.17 with SMTP id i17mr3532394bka.173.1266264586159; Mon, 15 Feb 2010 12:09:46 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2010 14:09:46 -0600 Message-ID: <5cf132c1002151209m2b4e9924w9444624c294223e1@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] PSRU oiling question From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00032555a7eed98785047fa932cf --00032555a7eed98785047fa932cf Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Chris, Yes, its cold here in Austin too, but nothing like the rest of the country. ;-) When checking your psru for gear lash prior to starting, it should move freely with about a 1/4-3/8" movement at the prop tips. If the bearing was binding, you should have been able to feel excessive resistance when performing this pre-flight check. Also, you should not feel any movement when pushing and pulling in and out on the prop. Based on my limited knowledge of the RWS gearbox, this would make me suspicious of a bad bearing out near the prop flange. I would expect the oil to gravity feed slowly into the box. However, you could disconnect the drain line and put a temporary line into the oil filler cap, or bucket, and idle the engine and observe that there is adequate flow. Or, you could replace the drain line with a clear line and watch to be sure there is good flow. Until Tracy looked at your box, I would have been suspicious of a blocked oil feed hole. But if that was the case, I'm sure Tracy would have noticed and corrected it. Have you checked that the psru oil feed line is not blocked? Mark S. On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 1:33 PM, Chris Barber wrote: > I just received my PSRU back from Tracy. If I understand his explanation > correctly my prop shaft bearing at the end near the prop (pusher) bound up > somehow. He machined it, made other needed adjustments (?) and sent it > back to me very promptly...bout a week turn around (of course I dropped a > bit on overnight shipping to make sure he got it before he was off again > ). > > The problem may have been due to a couple of factors....not really sure, > but I discovered it after my plane was sitting out of the hangar due to roof > repairs for about 6 or 7 weeks. When I went up to start it to taxi back to > the hangar, I pulled the prop through a few times by hand and all seemed > fine. I started it up, started, was tickled, but it it stalled. Did I > mention it was REALLY cold for Houston...about 27 degrees. I started it > again and is sounded "labored" and was running poorly. It was about 1:00 am > (I had just gotten off duty), so I figured I call it a night. I got out and > turned the prop through again and could barely turn the prop. Damn. I > thought I toasted another engine. Damn. > > A couple of days later a friend and I pushed the plane back to the hangar > and I walked away from the issue for a couple of weeks. Went so far as to > even looking at financing a Lyc . I distracted myself by doing > some interior work and wiring...actually got my radios far enough along to > listen to ATIS for a few minutes...on the bench. > > Finally, two days after my recent loss, I forced myself to the hangar and > pulled the PSRU. I had already looked inside the exhaust ports and the > chambers looked clean and smooth. I had also drained the oil, with a magnet > (I know, some is aluminum) in the drain filter and found it all to be > perfectly clean. Well, without the PSRU the engine turned perfectly > making that sweet churning sound through the open spark plug holes. > > I turned to the PSRU. I took out each section slooooowly. No signs of > binding, chipping or any other damage in each part....until I got to the > last section, the sealed section by the prop. The prop hub would not turn. > I could barely turn it with the prop on. Without the prop is was a no go. > So, I sent it to Tracy. > > ANYWAY, now that I have it back mounted on the bird I am curious as to the > oil going into the system. Even though I went through this > long explanation, I only have a questions about the oil entering the PSRU. > There is no reason to suspect any oiling issues caused the previous > problem...I just like to share on occasion. However, last night when I was > hooking up everything I decided to pour some oil directly into the in oil > hole on top of the PSRU. My curiosity is that it just kinda set there and > very slowly seemed to seep into the PSRU. Does oil pressure forced it > into the PSRU, thus getting more oil in. I would think with everythingspinning etc under power the oil flow etc would be much more dynamic, thus > providing a more significant lubricating event. I don't really know what I > was expecting. my oil flow seems good. It just got me thinking and wanting > to have a better understanding. TIA > > All the best, > > Chris > Houston, GSOT > --00032555a7eed98785047fa932cf Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Chris,
=A0
Yes, its cold here in Austin too, but nothing like the rest of the cou= ntry.=A0 ;-)=A0
=A0
When=A0checking your psru for gear lash prior to starting,=A0it should= move freely with about a 1/4-3/8" movement at the prop tips.=A0=A0If= =A0the bearing was=A0binding,=A0you should have been able to feel excessive= resistance when performing this pre-flight check.=A0=A0Also, you should no= t feel any movement=A0when pushing=A0and pulling in and out on the prop.=A0= Based on my limited knowledge of the RWS gearbox, this would make me suspi= cious of a bad bearing out near the prop flange.
=A0
I would expect=A0the oil=A0to gravity feed slowly=A0into the box.=A0 H= owever, you could=A0disconnect the drain line and put=A0a temporary line in= to=A0the oil filler cap, or bucket,=A0and=A0idle the engine=A0and observe= =A0that there is adequate=A0flow.=A0 Or, you could replace the drain line w= ith a=A0clear line and watch to be sure there is good flow.=A0=A0Until Trac= y looked at=A0your box, I would have been suspicious of a=A0blocked=A0oil f= eed hole.=A0 But if that was the case, I'm sure Tracy would have notice= d and corrected it.=A0 Have you checked that the psru oil feed line is not = blocked?=A0
=A0
Mark S.

=A0
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 1:33 PM, Chris Barber <cbarber@te= xasattorney.net> wrote:
I just=A0received my=A0PSRU back from Tracy.=A0 I= f I understand his explanation correctly my prop shaft bearing at the end n= ear the prop (pusher) bound up somehow.=A0 He machined it, made othe= r needed adjustments (?) and sent it back to me very promptly...bout a week= turn around (of course I dropped a bit on overnight=A0shipping to m= ake sure he got it before he was off again <g>).
=A0
The problem may have been due to a couple of factors....not really sur= e, but I discovered it after my plane was sitting out of the hangar due to = roof repairs for about 6 or 7 weeks.=A0 When I went up to start it to taxi = back to the hangar, I pulled the prop through a few times by hand and all s= eemed fine.=A0 I started it up, started, was tickled, but it=A0it= stalled.=A0Did I mention it was REALLY cold for Houston...about 27 deg= rees.=A0 I started it again and is sounded "labored" and was runn= ing poorly.=A0 It was about 1:00 am (I had just gotten off duty), so I figu= red I call it a night.=A0 I got out and turned the prop through again and c= ould barely turn the prop. Damn.=A0 I thought I toasted another engine. Dam= n.
=A0
A couple of days later a friend and I pushed the plane back to the han= gar and I walked away from the issue for a couple of weeks. Went so far as = to even looking at financing a=A0Lyc <shudder>.=A0 I di= stracted myself by doing some interior work and wiring...actually got my ra= dios far enough along to listen to=A0ATIS for a few minutes..= .on the bench.
=A0
Finally, two days after my recent loss, I forced myself to the hangar = and pulled the PSRU.=A0 I had already looked inside the exhau= st ports and the chambers looked clean and smooth.=A0 I had also drained th= e oil, with a magnet (I know, some is aluminum) in the drain filter and fou= nd it all to be perfectly clean.=A0 Well, without the=A0PSRU = the engine turned perfectly making that sweet churning sound through the op= en spark plug holes.
=A0
I turned to the PSRU.=A0 I=A0took out each sectio= n slooooowly.=A0 No signs of binding, chipping or any other d= amage in each part....until I got to the last section, the sealed section b= y the prop.=A0 The prop hub would not turn.=A0 I could barely turn it with = the prop on. Without the prop is was a no go.=A0 So, I sent it to Tracy.
=A0
ANYWAY, now that I have it back mounted on the bird I am curious as to= the oil going into=A0the system.=A0 Even though I went through this long= =A0explanation, I only have a questions about the oil entering the PSRU<= /a>.=A0 There is no reason to suspect any oiling issues caused the p= revious problem...I just like to share on occasion.=A0 However, last night = when I was hooking up=A0everything I decided to pour some oil=A0dire= ctly into the in oil hole on top of the PSRU.=A0 My cu= riosity is that it just=A0kinda set there and very slowly see= med to seep into the PSRU.=A0 Does oil pressure forced it int= o the PSRU, thus getting more oil in.=A0 I would think with= =A0everything spinning etc under power the oil flow etc would be muc= h more dynamic, thus providing a more significant lubricating event.=A0 I d= on't really know what I was expecting.=A0 my oil flow seems good.=A0 It= just got me thinking and wanting to have a better understanding.=A0 TIA
=A0
All the best,
=A0
Chris
Houston, GSOT

--00032555a7eed98785047fa932cf--