X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from poplet2.per.eftel.com ([203.24.100.45] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.16) with ESMTP id 3859344 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 19 Sep 2009 02:19:07 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=203.24.100.45; envelope-from=lendich@aanet.com.au Received: from sv1-1.aanet.com.au (sv1-1.per.aanet.com.au [203.24.100.68]) by poplet2.per.eftel.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D738A173795 for ; Sat, 19 Sep 2009 14:18:30 +0800 (WST) Received: from ownerf1fc517b8 (203.171.92.134.static.rev.aanet.com.au [203.171.92.134]) by sv1-1.aanet.com.au (Postfix) with SMTP id 72D31BEC01C for ; Sat, 19 Sep 2009 14:18:28 +0800 (WST) Message-ID: <4CC8CA19015642DDBE86D3E67C1F6C83@ownerf1fc517b8> From: "George Lendich" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] "P" ports (was) Three or two? Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 16:18:34 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01CA3944.D64C6290" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5843 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 090918-0, 09/18/2009), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01CA3944.D64C6290 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Kelly, Sorry have no photo of the insert but it's simple enough. Just weld the = insert to the housing in the water jacket area and back-fill with high = temp resin - pressurize it if you wish, I probably will, just in case. George ( down under) George, Interesting exchange on this subject again..............Jerry Hey = of this group is/was doing some "P" ports utilizing an aluminum insert.........I think a sealant = was then used for the rest of the cavity...........Have not heard from Jerry for a while (jump in = here if you are listening Jerry) but photos looked good.......Do you have access to any photos = from "Down Under" George showing the aluminum inserts and/or the same welded in place = ??............. =20 -- Kelly Troyer=20 "Dyke Delta"_13B ROTARY Engine=20 "RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2=20 "Mistral"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=20 -------------- Original message from "George Lendich" = : --------------=20 Bill, Good on Ya! I'm a bit behind my e-mails BTW. I have a great solution for the PP problems of leaking coolant. I = notice that PL advocates welding to the inner rotor steel liner - = however not much to weld to, and then pressurizes the resin filler. Now this is not my idea but it sis working well locally and that is = to weld a Al tube to the inner Al housing - weld it rights around and = then fill the remainder with resin. Seems to work much better than what = was done previously and ahs held up in well in racing applications.=20 George ( down under) ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WRJJRS@aol.com=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 5:06 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Three or two? Gonzalo, Sorry to be contrary, but in my opinion the ONLY way to go for a = flying rotary is P-port. All of the original Power Sport engines (the = Everette Hatch P.S.) ran P-ports. The manifolding for a P-port engine is = vastly easier. In fact Hatch and Steve Beckham built several engines = with P-ports that even ran reverse rotation so they could get proper = propeller rotation with some gearboxes. You can even P-port an Renesis = and it still works. The reason that Mazda isn't P-porting their race = cars has nothing to do with if P-porting is better, it is racing = organizations requirements. The reason for the side port Renesis is for = emissions and low RPM fuel economy. Those are areas that are only = important in a CAR. The typical aircraft runs 50% to 90% ALL THE TIME = and P-ports are much better at mid to high RPMS. The Mazda Le Mans = winning engine used P-ports and they were running with a fuel economy = formula. (the fuel was limited) For high output P-ports just work = better. Bill Jepson Gonzalo, A lot of people talk about peripheral porting rotaries but = nobody is doing it with a rotary that they plan to fly behind. If it = was such a good thing, Mazda would be P-Porting their cars. Instead = they are going away even from the peripheral port for the exhaust with = the Renesis. =20 If 200 HP will do it for you the Renesis is the way to go. This = process of putting an alternative engine in a plane is hard enough = without violating the KISS principle. Put in a Renesis, no turbo, no P-Port. Bill B =20 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Rotary motors in aircraft = [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of George Lendich Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 5:57 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Three or two? =20 Gonzalo, I don't know if the Renesis has a turbo version, I didn't think = it did. All turbo 13B's require low compression rotors. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01CA3944.D64C6290 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =EF=BB=BF
 Kelly,
Sorry have no photo of the insert but = it's simple=20 enough. Just weld the insert to the housing in the water jacket area and = back-fill with high temp resin - pressurize it if you wish, I probably = will,=20 just in case.
George ( down under)
George,
     Interesting exchange on this subject=20 again..............Jerry Hey of this group is/was doing
some "P" ports utilizing an aluminum insert.........I think a = sealant was=20 then used for the rest
of the cavity...........Have not heard from Jerry for a while = (jump in=20 here if you are listening
Jerry) but photos looked good.......Do you have access to any = photos from=20 "Down Under"
George showing the aluminum inserts and/or the same welded = in place=20 ??.............  
--
Kelly Troyer
"Dyke = Delta"_13B=20 ROTARY Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"Mistral"_Backplate/Oil = Manifold=20



 
--------------=20 Original message from "George Lendich" <lendich@aanet.com.au>: = --------------

Bill,
Good on Ya! I'm a bit behind my e-mails BTW.
 
I have a great solution for the PP problems of leaking coolant. = I=20 notice that PL advocates welding to the inner rotor steel liner - = however=20 not much to weld to, and then pressurizes the resin filler.
Now this is not my idea but it sis working well locally and = that is to=20 weld a Al tube to the inner Al housing - weld it rights around and = then fill=20 the remainder with resin. Seems to work much better than what was = done=20 previously and ahs held up in well in racing = applications. 
George ( down under)
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 WRJJRS@aol.com=20
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Monday, September 07, = 2009 5:06=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Three or=20 two?

Gonzalo,
Sorry to be contrary, but in my opinion the ONLY way to go = for a=20 flying rotary is P-port. All of the original Power Sport engines = (the=20 Everette Hatch P.S.) ran P-ports. The manifolding for a P-port = engine is=20 vastly easier. In fact Hatch and Steve Beckham built several = engines with=20 P-ports that even ran reverse rotation so they could get proper = propeller=20 rotation with some gearboxes. You can even P-port an Renesis and = it still=20 works. The reason that Mazda isn't P-porting their race cars has = nothing=20 to do with if P-porting is better, it is racing organizations=20 requirements. The reason for the side port Renesis is for = emissions and=20 low RPM fuel economy. Those are areas that are only important in a = CAR.=20 The typical aircraft runs 50% to 90% ALL THE TIME and P-ports are = much=20 better at mid to high RPMS. The Mazda Le Mans winning engine used = P-ports=20 and they were running with a fuel economy formula. (the fuel was = limited)=20 For high output P-ports just work better.
Bill Jepson

Gonzalo,

A lot = of people=20 talk about peripheral porting rotaries but nobody is doing it = with a=20 rotary that they plan to fly behind.  If it was such a good = thing,=20 Mazda would be P-Porting their cars.  Instead they are = going away=20 even from the peripheral port for the exhaust with the = Renesis. =20

If = 200 HP will=20 do it for you the Renesis is the way to go.  This process = of=20 putting an alternative engine in a plane is hard enough without=20 violating the KISS principle.

Put = in a=20 Renesis, no turbo, no P-Port.

Bill=20 B

 

From:=20 Rotary motors in = aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of George=20 Lendich
Sent: = Sunday,=20 August 23, 2009 5:57 PM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Three or=20 two?

 

Gonzalo,

I don't know if = the Renesis=20 has a turbo version, I didn't think it did. All turbo 13B's = require=20 low compression = rotors.

 
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