X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [64.12.143.101] (HELO imo-m13.mail.aol.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2c4) with ESMTP id 2629754 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 03 Jan 2008 15:28:41 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.143.101; envelope-from=WRJJRS@aol.com Received: from WRJJRS@aol.com by imo-m13.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r9.3.) id q.bc0.234f2552 (37140) for ; Thu, 3 Jan 2008 15:27:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from FWM-D16 (fwm-d16.webmail.aol.com [205.188.160.208]) by cia-ma03.mx.aol.com (v121.4) with ESMTP id MAILCIAMA032-9114477d454c39d; Thu, 03 Jan 2008 15:27:56 -0500 References: To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Weak Spark Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2008 15:27:56 -0500 X-AOL-IP: 65.161.241.3 In-Reply-To: X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: wrjjrs@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="--------MB_8CA1C5E42850D36_9F0_16A2_FWM-D16.sysops.aol.com" X-Mailer: AOL Webmail 33161-STANDARD Received: from 65.161.241.3 by FWM-D16.sysops.aol.com (205.188.160.208) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Thu, 03 Jan 2008 15:27:56 -0500 Message-Id: <8CA1C5E42850D36-9F0-B24@FWM-D16.sysops.aol.com> X-Spam-Flag: NO ----------MB_8CA1C5E42850D36_9F0_16A2_FWM-D16.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" AL, Pardon me for all the basic reminders but some of these things get forgotten= . Do you have a ground on the coils? often the auto coils use the engine/fir= ewall or brackets to close the gap on the coil core. Some are internal and d= on't need it. The rotary isn't that hard to turn over so you should get a pr= etty strong spark when cranking. The starter shouldn't draw so much that the= spark would diminish. In air with the plugs out you should see at least 1/4= ". The old mechanics rhyme was "Red is dead, blue will do, and white is all=20= right." Be sure that you have a good solid wire for eletrical FEED to the co= ils. Sometimes we don't do that right. I know you have run this engine a lot= including dyno time, so I'm sorry for the ultra basic stuff, but sometimes=20= we tend to blow right past it, once we have the engine running. Bill Jepson -----Original Message----- From: Al Gietzen To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 11:18 am Subject: [FlyRotary] Weak Spark =C2=A0 =C2=A0 All this talk of weak spark got me thinking again about my 20B. It has the s= tock CAS. I have found that the spark is weak and sometimes intermittent whe= n cranking. =C2=A0When I noted this, I was sure something was wrong.=C2=A0 I= then checked using the Mode 8, and the spark was great. It would start and=20= run, so I forgot about it. The engine always started and runs fine, but I ha= ve noticed more recently on cold mornings (meaning about 40F here in SoCal)=20= that the starting was a little more hesitant, and would fire intermittently=20= for a bit before getting going. =C2=A0 I recall when we were checking timing on the dyno, it would not fire the tim= ing light consistently =E2=80=93 figured it was the light.=C2=A0 On recent f= lights, on two occasions, after steady cruise for =C2=BD hour or so; there w= as a very short duration power sag; just a second or two and then back to no= rmal.=C2=A0 No roughness; just some power loss that gets your attention, and= then it=E2=80=99s OK.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m burning unleaded mogas, so shouldn= =E2=80=99t be the famous S.A.G. others have experienced.=C2=A0 I have no exp= lanation. =C2=A0 These things, taken together, make me wonder if I=E2=80=99m really getting t= he strong spark I should be getting.=C2=A0 I know that during cranking it is= barely enough to fire the plugs.=C2=A0 I haven=E2=80=99t checked it when ru= nning cuz it=E2=80=99s a little difficult to hold a wire off and see how far= the spark will jump when that prop is going right there. =C2=A0But I guess=20= I need to make a check of that. =C2=A0 What sort of cranking spark should be expected? Other ideas on what to check= ? Is it something about the EC2 and the CAS? =C2=A0 Al =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Subject: [FlyRotary] flooding =C2=A0 I made it out to the airport today, soldered up the CAS and installed it.= =C2=A0 Before I cranked it over, I put it in mode 8 and fired it off.=C2=A0=20= The usual nice blue sparks.=C2=A0 Then set it to mode 0 and cranked with the= plugs out and pumps/inj off.=C2=A0 No spark.=C2=A0 Cranked and looked again= .=C2=A0 Every so often there would be a weak spark or 3, but most of the tim= e, nothing.=C2=A0 So little or no spark ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.= aol.com ----------MB_8CA1C5E42850D36_9F0_16A2_FWM-D16.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
AL,
Pardon me for all the basic reminders but some of these things get forg= otten. Do you have a ground on the coils? often the auto coils use the engin= e/firewall or brackets to close the gap on the coil core. Some are internal=20= and don't need it. The rotary isn't that hard to turn over so you should get= a pretty strong spark when cranking. The starter shouldn't draw so much tha= t the spark would diminish. In air with the plugs out you should see at leas= t 1/4". The old mechanics rhyme was "Red is dead, blue will do, and white is= all right." Be sure that you have a good solid wire for eletrical FEED to t= he coils. Sometimes we don't do that right. I know you have run this engine=20= a lot including dyno time, so I'm sorry for the ultra basic stuff, but somet= imes we tend to blow right past it, once we have the engine running.
Bill Jepson


-----Original Message-----
From: Al Gietzen <ALVentures@cox.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 11:18 am
Subject: [FlyRotary] Weak Spark

 
 
All this talk of weak spark got me thinking a= gain about my 20B. It has the stock CAS. I have found that the spark is weak= and sometimes intermittent when cranking.  When I noted this, I was su= re something was wrong.  I then checked using the Mode 8, and the spark= was great. It would start and run, so I forgot about it. The engine always=20= started and runs fine, but I have noticed more recently on cold mornings (me= aning about 40F here in SoCal) that the starting was a little more hesitant,= and would fire intermittently for a bit before getting going.=
 
I recall when we were checking timing on the=20= dyno, it would not fire the timing light consistently =E2=80=93 figured it w= as the light.  On recent flights, on two occasions, after steady cruise= for =C2=BD hour or so; there was a very short duration power sag; just a se= cond or two and then back to normal.  No roughness; just some power los= s that gets your attention, and then it=E2=80=99s OK.  I=E2=80=99m burn= ing unleaded mogas, so shouldn=E2=80=99t be the famous S.A.G. others have ex= perienced.  I have no explanation.
 
These things, taken together, make me wonder=20= if I=E2=80=99m really getting the strong spark I should be getting.  I=20= know that during cranking it is barely enough to fire the plugs.  I hav= en=E2=80=99t checked it when running cuz it=E2=80=99s a little difficult to=20= hold a wire off and see how far the spark will jump when that prop is going=20= right there.  But I guess I need to make a check of that.=
 
What sort of cranking spark should be expecte= d? Other ideas on what to check? Is it something about the EC2 and the CAS?<= /SPAN>
 
Al
 
 
 
 
 
Subject: [FlyRotary] flooding
 
I made it out to th= e airport today, soldered up the CAS and installed it.  Before I cranke= d it over, I put it in mode 8 and fired it off.  The usual nice blue sp= arks.  Then set it to mode 0 and cranked with the plugs out and pumps/i= nj off.  No spark.  Cranked and looked again.  Every so often= there would be a weak spark or 3, but most of the time, nothing.  So l= ittle or no spark
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