X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fmailhost01.isp.att.net ([204.127.217.101] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2c4) with ESMTP id 2627499 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 02 Jan 2008 02:09:15 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.217.101; envelope-from=bbradburry@bellsouth.net Received: from arptk8ng400 (adsl-210-52-231.mco.bellsouth.net[68.210.52.231]) by isp.att.net (frfwmhc01) with SMTP id <20080102070835H0100mluhhe>; Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:08:35 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [68.210.52.231] From: "Bill Bradburry" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Floooooding! Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2008 02:09:08 -0500 Message-ID: <543B2BC82D114C5DB1178B5D0A935F6B@ARPTK8NG400> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0154_01C84CE4.7594F550" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AchM9TbKqR7zEqDyTy6QZQ6ffDt1IgAGDvwg X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6000.16545 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0154_01C84CE4.7594F550 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Don, I have the Renesis with stock Iridium plugs. While I was trying to learn to start it, I flooded the engine. I removed the plugs, blew them out to dry them, ran the engine to blow out any residual gas and tried again..Same thing.flooding. I repeated this several times hoping for a different result. :>) No luck! I was about to try new plugs, when I decided to take the old ones over to a friends shop and sand blast them. (be sure to get all the sand out!) I put the plugs back in and it fired right up! When the Renesis plugs get fouled, they are difficult to clean. Try it.It worked for me. Bill B _____ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Lehanover@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 11:09 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Floooooding! In a message dated 1/1/2008 9:13:21 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, tracy@rotaryaviation.com writes: On Jan 12, 2008, at 7:47 PM, Don Wallker wrote: > The list has been a little quiet lately, so I hope this will liven > it up a little. I'm at a loss as to how to get my engine running, > so hopefully you guys will have the correct answer. Or at least > move me in the right direction. > My Renesis RV-8 is complete and I tried starting it 2 weeks ago > and all I could get it to do is flood. First a little background > on the installation. > New Renesis, 4 port automatic from Bruce Turrentine. He does > nice work! All Tracy's stuff with all the new upgrades and I have > installed a floscan fuel flow sensor with the wiring changes > between the EM-2 and EC-2. I had a junk yard (literally from a junk yard) engine in an RX-2 years ago, that had no compression. To start it I would pour in some motor oil and some hot coffee. Then pump the throttle to get a bunch of fuel into the mixture. It started every time. It put out a cloud of smoke like a 3350. The new engine has no peripheral exhaust port. So instead of pumping out any big dose of fuel into the headers, it keeps dragging it over the plugs and wetting them in one revolution. Turn on the ignition and turn off the injectors. Hook up the timing light and point it at the pulley. Crank the engine and check the timing. If there is spark, the light will work just fine. Any timing between TDC and 30 degrees advanced, will work fine for starting. I doubt that with extended attempts with fuel removing any oil from the seals, that it has enough compression (heat of compression) to produce an energetic firing. A big wham......with lots of crankshaft spinning is what you want to see. Don't let it sit for long after a failure. The seals will rust in place very quickly. Some of the ports are always open to the air. So a cap for the exhaust system is helpful. If the test shows it has spark, squirt in some oil. Spin it up and flick a set of injectors on and off again. The rotary is far more sensitive to compression loss than a piston engine. So, cranking speed is important. The seals are long and leak a lot. Low cranking speed is a no start situation. So the oil gag helps seal it up and make some compression. If the timing is anywhere close. If the plugs are clean. If it gets almost any amount of fuel, if it has at least some compression, it will start. It cannot help itself. Either conducts electricity, and wets plugs instantly. It is for starting diesels that have become too cold. After it has run a while and worn off the high spots, it will be easy to start. My fresh engines peak about the third weekend. This after running at 2,000 RPM for 2 hours before use. Lynn E. Hanover _____ See AOL's top rated recipes and easy ways to stay in shape for winter. ------=_NextPart_000_0154_01C84CE4.7594F550 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Don, I have the Renesis with stock Iridium plugs.  While I was trying to learn to start it, I flooded = the engine.  I removed the plugs, blew them out to dry them, ran the engine to blow = out any residual gas and tried again….Same thing…flooding.  I = repeated this several times hoping for a different result. :>)  No = luck!

I was about to try new plugs, when = I decided to take the old ones over to a friends shop and sand blast them.  = (be sure to get all the sand out!)

I put the plugs back in and it = fired right up!  When the Renesis plugs get fouled, they are difficult to clean.  Try it…It worked for = me. 

 

=

Bill = B

 

=

From: = Rotary motors in aircraft = [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Lehanover@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, January = 01, 2008 11:09 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Floooooding!

In a message = dated 1/1/2008 9:13:21 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, tracy@rotaryaviation.com = writes:

On Jan 12, 2008, at 7:47 PM, Don = Wallker wrote:

> The list has been a little quiet lately, so I hope this will liven =
> it up a little.  I'm at a loss as to how to get my engine = running,
> so hopefully you guys will have the correct answer. Or at least
> move me in the right direction.
>     My Renesis RV-8 is complete and I tried starting it 2 = weeks ago
> and all I could get it to do is flood.  First a little = background
> on the installation.
>     New Renesis, 4 port automatic from Bruce Turrentine.  He does
> nice work!  All Tracy's stuff with all the new upgrades and I have
> installed a floscan fuel flow sensor with the wiring changes
> between the EM-2 and EC-2.  

 

=

I had a junk yard (literally from = a junk yard) engine in an RX-2 years ago, that had no compression. To start it = I would pour in some motor oil and some hot coffee. Then pump the throttle to = get a bunch of fuel into the mixture. It started every time. It put out a cloud of smoke like a 3350.

 

=

The new engine has no peripheral = exhaust port. So instead of pumping out any big dose of fuel into the headers, = it keeps dragging it over the plugs and wetting them in one revolution. =

 

=

Turn on the ignition and turn = off the injectors. Hook up the timing light and point it at the pulley. = Crank the engine and check the timing. If there is spark, the light will work just = fine. Any timing between TDC and 30 degrees advanced, will work fine for = starting. I doubt that with extended attempts with fuel removing any oil from the seals, = that it has enough compression (heat of compression) to produce an energetic firing. A big wham......with lots of crankshaft spinning = is what you want to see.

Don't let it sit for long after a failure. The seals will rust in place very quickly. Some of the ports = are always open to the air. So a cap for the exhaust system is helpful. =

 

=

If the test shows it has spark, = squirt in some oil. Spin it up and flick a set of injectors on and off = again.

 

=

The rotary is far more sensitive = to compression loss than a piston engine. So, cranking speed is = important.

The seals are long and leak a lot. = Low cranking speed is a no start situation. So the oil gag helps seal it up = and make some compression.

 

=

If the timing is anywhere close. = If the plugs are clean. If it gets almost any amount of fuel, if it has at = least some compression, it will start. It cannot help itself. =

 

=

Either conducts electricity, and = wets plugs instantly. It is for starting diesels that have become too cold. =

 

=

After it has run a while and worn = off the high spots, it will be easy to start. My fresh engines peak about the = third weekend. This after running at 2,000 RPM for 2 hours before use. =  

 

=

Lynn E. = Hanover 

 

=

 

=

 

=



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