X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com ([64.12.137.5] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.12) with ESMTP id 2401522 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 01:11:38 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.137.5; envelope-from=WRJJRS@aol.com Received: from WRJJRS@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r9.3.) id q.cca.1e10b601 (32913) for ; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 01:10:59 -0400 (EDT) From: WRJJRS@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 01:10:59 EDT Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Rotary Enhancements To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="-----------------------------1193116259" X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5044 X-Spam-Flag: NO -------------------------------1193116259 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve, That statement is incorrect. CERMET is the name given to several types of ceramic metal matrix. My father was a specialist in ceramics and ceramic-metalizing so I saw many trade types of cermet products. The idea of this matrix is that the metal stabilizes the compound to make the ceramic less prone to fracture. I believe an entire sideplate could be made of this material, but it would be costly. Due to surrface hardness it must usually be diamond ground. The article speaks of "spraying" the material. This would only be possible with plasma spraying, and woould be very propriatiry since the ceramic portion of the matrix wouldn't melt unless they sprayed at more than 3000 degrees! Honda made cylinder barrels for the RC45 V-4 750 from cermet. Cermet is supposed to be about the same weight as aluminum, but has a very hard surface after being finish ground. Most materials I have seen list a Coeficient of linear expansion at around 1.5 x 10^ -6 (one point five times ten to the minus sixth) units per degree F. Aluminum CoLE is about 2 x 10^ -5 there is a lot of built up stress at the skin of a coating with tht much of a difference in expansion. If they guys doing the rotor housings are doing a type of chrome and calling the result cermet then they are being misleading. Bill Jepson In a message dated 10/22/2007 7:48:15 PM Pacific Standard Time, steve@stevet.net writes: Not sure what you're looking at, but the coating is called "Cermet" not ceramic. They also sell ceramic seals. Cermet is a brand name for a particular kind of chrome plating, I believe. Best Regards, Steve ____________________________________________________________________ On Oct 22, 2007, at 1:09 PM, _wrjjrs@aol.com_ (mailto:wrjjrs@aol.com) wrote: Guys, The real question is, does the coating stay on?! There are many types of coatings, the toughest coating won't help if it cracks or flakes off. Ceramic is one of the hardest materials around short of diamond. There is no question that it will help lower sliding friction, do they have any high time engines? This comes from someone who really likes coatings. If the coating flakes off the flakes themselves are the worse than anything you could put in there. Bill Jepson ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -------------------------------1193116259 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Steve, That statement is incorrect. CERMET is the name given to several= =20 types of  ceramic metal matrix. My father was a specialist in ceramics=20= and=20 ceramic-metalizing so I saw many trade types of cermet products. The idea of= =20 this matrix is that the metal stabilizes the compound to make the ceramic le= ss=20 prone to fracture. I believe an entire sideplate could be made of this mater= ial,=20 but it would be costly. Due to surrface hardness it must usually be diamond=20 ground. The article speaks of "spraying" the material. This would only be=20 possible with plasma spraying, and woould be very propriatiry since the cera= mic=20 portion of the matrix wouldn't melt unless they sprayed at more than 3000=20 degrees! Honda made cylinder barrels for the RC45 V-4 750 from cermet. Cerme= t is=20 supposed to be about the same weight as aluminum, but has a very hard surfac= e=20 after being finish ground. Most materials I have seen list a Coeficient = ;of=20 linear expansion at around     1.5 x 10^ -6 (one po= int=20 five times ten to the minus sixth) units per degree F. Aluminum Co= LE=20 is about 2 x 10^ -5 there is a lot of built up stress at the skin of a coati= ng=20 with tht much of a difference in expansion. If they guys doing the rotor=20 housings are doing a type of chrome and calling the result cermet then they=20= are=20 being misleading.
Bill Jepson  
 
In a message dated 10/22/2007 7:48:15 PM Pacific Standard Time,=20 steve@stevet.net writes:
<= FONT=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size= =3D2>Not sure=20 what you're looking at, but the coating is called "Cermet" not ceramic.&nb= sp;=20 They also sell ceramic seals.  Cermet is a brand name for a particula= r=20 kind of chrome plating, I believe.  
Best Regards,

Steve 
____________________________________________________________________<= /DIV>

On Oct 22, 2007, at 1:09 PM, wrjjrs@aol.com wrote:
Guys,
The real question is, does the coating stay on?! There are many typ= es=20 of coatings, the toughest coating won't help if it cracks or flakes off.= =20  Ceramic is one of the hardest materials around short of diamond. T= here=20 is no question that it will help lower sliding friction, do they have an= y=20 high time engines? This comes from someone who really likes coatings. If= the=20 coating flakes off the flakes themselves are the worse than anything you= =20 could put in there.
Bill=20 Jepson
 




See what's new= at AOL.com an= d Make AOL Your Homepage.
-------------------------------1193116259--