Mailing List flyrotary@lancaironline.net Message #3814
From: Russell Duffy <13brv3@bellsouth.net>
Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: EWP - series pumps and wacky ideas
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 09:48:04 -0500
To: 'Rotary motors in aircraft' <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Message
The flow meter is a Signet paddlewheel sensor. They are obsolete at the mill I work in but there was still one in mill stores :-).  
 
Thanks.  We use similar type sensors in the cooler cabinets for MRI scanners.  Next time I open one of those up, I'll take note of how the sensor if physically set up.  I recall it being rather big and bulky.  Either way, it doesn't sound like something that I'll install on the plane. 
 
Tonight the weather was crap so I didn't fly, but changed out the water pump, as today I gave it a real good going over to ensure it wasn't going to have any problems. 
 
I'm interested to know if the problem you fixed with the original pump was something that you think was a flaw in that particular pump, or something that you think exists in all of them.    
  
Unfortunately the shaft is not accessible when in operation as I'd like to clamp it to ensure it doesn't freewheel when off in an effort to simulate a seized pump to measure flow restriction.  
 
I was thinking of trying this experiment in the garage to make sure there was going to be enough flow in the worst case event that one seizes.  
 
I think you may find that by running both pumps all the time that you will have a very cold engine on descent. 
 
This is the main problem I see with running both, or maybe even one pump all the time.  I guess it will be another experiment, and I can always add a controller later if needed.  I'm just worried that the controller allows the flow to get too low.  On the other hand, there are lots of folks running with no thermostat, and during descent, they will still be at a reasonable rpm to create a lot of flow with the stock pump.  If they aren't having problems, then I shouldn't either.  Since I'm keeping the stock pump housing, I can also use a thermostat, with enough bypass holes around the edge to allow sufficient minimum flow to keep the engine happy when the thermostat is closed. 
    
 My plan is to keep the primary pump on the controller with the ability to bypass the controller (see attached wiring diagram- option 2) with the secondary pump controlled by a thermal switch set to 95C. In the event of a pump failure, rising temps will automatically start the secondary. In the event of a extended full power climb it will also kick it on, however I don't know that additional flow will reject more heat. If it doesn't then I know that my coolers are operating at their capacity. Secondary pump will also likely be used to cool down heat soak after shutdown. 
 
This all sounds outstanding.  May I suggest that you plug your thermal switch into the temp sensor location near the oil filter pad?  I figure that would be the first place to show high temps in the combustion chamber if the water flow stops.  I've got a variable temp sensor that's used to turn fans on and off, and was thinking of using it in that location for the second pump, rather than leaving it on all the time.   
 
Take that bulky, heavy pump housing and throw it into the air, if it comes back down get rid of it and build a lighter, compact adapter:-) 
 
I weighed a spare housing from the attic yesterday.  It weighs 3 lb 2 oz, minus bolts, plus grease and dirt.  What does your adapter, header tank, and alternator mount weight?  I bet it's not that much less :-)  If I had room to move the alternator to the side, I'd consider that to be another reason to get rid of the pump housing.  The stock housing also allows me the ability to re-install the mechanical pump if the need should ever arise, or if I want to do some testing with stock pump, plus one EWP.  The housing also allows me to run a (modified) thermostat.  I think those capabilities are worth an extra pound or so.   
 
Cheers,
Rusty (Turbonetics order being placed today) 
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